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View Full Version : Doombreed = Hitler?



MrPickles
03-10-2007, 23:19
Anybody else see the similarities between the two in the description?

Once human? Check.

Warlord? Check.

Led Armies that ravaged entire nations? Check.

Genocide and murder? Check.

Long, long ago (speaking from 40k)? Check.

Savant
03-10-2007, 23:21
Doombreed = Ghengis Khan?

Once human? Check.

Warlord? Check.

Led Armies that ravaged entire nations? Check.

Genocide and murder? Check.

Long, long ago (speaking from 40k)? Check.

CELS
03-10-2007, 23:21
Yes.

In fact, I'll wager that if you do a search for Doombreed and Hitler on these forums, you'll find a lot of people who agree with you ;)

Ravenous
03-10-2007, 23:21
That could be hundreds of people throughout history though.

Ghegis Khan
Alexander the Great
Xerxes I

Hell for all we know its George W Bush.

Chilltouch
03-10-2007, 23:40
Or all of them.

DUN DUN DUNNNN.

Shiakou
03-10-2007, 23:47
The great murderers of the past all had visions of a warrior who would end them. They conspired together; upon their death, their souls will merge into a being even more terrifying than ever before!!!!111

Feor
03-10-2007, 23:55
The Anti-Emperor?

Savant
03-10-2007, 23:57
So... Hitler, Ghengis Khan, Alexander the Great and Xerxes I all conspired together, an achievment in itself, to unite within the warp upon their death (despite three of them being long dead before Hitler was born) to be reborn as a Chaos Space Marine with a stupid name. Well, I'm glad we got that cleared up!

Sadly, that's not even half as stupid as some of the legit canon.

mistformsquirrel
04-10-2007, 00:01
I honestly feel that Doombreed probably does point to Adolf Hitler - but it could just as easily be Stalin, Ghengis KHAAAAAN, Alexander the Great, Xerxes, Napolean, or any number of other tyrants of history.

Heck, I'd be happy to toss George W. into that category as well, but I've heard Doombreed existed before this codex; which would mean pretty likely before the reign of King George the Mad.

In the end, I think its most useful to just think of Doombreed as a metaphor for the most despicable of human tyrants throughout our own history. basically, it doesn't MATTER which of the varied villains of history Doombreed is; but rather, that he is a manifestation of man at its absolute most bloodthirsty. A human who would all too happily have destroyed Earth laying waste to everything; possibly including themselves.

So it doesn't matter "who" Doombreed is, but rather what Doombreed represents. At least thats how I see it >.>

Shadowheart
04-10-2007, 00:24
I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say no, Doombreed definitely does not equal Hitler. I think you're probably focussing too much on the mention of genocide. Doombreed is, first and foremost, Khorne's first great champion. Now think of the image of a champion of Khorne. A big, muscular man in gore-splattered armour, hefting a monstrous axe above his head and standing on a mound of skulls. And then look at a picture of Hitler. Even in his propaganda posters he didn't look like he could carve a man in half with one blow.

Whoever Doombreed was, he must've led his armies on the battlefield in person, very probably into hand to hand combat. Khorne doesn't favour tyrants in particular, he favours warriors. And even then, I'd say Doombreed must've been someone for whom the fighting was an end unto itself, rather than a tool of carving out an empire.

Shiakou
04-10-2007, 00:33
So... Hitler, Ghengis Khan, Alexander the Great and Xerxes I all conspired together, an achievment in itself, to unite within the warp upon their death (despite three of them being long dead before Hitler was born) to be reborn as a Chaos Space Marine with a stupid name. Well, I'm glad we got that cleared up!

Sadly, that's not even half as stupid as some of the legit canon.

I tell you, he was bred to bring about our DOOOOOM!!!! :cheese:

VanHel
04-10-2007, 00:48
I like the idea of the souls of the most murderous, genocidal people coalescing in the warp and becoming Doombreed.

Lion El Jason
04-10-2007, 01:00
<3 the idea that its George W.
Awesome...

Putty
04-10-2007, 01:53
add every warlord / dictator in the African civil wars and Pol Pot into the list.

Smishkun
04-10-2007, 02:02
Its the rock, from the beginning of the Mummy 2.

He didnt make a pact with Anubis. IT WAS KHORNE!!!

CORN FOR THE CORN GOD!

Kasonic
04-10-2007, 02:04
The first thing that came to mind is Genghis Khan, although in reality while Khan was a vicious general he usually conquered peacefully and left the cities he ruled some autonomy.

I assume it's left vague to let each reader fill in the blanks about their own historial figures that were potential Khorne worshippers.

I do like the idea of the character though. A Daemon Prince who's been slaughtering in the name of Khorne for tens of thousands of years before these Primarch kids came along? Bad ass.

Chrismage
04-10-2007, 02:07
I was thinking Cheney. Look at any photograph of the man and tell me you can't imagine him drawing an axe across your throat.

mistformsquirrel
04-10-2007, 02:09
I was thinking Cheney. Look at any photograph of the man and tell me you can't imagine him drawing an axe across your throat.

So true >.<;

"There's a man who would eat your kidney, and wash it down with a diet Dr. Pepper."

jhon
04-10-2007, 02:46
G.W. Bush[!?] Hitler, Ghengis Khan, Alexander the Great and Xerxes . only the Great Ghengis and the Great Alexander will fit the bill to become Blood God's champion . the skull lord hounor people will brave spirit not child with a temper ... as for Hitler and G.W.Bush they can be the first champion of the Dark prince and the change of ways ..

PS: the word Gengis Khan means lord of all warlord .

Tehkonrad
04-10-2007, 02:56
perhaps it was some unnamed crusader?

mistformsquirrel
04-10-2007, 03:12
perhaps it was some unnamed crusader?

Fitting... Ultimately a bit dull, but definitely a possibility.

Lexington
04-10-2007, 03:39
I think it's best (and intended) that he remain anonymous, but I also always figured he'd be an earlier warlord - Esarhaddon, Sennacherib, someone like that.

