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Captain Stern
16-10-2007, 18:10
Can anybody remember reading about Khorne in one of the older GW publications and coming accross a paragraph with this line in it? I'm forced to paraphrase as I can't remember the exact wording... It basically went something like:

"Slaying the weak and the innocent is against the warrior's code and therefore a dishonour to Khorne. Khorne unleashes his fleshounds on those who bring dishonour to his name."

I'm sure this isn't just my imagination...

The_Outsider
16-10-2007, 18:12
Well, it sounds entirely believable.

Martial prowess (and the code of honour typically associated with it) does fal lwithin Khorne's persona.

superknijn
16-10-2007, 18:15
Ofcourse, there are multiple aspects to Khorne, as well as the multiple aspects of Slaanesh, Nurgle or Tzeentch.

And, ofcourse, GW has simplified alot, reducing Slaanesh from the god of law-breaking and ignoring moral standards (or indeed, any law or standard) into a simple god of pleusure. Which he also is, but there is/was more to it.

Drongol
16-10-2007, 18:23
Can't pull my sources right now (I'm at the office) and I doubt I have anything like that, but the quote is very familiar. Khorne used to be more of a warrior's god prone towards semi-honorable behavior and is now OMG BLUD! This is because complex concepts (a blood god that doesn't advocate mindless slaughter?) don't sell all that well to emo kids and wannabe punks, the people who seem most prone to playing Chaos.

Likewise, Slaanesh was once the god of excess. Any sort of excess. Sure, hedonism was a part of it, but so was quite a few things that went way beyond the "sex, drugs, and rock 'n roll" motif that Slaanesh is now shackled to. This, too, can be summed up as a ploy to sell more models--let's face it, there's a lot of undersexed idiots out here in the gaming world and OMG BEWBS is a valid marketing ploy (Exhibit A: Hasslefree).

Nurgle and Tzeentch, though, really haven't changed too much in my mind. Maybe I'm just not as into them as I am anything else. Who knows? Nurgle's always been the sort of jolly, hypocritical buffoon who takes paternal pride in his followers and frankly, Tzeentch is a mindscrew. Any changes in his character can be summed up as "He's Tzeentch."

It's like playing a Malkavian, I swear.

Drongol

Captain Stern
16-10-2007, 18:33
I've looked in Slaves of Darkness and I'm pretty sure it's not in there. The only other place I can think of that I might have seen it was in Warhammer Roleplay but I don't have that with me.

Kintarent
16-10-2007, 19:08
Frankly, its things like this that make me angry at GW.

The concept of honor on the Battlefield is not too hard for all the new kids to understand, and the Chaos gods are supposed to be Multi-faceted, not singularly minded.

Every worshipper of Khorne has a different depiction of him, and though it could be argued that he might be perceived largely as a raging god that cares for nothing but Slaughter,
however it would take millenia of people worshipping Khorne in that way, for him to completely convert to a god of killing the innocent.

If Gw keeps going in this direction, The Night Lords may as well be considered a Khornate Legion.

Want to know how to survive a Khornate Invasion? Break your arms, and legs, and wrap a bag around your head so you cant see. No self-respecting servant of the Blood God should touch you.

I realize the absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, but they could at least mention SOME Khornate warband that seeks out foes worthy of Slaughter. Just one? Please?

/rant off.

mistformsquirrel
16-10-2007, 19:26
This is one of those things I learned about after getting into 40k - but yes, I honestly really like the concept of an aspect of Khorne as the "honorable warrior god" instead of "FOR THE SLAUGHTER!".

Then again - I'm not necessarily sure that's been removed, as its simply a trait that hasn't been well emphasized.

The reason I say that, is that the other gods have actually retained a good bit of their multifaceted natures. Sure - you have to dig a bit; but I think even in the new Chaos codex they mention something about Tzeentch not only being a god of magic and mutation - but also hope. I know the "hope" thing is well known; but truth be told, I think few people really pay attention to it.

