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View Full Version : Help me beat khornate chaos with my skaven (LONG)



Slaaneshi Ice Cream
02-09-2007, 10:36
Hello all,

We are playing a campaign game at my local store, and one of the players is using a nasty Khornate army consisting of the following:

Lord of Khorne on a Dragon
Exalted Demon

2 x 5 chaos knights

2 x 5 horsemen with flails

2 x 5 dogs

5 furies

I think that is about it. It all has a at least a 7 inch move and the 2 big terror causers scare me.

Here's what I have for skaven

Generals:

Grey Seer
Warlord
2 x Warlock Engineer
Plague Priest

CORE

2 x 30 Clan rats FC with ratling guns

20 slaves with muso

6 x globadiers

20 x night runners with xhw

6 x giant rat pack

SPECIAL

6 x gutter runners

4 x rat ogres

25 x plague monks with xhw and Full Command

1 x Jezzail (Wish I had ten of these)

RARE

8 x Plague Censer Bearers


I think that is all my skaven models. The games in this campaign are all 2250 points.

Here's an approximation of my current list:

Grey Seer, Twisted Crown, Dispel Scroll
Warlock Engineer x 2 all the stuff plus dispel scrolls and one storm deamon
Plague Priest w/ Desolate Blade

25 Clanrats, SB, Muso, Ratling Gun x 2

20 Slaves, Muso

4 giant rat packs

6 x globadiers

4 x 5 night runners with xhw

2x 3 gutter runners, poison weapons, tunneling

25 Monks with full Command, Banner of Burning Hatred

4 Rat Ogres

8 Plague Censer Bearers

Keep in mind this is a take all comers list. There is also Empire, Lizardmen, and Kislev in the campaign. The Empire army has 4 wizards in it and I expect the Lizard player to use a Slaan, hence the dispel scrolls.

So, any tips? Should I invest in more jezzails? I have an unopened box of clanrats that I plan on making into 20 slaves, but I could make it into another clan rat unit with a ratling gun. The Warp Lightning Cannon is also a possibility.

fubukii
02-09-2007, 12:18
eh it will be hard to beat that kind of army while lacking the SKavens only means to kill such big nasty and or heavily armored units.

I suggest getting some jezzails and some WLCs so you can deal with the knights and the dragon and daemon at a safe distance, also the more ranked units you put on the table the better, in 2000 pts i find 4 clanrats and 4 slave units about right. this way you can bait him with slaves then hit him with clanrats on his knights flanks, causing you to win by a few (you should tsart at +6, his knight will probably kill 2-3 rats) so you will win by 3ish causing him to lose frenzy and make a ld5 break check.

themandudeperson
02-09-2007, 13:37
I'd make it a point to deploy near the edge at the start and do my best to shoot his pants off as he comes across. If you back up just enough when you deploy you can force most of his calv to march twice before getting into close combat. This gives you some breathing room to try and shoot down his dragon and furies. The downside is that anything that panics is off the table pretty much outright.
Now, how you plan to shoot him up is up to you. Skaven are notorious for having **** for long range shooting. Jezzails aren't very reliable at long range, but thankfully his dragon counts as a large target so they could do a decent job of putting shots where they need to be. Make sure if you take more than 6 that you split them up so you don't lose all of them if they break.
The furies are only toughness 3 and skaven have plenty of ranged weapons with strengths 3-5. Enough massed multiple shots from slings could put a hurt on them, ratling guns also a viable choice, just don't get greedy with your rolls. A warpfire thrower would help against the knights due to it's high strength and armor penetrating ability. Plus, with his lack of ranged units you don't have to worry about your weapons teams getting shot to hell first turn and more than likely he'll have to charge them, which will grant you a stand and shoot with them. Once they're in base-to-base they WILL die and no longer be a contributing factor in your army so becareful of where they are positioned in relation to your opponent.
To begin with, I wouldn't depend on your magic too much unless you invest in a lot of warpstone tokens and don't mind the possibility of poisoning your heroes while attempting to cast magic. Once you start eliminating units you'll start getting a better chance of casting magic so don't get discouraged when he dispells EVERYTHING the first turn or two.
Anything that ignores armor saves will make things much easier once everything degenerates to close combat. This leaves spells like pestilence breath and plague as well as your globadiers and censor bearers. Try to make your slave units charge or take the charges and keep your general nearby so they won't immediately panic and get cut down first round of combat. This way you can shoot into the close combat and hope to take down some 15-35 pt models while you only put your 2 pt models in harm's way.
Put you Plague Priest in your censor bearer unit with a censor and that unit will thrash some knights the first turn, not to mention you might get lucky and kill a few knights with the fumes. Try to use them as a flanking unit with your plague monks and do your best to get the charge with the monks and use the bearers to wrap around to their flank and tear holes into their knights.
The Rat Ogres are up to you.. Plenty of people have a terrible hatred for them because you can take a rare slot for some slightly cheaper, but much more effective ironguts. But if you have both of your rares tied up with the censor bearers and warplighting cannon, the rat ogres' strength 5, toughness 4 and fear means you'll have something that stands a chance of passing a terror test and at least tying up either of his heroes as well as handling his furies.
If this is a take all comers list, you need to keep your tunnelers around, but they are going to be damned useless against this list due to it's high mobility and lack of shooting units, so try and place your tunnel marker where they might pop up and be set for a terrific flanking charge.