Argastes
04-10-2007, 04:16
If he was even a human from what we currently have in the way of recorded history, he would definitely be a great warrior who fought in person, with a weapon in his hands, and killed face-to-face. This is Khorne we're talking about, after all. He's not going to grant daemonhood to someone like Hitler, who--murderous as he may have been--was a politician and governmental official who ordered people to be killed by others and was non-violent in his personal behavior, not a howling, bloodthirsty warlord who hacked them apart with his own hands just for the joy of it.

But I don't think it's even safe to assume that he's an individual from our own real-life recorded history, since the 40K canon clearly includes momentous events from well before our recorded history begins (e.g., the birth of the Emperor out of the shamans' mass suicide); maybe Doombreed was a tribal war-chieftain from the prehistoric period, who led his warriors in a series of bloody conquests and wars that have been lost to the mists of time. All in all, I think I agree with Lexington that it's best that GW deliberately left his identity unstated. I like not knowing.

Ktotwf
04-10-2007, 04:19
Personally, the idea of Hitler being a demon prince is so cool, I vote yes.

Savant
04-10-2007, 04:48
Not exactly on topic, but related to it, I noticed an inconsistency in the new Chaos codex. It states that the Chaos gods are billions of years old (or have been forming for billions of years...) but that Khorne was one of the first Chaos Gods, and Doombreed one of his first servants. So... how does that work?

Defcon
04-10-2007, 05:00
Someone between 2008-29,000 with absolutely no actual connection to a real world individual existed?

That's who I first thought of when I saw Doombreed. Different minds.

Argastes
04-10-2007, 05:07
Not exactly on topic, but related to it, I noticed an inconsistency in the new Chaos codex. It states that the Chaos gods are billions of years old (or have been forming for billions of years...) but that Khorne was one of the first Chaos Gods, and Doombreed one of his first servants. So... how does that work?

The whole "timeline of Chaos" is a little questionable in some areas. How does it work? GW's fluff is contradictory or doesn't make sense in some spots, that's how.

Iracundus
04-10-2007, 05:41
Has it ever crossed people's minds that perhaps the tyrant Doombreed was elevated from hasn't been born yet in RL? All that is known really is that he was before Man took to the stars, and given the canonical 40K timeline, that still leaves quite a few millenia to go.

Also in the 2nd edition Chaos Codex there is a brief mention that his elevation took place in front of his followers who fled in terror, and that it was a blasted heath or moor.

stormblade
04-10-2007, 06:03
the word Gengis Khan means lord of all warlord .

- I thought it meant Great Khan- Khan being the title equal to warlord or chieften.

And if personal slaughter is a requirement than Stalin would be in, supposedly he executed over 1000 people himself.

Argastes
04-10-2007, 06:14
And if personal slaughter is a requirement than Stalin would be in, supposedly he executed over 1000 people himself.

But I think Khorne wants champions who kill in battle, exhibiting martial prowess and strength, not just execute helpless prisoners. Unless Stalin executed those prisoners by handing them an axe, taking one for himself, and facing off with them in no-holds-barred gladiatorial combat, I doubt Khorne would be too impressed with him.

Savant
04-10-2007, 06:28
But I think Khorne wants champions who kill in battle, exhibiting martial prowess and strength, not just execute helpless prisoners. Unless Stalin executed those prisoners by handing them an axe, taking one for himself, and facing off with them in no-holds-barred gladiatorial combat, I doubt Khorne would be too impressed with him.

Pshaw, that's old Khorne. New Khorne is only concerned with bloodshed, skull-taking and mindless death!

Old Khorne can keep depth, ambiguity and the whole martial prowess shebang, new Khorne appeals to teenagers!

Shiakou
04-10-2007, 06:32
Pshaw, that's old Khorne. New Khorne is only concerned with bloodshed, skull-taking and mindless death!

Old Khorne can keep depth, ambiguity and the whole martial prowess shebang, new Khorne appeals to teenagers!

Noooooooooooo!!!

*hacks Savant to death*

Death to Cowards! Honour for the Blood God, Character Depth for Khorne!

Argastes
04-10-2007, 06:58
Okay now I'm thoroughly confused.

pookie
04-10-2007, 08:45
I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say no, Doombreed definitely does not equal Hitler. I think you're probably focussing too much on the mention of genocide. Doombreed is, first and foremost, Khorne's first great champion. Now think of the image of a champion of Khorne. A big, muscular man in gore-splattered armour, hefting a monstrous axe above his head and standing on a mound of skulls. And then look at a picture of Hitler. Even in his propaganda posters he didn't look like he could carve a man in half with one blow.

Whoever Doombreed was, he must've led his armies on the battlefield in person, very probably into hand to hand combat. Khorne doesn't favour tyrants in particular, he favours warriors. And even then, I'd say Doombreed must've been someone for whom the fighting was an end unto itself, rather than a tool of carving out an empire.

agreed fully, people are too caught up in the most 'recent' homicidal maniacs etc.

I LOL at G W, being Doombreed, but he aint got the Balls for Khorne, he'd only ever be destined for Spawndom!

why couldnt it have been someone like Vlad? or even someone that we have never heard of before, its one of the things dropped into the Fluff as a Hook and thats it.

precinctomega
04-10-2007, 09:10
he'd only ever be destined for Spawndom

I think it already happened but no one noticed.

Anyway, I've always had Gilgamesh in mind for Doombreed. But there we go.

R.

Damien 1427
04-10-2007, 09:20
I doubt Adolf would have been marked for greatness by the Lord of Skulls, or indeed any other of the Great Four. He wasn't particularly scheming or even especially smart, certainly wasn't in favour of wanton excess and pleasure, and didn't unleash mighty plagues that ravaged the globe.

The odds of him, or perhaps any other figure within the last hundred, two hundred years being a daemon prince, let alone Doombreed are slim in the extreme. In fact, the only aspect of his life you could argue for that being the case is that his body was never recovered.

The Warmaster
04-10-2007, 10:12
Anybody else see the similarities between the two in the description?

Once human? Check.

Warlord? Check.

Led Armies that ravaged entire nations? Check.

Genocide and murder? Check.

Long, long ago (speaking from 40k)? Check.

That could also be used to describe the Emperor, funny enough.