Back to Khorne though; keeping in mind this is basically a combination of things I've read from multiple sources + some wishful thinking on my own part:

But I see Khorne as having the following Major Personalities (With a huge number of minor ones that I don't think are really calculable) -

The Slaughterer - This is the Khorne everyone knows. Blood for the Blood God, Skulls for the Skull Throne! It matters not from where the blood flows, only that it flows.

The Warrior - As above brought up in this thread; Khorne as an honorable god of war, who pushes his warriors to prove themselves against other warrior champions. There is of course, no honor or glory to be had in mindless slaughter - it is only when a worthy opponent presents himself that the warrior of Khorne is fulfilled.

The Strategist - I honestly think that there is an element of Khorne's persona one could think of as a master strategist or great general. After all, if all of Khorne's followers were blood-mad crazies, there'd be no warships devoted to Khorne, no tanks devoted to Khorne... heck it'd be near impossible for those berserkers to get to a fight in the first place if *someone* wasn't behind the scenes directing the action!

>.> I dunno, just my musing on the subject I guess.

silence
16-10-2007, 20:10
It does sound familiar, but i can't place it. The Chaos gods are more simple now than they used to be, its that simple. Realistically though I think this is more a matter of space, they have to emphasize a single aspect over all others, as it would probably take too much room in the new slimline codex's for an indepth look at the chaos gods different aspects.

bertcom1
16-10-2007, 20:17
Can anybody remember reading about Khorne in one of the older GW publications and coming accross a paragraph with this line in it? I'm forced to paraphrase as I can't remember the exact wording... It basically went something like:

"Slaying the weak and the innocent is against the warrior's code and therefore a dishonour to Khorne. Khorne unleashes his fleshounds on those who bring dishonour to his name."

I'm sure this isn't just my imagination...


Can't find that particular paragraph.

However:
"Renegades", the supplement covering Chaos forces for the 6mm scale game of Space Marine, ©1992, has this:

Khorne the Blood God

"Khorne is a noble warrior who respects strength and bravery, who takes no joy in destroying the weak, and considers the helpless unworthy of his wrath."

&

"It is also said that Khorne's daemons will hunt down and destroy any warrior who betrays his honour by killing a helpless innocent or murdering in cold blood."

setekhite
16-10-2007, 20:18
IIRC it comes from the old Epic "Eldar and Chaos Renegades" suppliment. In contrast to the pure HTH mania of current Khornates, this book specifically had Khorne as the god of war in all its forms - including mechanised warfare - so his Daemon Engines included battle tanks and artillery.

Elcampbello
16-10-2007, 21:10
I'd like to throw another 'face' of Khorne into the ring, The Murderer. I'm not talking about heat of the moment type things, but careful, planned murder often against a target who would be impossible to bring down in other ways.

Crazy Tom
16-10-2007, 21:32
That would be 'in cold blood'... which is somewhat contradictory, but he gets away with it because he's a Chaos God.

The_Outsider
16-10-2007, 21:47
I'd like to think of Khorne as a god form of the space wolves.

Loyal, honourable, mighty warriors with a streak of bloodlust.

Kasonic
16-10-2007, 22:00
Personally I like Khorne in his current incarnation. There's a billion "honorable but bloodthirsty" war gods in fantasy writing, but there's only one Blood God on the Skull Throne. It's far more Chaos, especially when you look at the Word Bearers or the Night Lords.

The Chaos gods are, after all, primal incarnations of emotion(rage, pleasure, stability, and change)

Now, the idea of a splinter Khorne cult that worships him as an honorable god is indeed an interesting idea.

