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View Full Version : Awesomeness of Generic Daemons!!



Merceus
16-10-2007, 15:49
I suppose I can see why people like the god-specific daemons, but after last night I cant think of a single reason to dislike the Generic ones either...

I spent 525pts on a Warp Rift with 1 Greater Daemon and 25 Lessers packed into it for an Apocalypse Game... They all showed up on the same turn and did not scatter into any enemy units that were near the rift...

I then proceeded to charge (and blow up) a Baneblade with the Greater, earning back pretty much what I spent on the Rift + Daemons... The Lessers then went on to wipe out a squad of 3 Marines (had been shot earlier), an Attack Bike, 2 Bikers and a Chaplin...

All I can say is, POINTS WELL SPENT :evilgrin:

So, anyone else had any really good experiences with Generics? Whether Apocalypse or not?

marv335
16-10-2007, 16:50
that's just crazy talk!
Have you not heard?
the generic daemons are "teh suxxorzz!!111!!" (apparently)
How could the Internet mob be wrong?
















ohh wait a minuite
;)


Well done in going against the flow.
rememeber, Theory hammer is bunk. use what you damn well please :D

Mojaco
16-10-2007, 17:13
Played against it a few times. It's annoying that they can just show up and reinforce a flank you thought was doing just fine. Ofcourse they were able to do just that in the previous edition, but didn't get so much worse at it as people predicted.

Darnok
16-10-2007, 17:17
use what you damn well please :D

Words of wisdom. :)

To the OP: congratulations, sounds like good fun. It's good to see that "stop whining, start playing" actually pays off.

FigureFour
16-10-2007, 17:44
So lesser demons are awesome because you killed 7 guys with 25 of them?

UltimateNagash
16-10-2007, 17:48
They're good as a support/tie up unit... Well, IMO... Pop them out, 5++ save, and Fearless... Pretty good really, Raptors + them could work quite well, stop the enemy reinforcing the enemy fighting the Raptors while your at it...

Polonius
16-10-2007, 17:48
Well, Warp Rift makes all daemons (especially Greaters) substantially better, the same way that many things become better in apocolypse.

I mean, you did a good job of kicking the stuffing out of a straw man, and I want to applaud a job well done, but I doubt you thought you would change anybody's mind with your little post. Still if you feel good because you got to shout your opposition to a (non-existant) "vast conspiracy" of people who hate Lesser Daemons, and think playing them will instantly cause you to lose, then, well, I hope you feel better.

Durath
16-10-2007, 18:00
You implemented them well. However, you aren't always going to have a Warp Rift (unless all you do is play Apoc).

The biggest problem they have, is no range, and they lack a way to punch armor (any armor)... yet cost 13 points a model.

I think they could be an ok "screen" troop if they were to drop a couple points, but Generic Daemons leave some things to be desired.

(edit: I might add that Generic Greater Daemons haven't been a huge source of complaint afaik. They can get the job done for a decent points cost.)

Polonius
16-10-2007, 18:10
My major problem with Lesser Daemons is that there are so many good choices in the non-troops segments of the FOC that taking a choice that's not as good, but doesn't count as compulsory choice chafes me the wrong way.

For a 2.5x the price, I can get termies instead of daemons. Suddenly I have a power weapon, a shooting attack, and a 2+ save. Sure, I lose fearless, but that's a lot of beef for not a lot of cost.

Raptors are only 66% more expensive, and gain Jump Packs and a 3+ save, as well as bolt pistols, access to meltas and fists, and start on the board.

While fine units, and I do mean that, Daemons have too much competition for my points to be a serious factor in my non-apocolypse games.

MuttMan
16-10-2007, 19:35
Daemons are cheap as scouts, fight just as well as a melee scout, pack a cheap Inv save to face down what space marines hate fighting in melee: rending, power weapons, monsters, fists, characters etc. Fearless and small scoring units scattered among the board can win you the game, and to further their benefit is they are reliable MEQ stats not some knock off guardsmen that you throw into battle.

Know what they are for before using them, and try using them properly before judging them. [/rant]

jfrazell
16-10-2007, 19:44
I suppose I can see why people like the god-specific daemons, but after last night I cant think of a single reason to dislike the Generic ones either...

I spent 525pts on a Warp Rift with 1 Greater Daemon and 25 Lessers packed into it for an Apocalypse Game... They all showed up on the same turn and did not scatter into any enemy units that were near the rift...

I then proceeded to charge (and blow up) a Baneblade with the Greater, earning back pretty much what I spent on the Rift + Daemons... The Lessers then went on to wipe out a squad of 3 Marines (had been shot earlier), an Attack Bike, 2 Bikers and a Chaplin...

All I can say is, POINTS WELL SPENT :evilgrin:

So, anyone else had any really good experiences with Generics? Whether Apocalypse or not?

To have a better test of their effectiveness, try them in 40K vs. tournament level opponents then come back to us with the results(seriously).

Mad Doc Grotsnik
16-10-2007, 20:39
NO no no.

DO NOT TAKE THEM TO A TOURNAMENT.

There is only so much Geek scorn one man can take. Better yet, avoid Tournaments like a particularly virulent nad plague!