- N.

The Warmaster
04-10-2007, 10:21
But I don't think it's even safe to assume that he's an individual from our own real-life recorded history, since the 40K canon clearly includes momentous events from well before our recorded history begins (e.g., the birth of the Emperor out of the shamans' mass suicide); maybe Doombreed was a tribal war-chieftain from the prehistoric period, who led his warriors in a series of bloody conquests and wars that have been lost to the mists of time. All in all, I think I agree with Lexington that it's best that GW deliberately left his identity unstated. I like not knowing.

The background implies that Khorne woke up after the birth of the Emperor (approx. 8,000 B.C.), most likely somewhere between then and the beginning of the Middle Ages (his awakening was supposedly marked by years upon years of war - Roman Empire, people!), so I don't think he'd have been born prior to the Holocene (which covers the last 10,000-or so years - effectively, everything before that is prehistoric).

- N.

Shiakou
04-10-2007, 10:33
Romans? Perhaps, but they're a bit late, only becoming important sometime after becoming a Republic, and didn't reach their peak until becoming an Empire. Heck, the famous Battle of Thermopylae happened in 480 B.C., when Romans were still barely out of their city.

Maybe during the times of Ancient Greek myths then? The Trojan Wars? Maybe even earlier; the ancient peoples of the Middle East, Asia Minor and Africa liked to wage war on a perpetual basis.

The Warmaster
04-10-2007, 10:38
Romans? Perhaps, but they're a bit late, only becoming important sometime after becoming a Republic, and didn't reach their peak until becoming an Empire. Heck, the famous Battle of Thermopylae happened in 480 B.C., when Romans were still barely out of their city.

Maybe during the times of Ancient Greek myths then? The Trojan Wars? Maybe even earlier; the ancient peoples of the Middle East, Asia Minor and Africa liked to wage war on a perpetual basis.

I'm not too good with ancient historical dates myself - just making a suggestion.

As for Doombreed's history, more may be revealed on that soon - there's rumours that he'll be in the upcoming Codex: Daemonica, which may yield more on him (maybe even a model!).

- N.

Iracundus
04-10-2007, 11:29
Though I prefer Doombreed to remain anonymous and perhaps a yet to be born future individual, if I had to pick someone historical I'd go for probably someone in ancient China, particular during the Warring States era. The sizes of armies and the bodycounts of battles dwarfed anything the Romans had (Rome at the time of the Punic Wars fielded about 100,000. The kingdom of Qin at the time of the final unification fielded 1 million troops).

Wolflord Havoc
04-10-2007, 12:01
I would discount Hitler because he was a drugged up syphalitic wimpy ponce of a burocrat, an evil drugged up syphalitic wimpy ponce of a burocrat I grant you, but a drugged up syphalitic wimpy ponce of a burocrat none the less. Not the stuff of a Khorne Champion.

I would suggest some one who got stuck in and was bloodily violent with it. Some one like Vlad the Impaler, or a senior Japanese officer at the 'Raping of Nanking' in 1936 (IIRC) were tens of thousands of Chinese men were beheaded or shot (Skulls for Khorne?) over a 3 week period.

http://www.gendercide.org/case_nanking.html

It even has an example of a 'Good' Nazi (if there is such a thing) in John Rabe who attempted to save as many Chinese as he could.

MadDogMike
04-10-2007, 14:21
The whole "timeline of Chaos" is a little questionable in some areas. How does it work? GW's fluff is contradictory or doesn't make sense in some spots, that's how.

A LITTLE contradictory? ;) Still, it did say Doombreed was one of the first after Khorne "awakened", so he could have been born before mankind but awakened during man's existence. Admittedly I don't know of anyone else in the 40K universe besides orks (who don't empower Chaos directly) who was necessarily more warlike at the time; the Eldar were at peace mainly apart from whatever their initial forays into Slaanesh-land at the time were, and none of the other major factions but humans were around. And humanity obviously had a fairly strong psychic potential even in prehistory if the whole shamans form super-psyker Emperor thing can be believed, so they might have been the strongest influence acting on Chaos at that time.

As for an appropriate candidate, Lord knows we were QUITE genocidal at the dawn of civilization, so any one of several ancient conquerors could qualify for Doombreed. I don't think he was Hitler or anything later than maybe Ghengis Khan though (unless he reincarnated several times during human history, which has a certain appeal to it).

Meathook
04-10-2007, 14:39
If I remember they had his stats in the back of the second edition codex for Chaos with Mean ol' Abby on the front. I don't beleive he was anything too impressive, but its been a long time since i've looked at the book.

pookie
04-10-2007, 14:56
If I remember they had his stats in the back of the second edition codex for Chaos with Mean ol' Abby on the front. I don't beleive he was anything too impressive, but its been a long time since i've looked at the book.

he may not have been in 2n ed, but he was back in RT days, he was some sort of uber greater deamon iirc.

Iracundus
04-10-2007, 15:02
You're kidding right? His stats and wargear were obscene.


With a mighty shout he rose, brighter than the sun and more fierce. In his hand he held a rod of twisted bone, crossed and recrossed to form the sign of his dark lord, a symbol of his power and fruit of mortal longings well-fulfilled.

He rose above the company, taller far than they, and looked with black pride on these his affrighted slaves. He snarled and heard the sound of his noble hatred echoing from the slaves. He stared the savage stare of immortal fury and death was in his gaze.

And on that blasted heath his ashen servants turned, gripped by cold, unthinking terror, and fled his presence. Thus on the blasted heath the Daemon Prince Doombreed was born. And he roared. - p. 139, 2nd ed. Chaos Codex

He was M6, WS10, BS9 S7 T8 W8 I10 A7 Ld12. While this was marginally inferior to the Bloodthirster in S and W it was superior in I and Ld. More importantly was his special rules and wargear. Doombreed's Rod of Khorne inflicted D3 automatic wounds on psykers in base contact, ignoring all saves, and he was immune to psychic powers, and he had a 3+ save on 2d6 with re-roll.