Adra
16-10-2007, 22:07
Hes more primal in his current form...no reason he cant be interpreted as a warrior god but the line "khorne cares not from where the blood flows" kinda washes out all the martial prowess aspect.

azimaith
16-10-2007, 22:24
You have to remember khorne is not the same god to a cultist as he is to a chaos space marine. You need to remember that chaos space marines are warped not necessarily by chaos, but by *becoming a space marine*. When a space marine is turned into essentially a fanatical fundamentalist killing machine from a normal human hes going to be a fanatical fundamentalist killing machine in whatever realm he falls into. You need to remember a space marine never raises a child, a space marine doesn't fall in love, a space marine is not taught to show kindness and mercy or to think in modern ethical terms. They are taught to fight, kill, follow orders, and repeat dogma. In many ways a space marine is mentally *stunted* compared to the wide range of experiences and emotions a normal human will experience in their life.

A normal warrior may be noble and kind yet still worship khorne for his martial prowess.

Just because a deranged space marine (and they're well deranged before they fall to chaos) screams: "KILL MAIM BURN!" doesn't mean khorne is speaking through him. They worship khorne in their own way, which is to go on a killing spree.

Another warrior might yell: "For honor!" and still be worshipping khorne.

So rule 1 of the chaos gods:
Just because a space marine screams it at the top of his lungs doesn't make it any more true.

Rule 2: Just because the imperium screams it at the top of their lungs doesn't make it any more true.

Rule 3: Chaos Space Marines do not represent the majority of chaos worship.

Captain Stern
16-10-2007, 23:44
Can't find that particular paragraph.

However:
"Renegades", the supplement covering Chaos forces for the 6mm scale game of Space Marine, ©1992, has this:

Khorne the Blood God

"Khorne is a noble warrior who respects strength and bravery, who takes no joy in destroying the weak, and considers the helpless unworthy of his wrath."

&

"It is also said that Khorne's daemons will hunt down and destroy any warrior who betrays his honour by killing a helpless innocent or murdering in cold blood."


That's it! (though I could have sworn it said Khorne's hounds rather than his daemons...)

EDIT/ UPDATE

Thanks by the way.

Smishkun
17-10-2007, 00:00
Yeah that seems like some things ive heard before about Khorne as well.

In some place or another wasnt it said that the battle between Slaneesh and Khaine was interrupted by Khorne on Khaine's behalf? Or is that false? I liked Khorne slightly once I had heard that, mostly knowing him as blood bluud kyll kyll.

Shiakou
17-10-2007, 00:19
Yeah that seems like some things ive heard before about Khorne as well.

In some place or another wasnt it said that the battle between Slaneesh and Khaine was interrupted by Khorne on Khaine's behalf? Or is that false? I liked Khorne slightly once I had heard that, mostly knowing him as blood bluud kyll kyll.

I thought Khorne fought Slaanesh over Khaine, not for Khaine. Sorta like;

Khorne: Hey brat, that's my bitch you're dominating!

Slaanesh: Oh yeah? Wat'cha gonna do about it?

Khorne: I'll show you what I'm gonna do about it!

*insert massive chaos battle*

Captain Stern
17-10-2007, 00:58
I've got it saved from a previous discussion.


From WD127, p26:
...When Kaela Mensha Khaine, the Bloody Handed God of the Eldar, fought with Slaanesh the Lord of Pleasure, he was quickly overwhelmed and his energy captured by the newborn God. For the Bloody Handed God was as much a part of Slaanesh as of Khorne - being a product of that part of the Eldar nature which finds gratification in murder and pleasure in bloody violence. Khorne the Blood God, the Patron of War, Murder and Battle, roared with rage to discover one of his own taken from him in this way. Then Khorne and Slaanesh clashed headlong, the Blood God fighting to recover the portion of his power that had been robbed from him, Slaanesh driven by his uncontrollable hunger to consume everything in his path. The Bloody Handed God of the Eldar was tossed this way and that, at first grasped by Slaanesh, then tugged back into the compass of Khorne.

