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Alathir
04-09-2007, 03:23
Quick question here, do the Eldar torture their prisoners? Do they even take prisoners?

Thanks in advance.

starlight
04-09-2007, 03:36
With all their Psi powers, I think it would be a bit redundant, however I don't think they'd even stop to consider using *any* means to gain their end goals, least of all torture of xenos.

DantesInferno
04-09-2007, 03:54
To state the bleeding obvious: the Dark Eldar certainly do.

Craftworld Eldar in general measure success and failure in terms of the loss of Eldar life (so are willing to, for instance, divert Ork Waaghs into human worlds to save Eldar lives). They certainly wouldn't have qualms about torturing prisoners if necessary, although as starlight points out, things have got extraordinarily bad for the Eldar if they've been reduced to physical torture to extract information - they've usually got much more reliable ways of doing that. Given the Eldar way of war, I doubt they'd be taking many prisoners in the first place anyway.

Tehkonrad
04-09-2007, 03:56
yeah..nothing else to sat dante is right-as always

Devil-Tears
04-09-2007, 04:12
To state the bleeding obvious: the Dark Eldar certainly do.

Craftworld Eldar in general measure success and failure in terms of the loss of Eldar life (so are willing to, for instance, divert Ork Waaghs into human worlds to save Eldar lives). They certainly wouldn't have qualms about torturing prisoners if necessary, although as starlight points out, things have got extraordinarily bad for the Eldar if they've been reduced to physical torture to extract information - they've usually got much more reliable ways of doing that. Given the Eldar way of war, I doubt they'd be taking many prisoners in the first place anyway.

Agreed, especially on the last part. Eldar usually depend on Farseer visions to scry the future for information, so there isn't really a need for them to take and interrogate prisoners.

Khaine's Messenger
04-09-2007, 05:42
Quick question here, do the Eldar torture their prisoners? Do they even take prisoners?

The Eldar usually have all of the relevant information to hand (or at least what they think is all the relevant information) and thus do not take the time to engage in such information-gathering techniques; their way of war is fast and hard, with little allowance for such baggage as "prisoners" to slow them down in their lightning salients. This is not to say, however, that they depend on remote sensing, mind-reading, and farseeing exclusively. Those techniques have failed them at critical moments all too often. Although I may be exaggerating...such critical failures may only be included for dramatic effect in the various stories we've been given.

GodofWarTx
04-09-2007, 06:06
If the Eldar were so good at prediction, the fall would have reached far more eldar minds that it was wrong ;)

I would believe the eldar certainly wouldnt be above torture to achieve their means. Its not like they care for the life of a human, tau, or ork unless their living will directly or indirectly benifet them through some twist in the fortune of the future.

It would proably be difficult to walk the eldar path, while at the same time rejecting some of their more base desires to torture cruelly. I would imagine any torture would be highly ritualised to protect the eldar mind.

RedWolf
04-09-2007, 08:05
The Eldar are good at predictions nevertheless. Perhaps not the best, but one must admit that they are far ahead of the humans, tau, and various other species and vermin in the 40k universe. They will do whatever required to preserve what remains of their race (understandable, since they are locked into a desperate situation). Certainly, torture would be a part of that.

Through their decadence, the Eldar felled. I don’t believe that it is in their instinct to torture, main and kill. It’s just that their society before the fall, lacked any productive ideals, and thus felled into a disarray of debauchery. A similar thing is happening in real life according to some people, but this time with regards to Western society.

FarseerMatt
04-09-2007, 08:35
Craftworld Eldar have no need for crude and barbaric torture - if we assume they take prisoners at all it is a much simpler matter to probe their weak minds for the information they need.

Plus I imagine they have a rather violent aversion to something usually associated with their fallen cousins...

carlisimo
04-09-2007, 08:35
I don't think the Craftworld Eldar think they're too good for torture, but they would probably avoid it because of its associations with the Fall... not a good path to get back onto. Nothing to gain from it either, when it comes to interrogation their psychic powers are enough.

But there is a story in official fluff (in a WD) where the Eldar capture a planetary governor who had killed Eldar to use their spirit stones as jewelry. They're about to kill him when one of them comes up with an idea... then they deliver him to some Harlequins, who give him to the Dark Eldar. The story goes that 1,500 years later they're still keeping him alive for their tortures...

Rockerfella
04-09-2007, 09:29
Now THATS how you torture someone. :P Who wants to be tortured by the marines? Naaah. The ORKS? Pfft, amateurs..... hey, highest bidder goes to the dark Eldar.

Those guys really know how to torture dont they.... Nice.

Lord Fatwa
04-09-2007, 10:04
With regard to their psychic powers, I have my doubts that the Eldar with the capability, much less a Farseer or Warlock, would even consider entering the mind of a human for any reason other than absolute and total necessity, ala the end of the Farseer novel, but not for information. It just makes me think of a ridiculously snooty couple in black-tie-style attire wandering into a seedy, beat-up bar, sitting down on sticky, grime-laden stools and drinking terrible beer out of dirty glasses. Why would they choose that when so many other options are available to them...