He far outstripped his rival Slaaneshi daemon prince N'kari. Yes that N'kari, the same one that plagues the WHFB world and who was one of the first Slaaneshi daemon princes from the WHFB world. The background in the Chaos Codex also described the WHFB world:


...an isolated, backward world which has been trapped in the centre of a violent warp storm for millenia. The Chaos Powers have repeatedly attempted to conquer this planet, but have so far been foiled by the uncorrupted peoples of the world. p. 140, 2nd ed. Chaos Codex

Lexington
04-10-2007, 15:03
He was actually very impressive - the Daemon Princes in that list have the highest stats (many over ten) that've appeared in 40K since. It's why I've always considered the Daemon Princes of 3rd Edition and beyond so shrimpy, and hardly deserving of the title.

If Doombreed ends up in the new Daemon World book, he better be an Apocalypse-only sort of deal, else he couldn't possibly be accurately represented.

Bookwrak
04-10-2007, 15:06
- I thought it meant Great Khan- Khan being the title equal to warlord or chieften.

And if personal slaughter is a requirement than Stalin would be in, supposedly he executed over 1000 people himself.
However, some of the mountains of skills Khan left behind after executing entire cities (the man hated walls something fierce - Surrender now, and I execute all your men, or make me come in there, and you all die) are still extant in China to this day.



Not exactly on topic, but related to it, I noticed an inconsistency in the new Chaos codex. It states that the Chaos gods are billions of years old (or have been forming for billions of years...) but that Khorne was one of the first Chaos Gods, and Doombreed one of his first servants. So... how does that work?

The passage of time within the warp is not necessarily a linear thing... Just smile and nod.

Or, while the Chaos gods have existed for millions of years, with the galaxy nearly purged of life by Enslavers at the end of the Old One / Necron war, the potential for life with the psychic potential to truly empower and feed the Chaos gods and make them truly powerful has only been realized within the last 50,000 years or so.

Iracundus
04-10-2007, 15:09
Nowhere does it say the Chaos gods themselves are billions of years old.

In the new Chaos Codex, it says


For billions of years these tides and waves flowed unceasingly through Warpspace, and such is their power that they formed creatures made of the stuff of Warpspace

There are numerous warp creatures and entities beyond just the main Chaos gods so that above statement doesn't have to apply to them at all. Read the background as written carefully without leaping to conclusions. There is no inconsistency with the fluff that the Chaos gods Khorne, Tzeentch, Nurgle (in that order) were born with humanity, nor is there a need to concoct and make up special explanations or reasons.

Progena
04-10-2007, 16:51
Err... I don't remember where I have this from, but I seem to remember that Khorne fully awoke in the 3rd millenium...

EDIT: NVM, that can't be right.

Imperialis_Dominatus
04-10-2007, 17:06
Anyone notice that the two 'Nazi' threads in General were deleted as spam?

Bregalad
04-10-2007, 18:29
Anyone misses that spam?
Every board will finally get some "discussion" like that: It's Godwin's Law:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_Law

Outlaw289
04-10-2007, 20:29
Hey mods good job keeping the P&R out of the discussion. I guess numbers validate ideas around here.

BrainFireBob
04-10-2007, 21:21
Going to toss in Attila and the First Emperor, neither of whom was a very nice man.

Gengis Khan's a good bet, though, since he'd quite willingly practice genocide.

Believe it or not, not only did Hitler not invent genocide, he didn't even invent anti-Semitism *ooooh, spooky*!

Iracundus
04-10-2007, 21:27
The only problem is that the deaths of both Attila and the First Emperor, particularly the latter, are documented in the histories. This conflicts with the my earlier above quote of the GW source material on Doombreed's elevation.

Argastes
04-10-2007, 22:02
The only problem is that the deaths of both Attila and the First Emperor, particularly the latter, are documented in the histories. This conflicts with the my earlier above quote of the GW source material on Doombreed's elevation.

A-yep. Since real-world history includes no great warlords who turned into huge daemons in front of numerous onlookers, we can safely conclude that Doombreed was either a pre-historic figure, or one that will appear in the future. Not Hitler, not Attila, not Ghengis Khan, not Vlad the Impaler, not a Greek or Roman figure from classical antiquity, not Stalin, not Xerxes (BTW the real Xerxes was a somewhat overweight little nobleman who never killed anyone with his own hands, despite his portrayal in '300', so I think that suggestion is particularly silly), not George Bush, etc. etc. etc.

Smishkun
04-10-2007, 22:55
Well from what I understand Atilla's death is pretty speculatory. Also im pretty sure nobody is alive today from anywhere over about 120 years ago, so nobody can be sure of any of these classical figure's fates can we(purely hypothetical reasoning here). So if you want to believe in any of these older figures, why not.

History is fickle and highly tampered with, so you really cant be that iron clad about anything once you go back far enough.

Word.

mistformsquirrel
05-10-2007, 00:31
A-yep. Since real-world history includes no great warlords who turned into huge daemons in front of numerous onlookers, we can safely conclude that Doombreed was either a pre-historic figure, or one that will appear in the future. Not Hitler, not Attila, not Ghengis Khan, not Vlad the Impaler, not a Greek or Roman figure from classical antiquity, not Stalin, not Xerxes (BTW the real Xerxes was a somewhat overweight little nobleman who never killed anyone with his own hands, despite his portrayal in '300', so I think that suggestion is particularly silly), not George Bush, etc. etc. etc.

Give Bush time, who knows, maybe January '09 we'll see him turn into a massive daemon prince on the White House lawn >.>

... And then the Grey Knights will kick the frick out of him <.<

... WHAT? I can fantasize!

ExquisiteEvil
05-10-2007, 00:39
Vlad the Impaler perhaps?

murder - check

genocide - check

warrior type - check

like blood- BIG check

The Warmaster
05-10-2007, 00:58
A-yep. Since real-world history includes no great warlords who turned into huge daemons in front of numerous onlookers, we can safely conclude that Doombreed was either a pre-historic figure, or one that will appear in the future. Not Hitler, not Attila, not Ghengis Khan, not Vlad the Impaler, not a Greek or Roman figure from classical antiquity, not Stalin, not Xerxes (BTW the real Xerxes was a somewhat overweight little nobleman who never killed anyone with his own hands, despite his portrayal in '300', so I think that suggestion is particularly silly), not George Bush, etc. etc. etc.