Eventually the rage of the Blood God and the passion of the Lord of Pleasure were exhausted, and the boundaries between them were established. Like a leaf in the eye of a hurrican, Kaela Mensha Khaine fell among the calm, down through the Realm of Chaos and into the material universe. As he entered the material universe he divided into many shards of energy, scattering his power so that neither Khorne nor Slaanesh could ever find him again. Each shard entered the body of an Eldar, filling the body with his own mind, possessing it, so that it became a virtually indestructible blood-lusting murderer - the material manifestation of the Bloody Handed God. These are the Avatars of the Bloody Handed God...

Col. Dash
17-10-2007, 03:25
I do remember reading that and seeing several other things such as a berserker offering the skull of an innocent to Khorne and then the god striking him down and adding his skull to his throne as punishment. I also remember reading somewhere in fantasy that even in the empire of at least one knightly order who fights against chaos unknowingly worshiping Khorne as a god of honor. That sounds kiinda cool, its a win win situation for him in that case, someone is going to die in battle either way heheh.

Smishkun
17-10-2007, 03:29
I've got it saved from a previous discussion.
Aha! Yes, exactly.


I thought Khorne fought Slaanesh over Khaine, not for Khaine. Sorta like;

Khorne: Hey brat, that's my bitch you're dominating!

Slaanesh: Oh yeah? Wat'cha gonna do about it?

Khorne: I'll show you what I'm gonna do about it!

*insert massive chaos battle*

Yeah thats what I meant, still not out of goodness or anything, but a deeply buried sense of honor.

Captain Stern
17-10-2007, 03:41
I like that this nifty piece of background implies that Khorne is truly ancient and that war (Khorne) and the warrior(Khorne) are common to all sentient races of the galaxy/ universe.

I think it also serves to remind us that Eldar were created by Rick Priestly and Jes Goodwin, and not by Graham Macneil (a warrior race with Toughness 3..?).

iamkion132
17-10-2007, 05:44
It would be interesting to see a Chaos warband dedicated to protecting the weak

Kveld-Ulf
17-10-2007, 06:37
Can't pull my sources right now (I'm at the office) and I doubt I have anything like that, but the quote is very familiar. Khorne used to be more of a warrior's god prone towards semi-honorable behavior and is now OMG BLUD! This is because complex concepts (a blood god that doesn't advocate mindless slaughter?) don't sell all that well to emo kids and wannabe punks, the people who seem most prone to playing Chaos.
Drongol

Dang it.. what have I told those emo kids about playing Khorne? They only cut others, not themselves!

As a Khorne player myself (despite the recent Codex) I have to agree with this. It's all about the prowess of martial force, and honor. Don't use Khorne Berserkers for examples, they've been lobotomised, so they don't count.

Don't get me wrong though, most Chaos Marines have been corrupted to the point of madness. What was once honor in battle is now ruthlessness and winning is now all that matters.

Although I'm going to have a bit of trouble retooling my Chaos Army with this new Codex, I have to say I appreciate the changes in it. It seem's to me that Khorne was changed from a "Rarg me smash!" (sorry Greenskins) to a slightly more flexible unit. This ties in with warriors of Khorne being a highly close combat oriented doctrine, as well as showing they do have honor and somewhat of a brain.

Eulenspiegel
17-10-2007, 07:37
You have to remember (...)
Excellent, Azimaith! That´s how I would have put it, but in less eloquent words and much more incoherently :D
When I got my first Realm of Chaos books in the last millennium, I envisioned Khorne like this.

Richter Kless
17-10-2007, 10:28
I gues I am one of the few who excerly likes Khorne the way he is now.
The no morals and ulimited slaughter attitude is what makes so him delightfull in my eyes. I always hated it when in horror movies, the monster/psycho always spares the children. A khorne berzerker who butchers anything, and I mean anything, is really what Chaos is all about in my opinion. Mindless slaughter, none are spared, and make the blood flow until it can fill oceans.

But than again, I am more of the new generation gamer and what many veterans would call ´a kid´. (though I am 17)

DantesInferno
17-10-2007, 10:41
I really have problems with this thread, since it buys whole-heartedly into the notion that there's a single identity which we can label "Khorne", and that this identity has certain likes and dislikes, actually sitting on a throne somewhere and directing his hounds around.