NallTWD
16-10-2007, 20:40
Just imagine what a warp rift WOULD have done for units of demonettes, bloodletters and a bloodthirster.

Generic demons are flat-out useless unless they take on individual models or outnumber their opponent 3-1.

Hell, I'm jaded on the new demons and I played Tzeentch, I didn't even get the good ones!

I want my damn flamers back!

jfrazell
16-10-2007, 20:46
NO no no.

DO NOT TAKE THEM TO A TOURNAMENT.

There is only so much Geek scorn one man can take. Better yet, avoid Tournaments like a particularly virulent nad plague!

I didn't say take them to a tournament MDG (better pop nitro pill there boyo). I said tournament level player. If you're testing the effectiveness of unit you have to play it in competitive conditions.

As noted, visualize what demonette cav, demonettes, bloodletters, or plain jane furies would have done in that circumstance.

Shadowseer Crofty
16-10-2007, 22:34
I didn't say take them to a tournament MDG (better pop nitro pill there boyo). I said tournament level player. If you're testing the effectiveness of unit you have to play it in competitive conditions.

As noted, visualize what demonette cav, demonettes, bloodletters, or plain jane furies would have done in that circumstance.

daemonnettes would have munched through plenty of space marines, (a squad of 6 on the charge was nasty, and a squad of 12 on the charge was unbeatable) before they could hit back, daemonnette cav would have done the same but with a larger choice of opponents, and more effective in lesser numbers from the steed, bloodletters would have destroyed smaller squads of tougher enemies, like immortals and such, and furies would have been the bane of hordes.
generic, meh. ooohhh, look, the foul, immortal, amazing in a fight daemonic soldiers of the Gods. stormtroopers-charge. hhhmmm, some stormtroopers appear to still be alive. Demonic basic training appears to have been nerfed.

Reaver83
16-10-2007, 23:13
i played chaos vs chaos when the new dex was out, i played my World eaters he took emporer's children.

He charged 22 into 5 Bezerkers, thats 66 attacks, he killed 3, the 2 remaining ones killed 5...

i've found them good ve guard/tau, but otherwise i'm not a fan

IJW
17-10-2007, 00:07
He charged 22 into 5 Bezerkers, thats 66 attacks, he killed 3, the 2 remaining ones killed 5...
Some unlucky rolling there on the daemon's part. :( By rights they should have killed 5-6 Zerks, leaving none to strike back.

Mad Doc Grotsnik
17-10-2007, 00:10
You implemented them well. However, you aren't always going to have a Warp Rift (unless all you do is play Apoc).

The biggest problem they have, is no range, and they lack a way to punch armor (any armor)... yet cost 13 points a model.

I think they could be an ok "screen" troop if they were to drop a couple points, but Generic Daemons leave some things to be desired.

(edit: I might add that Generic Greater Daemons haven't been a huge source of complaint afaik. They can get the job done for a decent points cost.)

But, they do excel at tying up enemy command, where their 5+ Invulnerable, ability to fight just as well as a CSM, Fearlessness, lower points cost, and uncanny knack, of, well, not getting knacked on the way in well worth the investment.


As for them having to gang up 3-1 or something. Well, since when has a fair fight been any fun? In a fair fight, you risk getting brayed, chinned, and even lightly hoofed! Stuff that. But thankfully, with the Daemons, regardless of a lack of rending, I can summon up a major pain in the **** where you don't want it, neatly tying up your horrifically expensive assault troops with 13 points of surprisingly survivable mirth able to at least pretend to threaten them!
As for the Deepstriking to come on, you show me someone playing Chaos without Icons in their units, and I'll show you a damned fool!

Curufew
17-10-2007, 00:11
Lesser demons are good. They're great cheap tarpits with T4 S4 A 2

The_Outsider
17-10-2007, 00:16
Lets take this from the other side.

My talos killed a generic GD 1v1 in CC.

GD must be crap then huh?

Defender of Ulthuan
17-10-2007, 00:17
I just wish there was some customization available... I mean, aren't some greater daemons supposed to have wings? and why would any of the chaos gods have daemons alike to any of his brothers'? I have lots of daemons so I can play different patrons... did I waste all that money when I could have just bought the cheapest models I wanted? I really don't like where GW is going with this.. just hope it doesn't happen to fantasy chaos as well..

IJW
17-10-2007, 00:20
Defender - you're aware that these are Undivided daemons, with a daemon-specific codex to come? Whether it'll be usable with C:CSM in a tournament environment is another matter.

Mad Doc Grotsnik
17-10-2007, 00:20
BEcause all of that is turning up in the Daemon Codex.

Why can't people grasp this?

Defender of Ulthuan
17-10-2007, 00:27
I hadn't heard, but now I'm really excited :). Thanks a bunch for the info, all.

Crassus
17-10-2007, 00:27
the generic daemons give no variety. since when was a plague bearer as fast as a daemonette, and since when were horrors as strong as bloodletters. i can't wait for codex demonica for the new daemon rules

Mad Doc Grotsnik
17-10-2007, 00:28
But, but, thats the idea.

You wanna play with 'proper' Daemons, go play with 'proper' Daemons in their own army.

Want to shoot people with Tanks, and have some Daemons? Well, you can't have all ways my friend, but the Undivided Daemons are still respectable choices!