Well, some Chaos followers probably just vanish (possibly even a faked death?), and then shown up as Daemon Princes later on. Basically what happens to Sensei when they become Sensei Masters (see "Realm of Chaos: The Lost and the Damned" to see what I mean - it's in the Sensei section).

- EDIT: Read the quote from 2nd Edition, so never mind my above statement.

Also, there may be a reason that none of the warlords we know of were seen to have become a Daemon Prince - FICTION.


Give Bush time, who knows, maybe January '09 we'll see him turn into a massive daemon prince on the White House lawn >.>

... And then the Grey Knights will kick the frick out of him <.<

... WHAT? I can fantasize!

And then they'll move on to purge Hogwarts, I guess? (Or is that more of a Witch Hunter job?)

- N.

mistformsquirrel
05-10-2007, 01:53
Well, some Chaos followers probably just vanish (possibly even a faked death?), and then shown up as Daemon Princes later on. Basically what happens to Sensei when they become Sensei Masters (see "Realm of Chaos: The Lost and the Damned" to see what I mean - it's in the Sensei section).

- EDIT: Read the quote from 2nd Edition, so never mind my above statement.

Also, there may be a reason that none of the warlords we know of were seen to have become a Daemon Prince - FICTION.



And then they'll move on to purge Hogwarts, I guess? (Or is that more of a Witch Hunter job?)

- N.

>.> I'm definitely saying WH. If for nothing else than the chance to get slapped by a Sister of Battle <^_^> "It was worth the pain!"

... I'm a horrible person <;_;>

Argastes
05-10-2007, 03:44
Give Bush time, who knows, maybe January '09 we'll see him turn into a massive daemon prince on the White House lawn >.>

... And then the Grey Knights will kick the frick out of him <.<

... WHAT? I can fantasize!

I don't even think Bush is that bad, but I have no reservations in saying that would be the coolest **** ever.

MadDogMike
05-10-2007, 03:47
A-yep. Since real-world history includes no great warlords who turned into huge daemons in front of numerous onlookers, we can safely conclude that Doombreed was either a pre-historic figure, or one that will appear in the future. Not Hitler, not Attila, not Ghengis Khan, not Vlad the Impaler, not a Greek or Roman figure from classical antiquity, not Stalin, not Xerxes (BTW the real Xerxes was a somewhat overweight little nobleman who never killed anyone with his own hands, despite his portrayal in '300', so I think that suggestion is particularly silly), not George Bush, etc. etc. etc.

Haven't some normal humans been raised by the Chaos gods post-death as demons though? I know the one Chaos chick in the Ciaphas Caine books did obviously. I figure that's how somebody like Doombreed would be spawned; Khorne probably couldn't even reach the guy until he died anyway given the whole lack of Chaos demonic incursions in recorded history :D.


And then they'll move on to purge Hogwarts, I guess? (Or is that more of a Witch Hunter job?)

Been done - behold! (not my work btw, just found it before)

--------------------------------
To; Lord-Inquisitor Von Grimm, Ordo Hereticus
From; Inquisitor Bigotin, Ordo Hereticus
Subject; Inquisitorial Purge BD-4992 "The Hogwarts Purge"
Transmitted; Inquisitorial Fortress, Bethor VIII
Transmitter; Astropath Ginla
Receiver; Astropath Wulesh

Thought For The Day; Never give into temptation and ask about the black and white Space Marine on the black and white bike.

Salutations Lord!

I am pleased to report that the heretical witch-coven, the blasphemous sect known as "Hogwarts School of Witchcraft and Wizardry" has been eliminated, and every member of this vile cult has been cleansed with fire and sword.
Accompanied by five squads of veteran Inquisitorial Stormtroopers, two-hundred local militia, a dozen arco-flagellants, two Penitent Engines, and three squads drawn from the Adeptus Sororitas Order of the Holy Nimbus, we began our assault upon the fortress of the enemy at dawn's first light. Although the castle was hidden from normal sight by a myriad of hexes and foul enchantments, these wards were easily bypassed thanks to the psyk-out strike launched by the Persecution, and we were able to begin the assault.

We stormed the grounds, suffering only minor casualties from various self-defence spell-traps that the enemy had placed within the grounds. These traps were disposed of quickly by my cadre of sanctioned psykers, and we were able to press on.

We were soon accosted by a heavily-haired mutant of exceptional height and bulk (see pict attachments 00-03) upon approaching the castle's main portcullis. He was accompanied by a variety of abominable creatures (pict attachments 04-16), gruesome beasts which looked like twisted parodies of ancient creatures of legend- such beasts included a disturbing horse/eagle hybrid and assorted scorpion/crab-like creatures, each one the size of a small landcar, amongst others. The large mutant challenged us in an accent I did not recognise, but no doubt it was speaking in some daemonic tongue. I ordered the attack. The creatures of the mutant beastmaster took a heavy toll on the local militia and my Stormtroopers, but our numbers and weaponry were superior, and the Sisters of the Holy Nimbus swiftly brought down the creatures with bolter, melta and flamer fire. The giant mutant beastmaster possessed incredible strength and endurance, and managed to inflict crippling damage on one of the Penitent Engines and kill and seriously wound twenty-three militia, Sisters and Stormtroopers before it was brought down by the holy rage of the arco-flagellants (three of which perished due to lethal combat stimm overdose- in death, they have been granted His Forgiveness).
We consolidated our position and set up a strong foothold whilst our chirurgeons and Sisters Hospitaller provided healing for the wounded and mercy for the dying.

To the south, I glimpsed an oval structure that appeared to resemble a standard Imperial amphitheatre or coliseum (pict attachments 17-20). Six tall poles, topped with huge hoops, were situated on this "pitch", three at each end. I theorised that the cult held some form of diabolical rituals or ceremonies there, and that the hoops were utilised in these.