It seems to me to be taking the descriptions of "Khorne" in the background far too literally: there isn't a bloke called Khorne sitting on a mound of skulls in the Warp. The best way we have of understanding what the Chaos Gods are is as gigantic nebulous "swirls" of like emotions within the Warp. Even this description, it must be stressed, is just a metaphor for what's going on in the Warp.

So, within the swirling warp vortex we call Khorne, there's possibilities for a whole range of conglomerations of like emotions: distinct sub-swirls within the larger vortex. So it's misleading to say "Khorne likes X" or "Khorne hates Y". The more accurate (although perhaps less poetic) way might be to say "There's a part of the warp vortex we call Khorne that is formed by the real-space emotions of martial pride".

Shiakou
17-10-2007, 11:24
Dantes, wouldn't that imply that Khorne is merely the receptacle or the embodiment of martial pride and rage, but that he doesn't actively inspire the same in others? That it's effectively a one-way street?

DantesInferno
17-10-2007, 11:41
Dantes, wouldn't that imply that Khorne is merely the receptacle or the embodiment of martial pride and rage, but that he doesn't actively inspire the same in others? That it's effectively a one-way street?

Depends what you mean by "actively inspire", I suppose.

My position doesn't imply that the swirling warp-vortex "Khorne" cannot affect the emotions of mortals; that it must be a one-way street. Mortals' emotions flow around in the Warp, coming together in big whirlpools like Khorne. These whirlpools can certainly have impacts back into the real-world: the manifestations of Daemons and Warp Storms being obvious examples.

However, I don't think that there's necessarily someone in the Warp ("Khorne") who makes conscious decisions to manifest Daemons, cause rage in people etc. That's taking the mythology far too literally for me. The better explanation for me is that those effects are by-products of all the raw churning emotions flowing in the Warp.

setekhite
17-10-2007, 11:47
The whole Khorne concept went full-circle in the late 80s / early 90s, which is why you have so much confusion.

In the earliest mentions of Khorne - mid-80s fluff, WFRP, and ultimately Slaves to Darkness - he was a slavering blood-god. About 1990, though, GW went into their most child-friendly stage; what is sometimes referred to as the 'red period' because all company models had to be painted in a cheerful, eye-catching colour scheme. With the release of the first plastic World Eaters, they were retconned from blood-crazed maniacs into honourable warriors, I guess so that they were more acceptable to young players. Renegades was published in this period and continued the trend. It wasn't until the late years of 40K 2nd ed - notably the release of the first Chaos Codex in 1996 - that the retcon was reversed and the followers of Khorne went back to being blood-crazed maniacs.

Chaos Undecided
17-10-2007, 12:58
I found the short story in the latest codex accompanying Kharns entry quite interesting in that it potrayed that other World Eater Berserkers as quite coherent and no more unstable than any other Chaos Space Marine. Kharn himself is shown as the very extreme of what it is to be a worshipper of Khorne.

Now once a World Eater beserker is in combat and their rewired brains kick in I'm sure that everything and anything that gets in their way is going to be chopped up into little pieces but I dont think they are any different to the other Chaos Marine legions on how they treat the "innocent", you could argue that if anything the Death Guard or Emperors Children would be even worse.

Brother Loki
17-10-2007, 13:02
I like to think that theres a wide variety of doctrinal differences amongst groups of Khorne worshippers, as there are in pretty much all religions.

The World Eaters take at least as much of their persona from Angron's upbringing and foul temper, along with the lobotomy that most of the legion underwent, as they do from the active worship of Khorne. Even they need people to handle logistics and planning however.

Look at Khorne cults in the fiction for some other variations:

The Blood Pact of Urlock Gaur have little or no morality, but a strong sense of military professionalism. tHey'll torture and kil with the rest of them, but the mission comes first.