I don't believe Craftworld Eldar would consider torture, and I think to them invading something so primative and 'dirty' a thing as a human mind would be inherently distasteful... Realistically, there probably isn't too much information beyond a Seer Council who, IIRC, can see pretty much any pathway the future may hold, and the benefits and negatives thereof... So, IMHO, torture is unnecessary...

kroq'gar
04-09-2007, 10:27
All eldar have an inherant sadistic streak... however repressed... slanaash came into being for a reason.

Lord Fatwa
04-09-2007, 10:53
All eldar have an inherant sadistic streak... however repressed... slanaash came into being for a reason.

That's what the Path ideology was meant to repress in the Craftword Eldar though... At least that's what I thought it's purpose was... An Eldar focusses all of their mind on achieving the mastery of a single purpose, to the point where they block out other desires and distractions... The point being they know Slaanesh is their fault, and they don't want to make it worse...

Stingray_tm
04-09-2007, 10:57
I think, that Eldar would use some kind of "clean" torture.

Using some psychic power, that gets the information, without inflicting any pain on the subject, but in the end the prisoner ends up dead (like his soul just vanishes), seems to be the Eldar way.

kroq'gar
04-09-2007, 11:05
the definition of torture and interigation seem to vary depending on the need. Please define 'clean' torture. Eldar inherintly like themselves to be superior, and there is no other way than wilfull infliction of pain, like a curel kid and a kitten (hence the dark eldar love it so much).

Like i said, however repressed, its in them. They strive to remove their taint, but have they succeded? There attacks (craftworld and dark) are both methodical and surgical sugesting an aloofness from feeling, yet the dark eldar enjoy it. Can you supress joy? Revenge supposedly feels right. Can you have revenge, and make it not feel right?

xibo
04-09-2007, 11:21
Why should DE torture someone for information? What would it get them? They won't even tell you they'll stop torturing you if you tell them something...

Sabbad
04-09-2007, 11:27
Would the Eldar have any reservations about torturing someone? No.

Would they ever actually do so? Depends. I've written a story for an Inquisitor campaign in which an Eldar Ranger, far from home, interrogates a human to gain information to help complete his mission. In fact, he does so three times during the course of the campaign (the story's in the Inquisitor forum if anyone's interested: http://warseer.com/forums/inquisitor-discussion/83889-eoheran-a-hero-s-death.html). I think that it would be an entirely appropriate way for an Eldar Ranger to act in that situation.

elvinltl
04-09-2007, 11:36
Maybe they do mental Torture? Anyway given their degree of Psyhic powers, they could have easily forced out information from anyone. Torture is simply a form of entertainment, not a valid excuse for Eldar to extract information.

Alathir
04-09-2007, 13:50
Thanks for the replies people.

So I guess the general concensus is that they wouldn't torture prisoners in the 'conventional' sense... but would they perhaps use mental torture like elvinltl suggested? i.e. highly painful psychic powers used to cause pain upon the prisoner and make them give in to the pain if perhaps they couldnt break in to their mind normally?

Andyalloverdaplace
04-09-2007, 14:59
Keep in mind that torture, in the normal sense, generally doesn't get a lot of reliable information, since once you hurt someone enough they'll say practically anything to make it stop.

I would imagine a psyker being present, and the eldar would simply use some sort of nerve induction, box goes on, world of hurt comes, box goes off, prisoner is unharmed. The psyker asks questions, if they sense a less than complete answer they know it and can administer corrective action. The psyker can even manipulate things to keep the victim off balance in their head.

I doubt the Eldar would resort to anything so crude as lopping off fingers and such, a la "Man on Fire".

MrBigMr
04-09-2007, 15:17
I love the concept of the Eldar handing people for the Dark Eldar to be tortured.
"We're civilized and won't descent into such barbaric behavior like torture. But luckily out fallen cousins aren't that picky. Here ya go."
So screwed up...
But I don't see why few Eldar couldn't do some interrigation. Little smacking around is quite understandable and surely isn't above the Eldar. Gathering information is far from torturing just to punish, even if the methods are the same.


I doubt the Eldar would resort to anything so crude as lopping off fingers and such, a la "Man on Fire".
Oh, why not. I've never realy got the idea of some "neuro-whip", psychic torture, etc. Lets get some 1984 type of stuff. Just beat the crap out of the victim, heal him/her up and repeat. Continue for a good while. In time the victim is softened up for the nasty stuff.

carlisimo
04-09-2007, 16:44
I don't speak for everyone, but when I said that I think they would use their psychic powers to get information, I meant that they would do so instead of resorting to torture, not as a means of torture. I'm defining torture as using pain or the threat of pain to convince a prisoner to spill the beans. If you just reach in and grab what you need from his mind, and it happens to hurt him, it isn't really torture... just collateral damage.

Anything that close to pre-fall Eldar culture scares the hell out of Craftworld Eldar. Don't forget, they were the puritans among their people and are obsessed with self-control. Seeing what their Dark Eldar cousins are capable of probably just reinforces that... but it's convenient too.

But again, any aversion to torture is simply due to what it might do to the Eldar torturer. They couldn't care less about the victim.