No sooner had our wounded been comforted and aided by our medical staff, the witches of the Hogwarts School appeared. I was at first shocked at the average age of our foe; the youngest seemed to be ten years of standard, the oldest no more than seventeen. They were led by five older psykers (see accompanying pict-files 21-25), and they outnumbered us nearly two to one. At first, I foolishly thought that fighting children would be no challenge, but I chastised myself, remembering that each of these younglings was an illegal psyker, taught by the council of their older rogue psykers.

The eldest of the rogue psykers (pict 21), whom I presumed to be the leader, stepped forward, and I saw the malevolence and hatred in his eyes that spoke of a man driven insane by the daemonic power which he wielded. He personally addressed me, giving his name as Albus Dumbledore, but I did not wish to bandy words with a heretic and a witch, so before he could speak any further and bewitch me, I disposed of him with my stake crossbow and gave the order for my force to attack.

Pandemonium erupted immediately. The younger psykers were herded back into the castle by two of the "teachers"; a wrinkled midget (pict/subject 24) and a portly woman bedecked with scraps of local flora (pict/subject 25). The older children retaliated, led by the other two psykers, a crone-faced woman (pict/subject 22) and a cadaverous man with long black greasy hair (pict/subject 23).

The psykers launched a variety of psychic attacks that killed and/or otherwise incapicitated my warriors. I saw some terrible things. Two Stormtroopers stumbled and fell to the ground, as if their limbs had ceased to function. Sister-Palatine Lucresia was transmuted in a second from a proud warrior of the Adepta Sororitas to a pewter goblet. Local militia either burst into laughter so violent that their blood vessels burst, or were inflated like carnival balloons. Arco-flagellants slipped and collapsed as the ground beneath them was turned to ice. I remained unscathed, thanks to the protection offered by my hexagrammic wards and my accompanying sanctioned and penitent psykers.

I rallied my troops and pressed the attack. Many of the child psykers were slain by the accurate firepower of my Stormtroopers and the Sisters, and they fled in craven dissarray, only to be picked off at the leisure of my warriors and I. Subject 23 was bisected by Sister Superior Paminda's eviscerator, whilst Subject 22 met the Emperor's Judgement at the claws of the Penitent Engine.

We advanced into the castle, gunning down resistance where we found it. Subjects 24 and 25 were killed as they defended the younger heretics, many of whom surrendered after the deaths of their "teachers". I tasked Stormtrooper Lieutenant Virone with prisoner detail, and he and his squad set about dealing with the captured children, taking them to the evac zone and transferring them to the null-cells aboard the Persecution, where they would await interrogation and execution.

We finally came across the last point of resistance in the great hall of the castle, a room so seeped in obscene witchery that I permitted only the Sisters and my personal staff to accompany me inside- I could not risk the corruption of the Stormtroopers.

At the end of the hall stood four figures (picts 26-29), all of them young psykers. Three of the psykers were male, and one was female. They began a last-ditch defence, but their efforts were in vain. The blonde, arrogant-looking male (pict/subject 27) was reduced to ashes by my gun-servitor's plasma cannon, and the freckled, red-haired male (pict/subject 2) took a trio of bolter shots to the chest. The female, a young girl with long, curly brown hair (pict/subject 26) surrendered to us, and I immediately placed an inhibitor upon her (I have since transferred Subject 26 to my own staff, where she now serves as a penitent psyker).

The final male, a boy with thick black hair, spectacles, and a curious scar on his forehead (pict/subject 29) was monstrously powerful for one so young, and claimed the lives of four Sisters, my two gun-servitors, and Interrogator Delaun before he was stopped. As Interrogator Tesze held him in the jaws of her mancatcher, I prepared my power stake for the killing strike. Subject 29 looked at me frantically and cried out; "You idiot muggle! If you kill me, Voldemort will return!"

I presumed that "muggle" was some sort of profane cult slang. I had no idea who "Voldemort" was/is, but I assume that the witch's babble was a desperate and useless plea to prevent me from dispensing justice. I paid his rambling no heed, and impaled his heart with my sacred power stake.
Our mission a success, we ransacked the castle for any heretical items that would need to be immediately destroyed to prevent them from corrupting the servants of the Emperor any longer. We found all manner of wands, ingredients, spellbooks and scrolls, and curious orb-shaped relics (picts 30-32; note the curious wings that adorn the tiny golden ball in pict 32). All was put to the cleansing flame.

Upon our return to the Persecution, I gave the order for Captain Yevonce to begin the orbital bombardment of the castle, completely obliterating the vile structure. As we made warp transition to Bethor VIII, my staff and I began the interrogation of the young witches.

My apologies for the lack of transcripts at this current moment, but I regret to announce that both my scribe-skull and auto-savant are both out of ink and parchment, and Interrogator Tesze has been forced to transcribe the interrogations from the various vox-thief recordings. The transcripts will be with you shortly, my Lord.

The stain of the Hogwarts coven has been wiped from the Emperor's glorious realm.

Your Servant,
Inquisitor Predujis Bigotin

mistformsquirrel
05-10-2007, 03:54
I don't even think Bush is that bad, but I have no reservations in saying that would be the coolest **** ever.

Well given the scales we're working in <'x'> yah, I sincerely doubt he'd wind up as a Daemon Prince; it was just a crack I felt I had to make <,<;

Also - that purging of Hogwarts thing is both hilarious and disturbing <X_X>

Outlaw289
05-10-2007, 03:58
Make more Bush jokes the first 30 weren't enough

Argastes
05-10-2007, 04:04
Make more Bush jokes the first 30 weren't enough

Complain more.

BattleofLund
05-10-2007, 04:34
Surely it must be sexist, gender biased and such that the Hermio-niono-nunny chick isn't killed with the other witchlings... ? ;)

On the other hand, a Hermione Daemon Princess would be seriously sweet...
... copyright infringement alert, JKRowling Attorney Missile Inbound!!!
[need smily screaming in terror here people]

Shiakou
05-10-2007, 04:44
Surely it must be sexist, gender biased and such that the Hermio-niono-nunny chick isn't killed with the other witchlings... ? ;)

On the other hand, a Hermione Daemon Princess would be seriously sweet...
... copyright infringement alert, JKRowling Attorney Missile Inbound!!!
[need smily screaming in terror here people]

She'll probably become yet another sanctioned psyker. They are loyalist forces after all.