Urgat
02-09-2007, 14:02
You can also use my favourite nasty trick (slaves are perfect for that):
when you figure his chaos knights will charge in the next turn, just put you slaves in front of them, but have them face a way that when the break (you want them to break, you don't want them to flee as a charge reaction, because running down a unit is dealt with 3D6, so they're likely to move further away if your units break than if the unit tries to pursue), these nasty frenetic knights will go away, and loose at least a couple turns getting back in the fight. Your slaves are there for just such things (ie die). You can even try to pull that in conjonction with the globadiers, try to guess where the pursuit will get the knights, and place your globadiers on the flank of the area you've pinpointed for a nasty flank charge on your turn (iirc globadiers are good against high saves right?).
Gives you more room to deal with the rest of the army.
Alternatively, I'm not sure the rat ogres are such a good choice, unless you keep them back to guard your artillery and shooty stuff (he should think twice about sending his furies there if you do that). Then they have a decent movement and can provide late support when their job has been fulfilled.

And yeah, I too wish for you that you had 10 jezzails, it's strange, that's one thing I'd have in quantities, and no skaven player I know seem to like them for some reason (the reason probably being that they think ratling guns are so much cooler maybe...).
Anyway, the exalted deamon's main strenght is, indeed, its terror (nasty, for skavens, my gobs perfectly know the feeling :p). It does pack quite some punch, but, all in all, it's not very resilient to a good slapping, and any ranged attacks would help you with that guy.
Looks like a boring army to play against, anyway, tough luck, rat-thing.

mav1971
02-09-2007, 15:58
I would definitely take more jezzails and aim them at the lord on a dragon. Large target, 4+ to wound the dragon no armor save, 3+ to wound the lord and probably armor save.

theunwantedbeing
02-09-2007, 16:28
Jezzails,2 units of 10.
I sugguest getting that,as thats plenty to remove his dragon.

If you go fairly heavy on magic you can drain his dispel dice and then use a warpstorm scroll(or 2) on him...that'll cripple his dragon,exaulted daemon and furies assuming those are all within the fairly large range of the spell.

He only has 6 dispel dice,you can eat that up easily enough,a few goes at warplightning should remove it.

Slaaneshi Ice Cream
03-09-2007, 00:32
And yeah, I too wish for you that you had 10 jezzails, it's strange, that's one thing I'd have in quantities, and no skaven player I know seem to like them for some reason (the reason probably being that they think ratling guns are so much cooler maybe...).


For me it's because they are $12 each. That's $120 for ten! Coincidently, that is the same reason I don't have a lot of mounted daemonettes.

WageMage
03-09-2007, 11:27
It's easier to beat that army then you'd think.

Heroes:
1: Take a Warlord as your general => LD 10 in a 12" bubble.
(Stick him in the back and only use him for the leadership)
2: Take the 2 Engineers with a Storm Daemon and Warpstone Charm, the other with the Warpstorm scroll (D6 STR 6 hits )
3: Take the Priest with flail + Warpstone Amulet

Tactics:

Your only concern are the 2 flying Terror causers.
The Dragon should be easy to bait as he has flying and frenzy.

For the knights and marauders just bait/flee/flank with globadiers, slaves and nightrunners.

Put the Warbanner on the Monks and let them be charged by the Dragon (try to make sure it's the only unit the Dragon lord can charge or maybe put the general in there to tempt him). Challenge with the champion to minimize casualties. The most he'll be able to get is 6 CR while you also get 6 CR (3 ranks, banner+ warbanner + outnumber) which means you just won by 1 thanks to the Musician. Repeat with the Priest and another unit with champ piled on. Eventually he'll fail a break test or fluff.

See, all that without resorting to Jezzails.:angel:

PS: The reason most seasoned Skaven players won't use a lot of Jezzails is that they only have LD 5 which means a lot of points lost if it has to take a panic or Terror test. (See Dragons, Manti's => exactly the units you are taking them for) Most shooting will see the Jezzails leg it on the first volley they get.
My monks and Censers never run away before seeing combat => this scares most players more then some rat snipers.

Urgat
03-09-2007, 16:41
For me it's because they are $12 each. That's $120 for ten! Coincidently, that is the same reason I don't have a lot of mounted daemonettes.

Convert them, it's not a difficult project to do.