And Voldemort becomes a Slaanesh champion wanna-be; he doesn't actually have the guts be in the front line.

BattleofLund
05-10-2007, 04:52
She'll probably become yet another sanctioned psyker. They are loyalist forces after all.


Let's hope she is strong enough to break through the 'sanction' then! And achieve her True Destiny...

[beats down inner battleoflund drama queen]

The Hogwarts/Witch Hunters text said she was to become a 'penitent psyker'. Is that an official thing? I.e., playable type?

Xandros
05-10-2007, 04:58
Hitler was a politician, not a warlord.

mistformsquirrel
05-10-2007, 05:09
Let's hope she is strong enough to break through the 'sanction' then! And achieve her True Destiny...

[beats down inner battleoflund drama queen]

The Hogwarts/Witch Hunters text said she was to become a 'penitent psyker'. Is that an official thing? I.e., playable type?

Yep, its a Henchmen choice for Ordo Hereticus Inquisitors. They act as a "Psychic Lightning Rod" - essentially granting the Inquisitor a save against any psychic powers used against them. I forget the exact rules of it though.

mistformsquirrel
05-10-2007, 05:10
Make more Bush jokes the first 30 weren't enough

... I made like, one actual joke, the rest was just carryover commentary.

What, for balance need I make an Al Gore joke now too? >.> Cause I can do that.

Smishkun
05-10-2007, 05:34
The cleansing of Hogfarts brings me no small amount of joy and retribution.

Suffer not the witch/wizards to live!

BrainFireBob
05-10-2007, 05:47
Actually, Vlad disappeared, and Attila's resting place was never found.

These both allow fluff room.

wilting_laughter
05-10-2007, 06:02
My guess would be Oliver Cromwell. Not the nicest of fellows.

Iuris
05-10-2007, 06:44
One only need to watch "Untergang" to see why Hitler fails to fit the profile for Doombreed.

Hysterical,Delusional little man screaming at the last remains of his army to die honourably =/= Fanatical follower of Khorne...

Never mind SOMEONE would have seen the acension, since the story describes some serious special effects taking place ;)

ctsteel
05-10-2007, 07:43
When I read about Doombreed, my mental image of his human form was along the lines of the Kurgan from Highlander, or the warlord types from the Conan style movies. Or the Mummy 2 even (edit - scorpion king i mean).

Green-is-best
05-10-2007, 08:13
You are all so wrong that it makes me want to vomit with rage!

Clearly, Doombreed is Chuck Norris.

Shiakou
05-10-2007, 08:20
You are all so wrong that it makes me want to vomit with rage!

Clearly, Doombreed is Chuck Norris.

That's impossible!

The criteria clearly indicates that Doombreed was once human!

I refuse to believe Chuck Norris was ever human!

Twaun007
05-10-2007, 08:32
Doombreed = Hitler?

I'm going to have to say no because Doombreed does not have one of those funky Hitler mustaches.

ctsteel
05-10-2007, 10:22
You are all so wrong that it makes me want to vomit with rage!

Clearly, Doombreed is Chuck Norris.

:eyebrows: impossible - chuck norris has complete control over his body and does not feel uncontrollable rage or bloodlust.

its whispered that he once ate a bloodthirster.... keeping it trapped inside him, under his control.... and when he gets really annoyed, he channels its frustrated rage through his fists and feet.

no - chuck norris is beyond a mere daemon.

Born Again
05-10-2007, 10:22
That's impossible!

The criteria clearly indicates that Doombreed was once human!

I refuse to believe Chuck Norris was ever human!

I'll sig that! :p


Actually, Vlad disappeared, and Attila's resting place was never found.

These both allow fluff room.

Likewise, Hitler's death was never confirmed. However, the criteria states "was once human". Apart from the obvious one of (some of them) being dead, could someone point out to me the part where Hitler/ Vlad/ Attila/ George/ Murdoc was anything other than human? Doombreed became a daemon Prince in front of his followers.

The Warmaster
05-10-2007, 11:02
Been done - behold! (not my work btw, just found it before)

--------------------------------
To; Lord-Inquisitor Von Grimm, Ordo Hereticus
From; Inquisitor Bigotin, Ordo Hereticus
Subject; Inquisitorial Purge BD-4992 "The Hogwarts Purge"
Transmitted; Inquisitorial Fortress, Bethor VIII
Transmitter; Astropath Ginla
Receiver; Astropath Wulesh

Thought For The Day; Never give into temptation and ask about the black and white Space Marine on the black and white bike.

Salutations Lord!

I am pleased to report that the heretical witch-coven, the blasphemous sect known as "Hogwarts School of Witchcraft and Wizardry" has been eliminated, and every member of this vile cult has been cleansed with fire and sword.
Accompanied by five squads of veteran Inquisitorial Stormtroopers, two-hundred local militia, a dozen arco-flagellants, two Penitent Engines, and three squads drawn from the Adeptus Sororitas Order of the Holy Nimbus, we began our assault upon the fortress of the enemy at dawn's first light. Although the castle was hidden from normal sight by a myriad of hexes and foul enchantments, these wards were easily bypassed thanks to the psyk-out strike launched by the Persecution, and we were able to begin the assault.

We stormed the grounds, suffering only minor casualties from various self-defence spell-traps that the enemy had placed within the grounds. These traps were disposed of quickly by my cadre of sanctioned psykers, and we were able to press on.

We were soon accosted by a heavily-haired mutant of exceptional height and bulk (see pict attachments 00-03) upon approaching the castle's main portcullis. He was accompanied by a variety of abominable creatures (pict attachments 04-16), gruesome beasts which looked like twisted parodies of ancient creatures of legend- such beasts included a disturbing horse/eagle hybrid and assorted scorpion/crab-like creatures, each one the size of a small landcar, amongst others. The large mutant challenged us in an accent I did not recognise, but no doubt it was speaking in some daemonic tongue. I ordered the attack. The creatures of the mutant beastmaster took a heavy toll on the local militia and my Stormtroopers, but our numbers and weaponry were superior, and the Sisters of the Holy Nimbus swiftly brought down the creatures with bolter, melta and flamer fire. The giant mutant beastmaster possessed incredible strength and endurance, and managed to inflict crippling damage on one of the Penitent Engines and kill and seriously wound twenty-three militia, Sisters and Stormtroopers before it was brought down by the holy rage of the arco-flagellants (three of which perished due to lethal combat stimm overdose- in death, they have been granted His Forgiveness).
We consolidated our position and set up a strong foothold whilst our chirurgeons and Sisters Hospitaller provided healing for the wounded and mercy for the dying.

To the south, I glimpsed an oval structure that appeared to resemble a standard Imperial amphitheatre or coliseum (pict attachments 17-20). Six tall poles, topped with huge hoops, were situated on this "pitch", three at each end. I theorised that the cult held some form of diabolical rituals or ceremonies there, and that the hoops were utilised in these.

No sooner had our wounded been comforted and aided by our medical staff, the witches of the Hogwarts School appeared. I was at first shocked at the average age of our foe; the youngest seemed to be ten years of standard, the oldest no more than seventeen. They were led by five older psykers (see accompanying pict-files 21-25), and they outnumbered us nearly two to one. At first, I foolishly thought that fighting children would be no challenge, but I chastised myself, remembering that each of these younglings was an illegal psyker, taught by the council of their older rogue psykers.

The eldest of the rogue psykers (pict 21), whom I presumed to be the leader, stepped forward, and I saw the malevolence and hatred in his eyes that spoke of a man driven insane by the daemonic power which he wielded. He personally addressed me, giving his name as Albus Dumbledore, but I did not wish to bandy words with a heretic and a witch, so before he could speak any further and bewitch me, I disposed of him with my stake crossbow and gave the order for my force to attack.

Pandemonium erupted immediately. The younger psykers were herded back into the castle by two of the "teachers"; a wrinkled midget (pict/subject 24) and a portly woman bedecked with scraps of local flora (pict/subject 25). The older children retaliated, led by the other two psykers, a crone-faced woman (pict/subject 22) and a cadaverous man with long black greasy hair (pict/subject 23).

The psykers launched a variety of psychic attacks that killed and/or otherwise incapicitated my warriors. I saw some terrible things. Two Stormtroopers stumbled and fell to the ground, as if their limbs had ceased to function. Sister-Palatine Lucresia was transmuted in a second from a proud warrior of the Adepta Sororitas to a pewter goblet. Local militia either burst into laughter so violent that their blood vessels burst, or were inflated like carnival balloons. Arco-flagellants slipped and collapsed as the ground beneath them was turned to ice. I remained unscathed, thanks to the protection offered by my hexagrammic wards and my accompanying sanctioned and penitent psykers.

I rallied my troops and pressed the attack. Many of the child psykers were slain by the accurate firepower of my Stormtroopers and the Sisters, and they fled in craven dissarray, only to be picked off at the leisure of my warriors and I. Subject 23 was bisected by Sister Superior Paminda's eviscerator, whilst Subject 22 met the Emperor's Judgement at the claws of the Penitent Engine.

We advanced into the castle, gunning down resistance where we found it. Subjects 24 and 25 were killed as they defended the younger heretics, many of whom surrendered after the deaths of their "teachers". I tasked Stormtrooper Lieutenant Virone with prisoner detail, and he and his squad set about dealing with the captured children, taking them to the evac zone and transferring them to the null-cells aboard the Persecution, where they would await interrogation and execution.

We finally came across the last point of resistance in the great hall of the castle, a room so seeped in obscene witchery that I permitted only the Sisters and my personal staff to accompany me inside- I could not risk the corruption of the Stormtroopers.

At the end of the hall stood four figures (picts 26-29), all of them young psykers. Three of the psykers were male, and one was female. They began a last-ditch defence, but their efforts were in vain. The blonde, arrogant-looking male (pict/subject 27) was reduced to ashes by my gun-servitor's plasma cannon, and the freckled, red-haired male (pict/subject 2) took a trio of bolter shots to the chest. The female, a young girl with long, curly brown hair (pict/subject 26) surrendered to us, and I immediately placed an inhibitor upon her (I have since transferred Subject 26 to my own staff, where she now serves as a penitent psyker).

The final male, a boy with thick black hair, spectacles, and a curious scar on his forehead (pict/subject 29) was monstrously powerful for one so young, and claimed the lives of four Sisters, my two gun-servitors, and Interrogator Delaun before he was stopped. As Interrogator Tesze held him in the jaws of her mancatcher, I prepared my power stake for the killing strike. Subject 29 looked at me frantically and cried out; "You idiot muggle! If you kill me, Voldemort will return!"

I presumed that "muggle" was some sort of profane cult slang. I had no idea who "Voldemort" was/is, but I assume that the witch's babble was a desperate and useless plea to prevent me from dispensing justice. I paid his rambling no heed, and impaled his heart with my sacred power stake.
Our mission a success, we ransacked the castle for any heretical items that would need to be immediately destroyed to prevent them from corrupting the servants of the Emperor any longer. We found all manner of wands, ingredients, spellbooks and scrolls, and curious orb-shaped relics (picts 30-32; note the curious wings that adorn the tiny golden ball in pict 32). All was put to the cleansing flame.

Upon our return to the Persecution, I gave the order for Captain Yevonce to begin the orbital bombardment of the castle, completely obliterating the vile structure. As we made warp transition to Bethor VIII, my staff and I began the interrogation of the young witches.

My apologies for the lack of transcripts at this current moment, but I regret to announce that both my scribe-skull and auto-savant are both out of ink and parchment, and Interrogator Tesze has been forced to transcribe the interrogations from the various vox-thief recordings. The transcripts will be with you shortly, my Lord.

The stain of the Hogwarts coven has been wiped from the Emperor's glorious realm.

Your Servant,
Inquisitor Predujis Bigotin

I've seen this before - it's actually what gave me the idea.

- N.

EDIT: Just a question while I'm at it - was there ever any artwork of Doombreed produced by GW? If so, I would like to see it, if anyone has it.

Avian
05-10-2007, 14:28
Spamthread closed