Anakwanar Sek and his followers seem to be part of a functional society, although a brutal one. Sek believes that words are more powerful weapons than bombs or swords. He'd as soo win a battle through clever use of propaganda as through bloodshed. Yet he is depicted with the icon of Khorne - a far cry from the frothing lunatics we see more commonly bearing it.

From this we see many different approaches to the worship of Khorne. Some do nothing but slaughter in his name, some wish to prove themselves in battle, some just want to win, and so on.

I think there's more than enough room and ambiguity for any of these styles to be perfectly valid.

vforvenator
08-11-2007, 13:50
I gues I am one of the few who excerly likes Khorne the way he is now.
The no morals and ulimited slaughter attitude is what makes so him delightfull in my eyes. I always hated it when in horror movies, the monster/psycho always spares the children. A khorne berzerker who butchers anything, and I mean anything, is really what Chaos is all about in my opinion. Mindless slaughter, none are spared, and make the blood flow until it can fill oceans.

But than again, I am more of the new generation gamer and what many veterans would call ´a kid´. (though I am 17)Well as a 'veteran' gamer by some reckoning, I whole-heartedly agree. I've no problem with complex concepts but still seriously dislike the honourable image of Khorne's followers that makes them so noble, they don't seem evil any more. That some of them percieve Khorne in such a way is a good idea, but I still prefer the idea of Khorne's servants as vicious, murderous scum.
There's a passage in the RoC books, I can't recall exactly, but that says Khorne equally smiles on those who kill their own brothers or friends, and that take the initiative in this regard (making him sound kind less like Patton or Sun Tzu, more like Machiavelli...). Or like Khaine, a theological connection I also like. While Chaos forces wil inevitably turn on their own once their usual victims run out.
If you read Shadowbreed and Warblade, from the Konrad trilogy, the former shows Khornate acolytes as as nasty and sadistic a bunch of cults as you'll ever find - like I mentioned above, in truely graphic style - while the latter shows a good example of Khorne's ambiguity when Konrad escapes from a Slaaneshi cult's temple.


It would be interesting to see a Chaos warband dedicated to protecting the weakNurgle?

TheSonOfAbbadon
08-11-2007, 15:28
Considering the fact that the big four aren't the only chaos gods out there, even if GW do turn Khone into just a crazy violent guy, and Slaanesh into just a pervert, it would be acceptable to anyone who knows the background that there may be other, weaker chaos gods who embody different aspects of the human psyche. A god dedicated to honour, one dedicated to protection of the innocent, one dedicated to justice, logically they would all exist, so forming an army using the chaos gods' special rules that isn't an army of that actual god would be perfectly fine.

Although, not having to make up excuses why your Khorne bezerkers believe in honour above all else, or your Orks aren't babbling ****** would be great.


Khornate warband that seeks out foes worthy of Slaughter.

This is why I don't read the background board anymore.

I keep on getting too many ideas for fantasic armies! :D I think the last one was a Chapter of Marines made up almost entirely out of scouts, that actually used camoufalge and carefully planned tactics to win.

Havock
08-11-2007, 16:56
I realize the absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, but they could at least mention SOME Khornate warband that seeks out foes worthy of Slaughter. Just one? Please?

/rant off.

The idea is actually quite nice, for fantasy as well as 40k.
Sort of like "we just want to fight with the best, all else can go to hell for all we care."

Exterminatus
08-11-2007, 18:30
THere still is a piece fluff depicting Khorne with a little more aspect to it than the Blood God.

One of my codices has a few lines on Ulrik the Slayer of the space wolves. Becasue of his martial prowess, slaying 8 or so Khorne Bezerkers single handedly in hand to hand combat, he has the singular honour of receiving a salute from the World Eater legion, a feat no other space marine has accomplished. It was also a bit of a dubious honour...

What does this imply? Instead of charging more Bezerkers into combat with Ulrik, they respected and appreciated the martial prowess of Ulrik. Thus Khorne does not only live for slaughter and blood.

Argastes
08-11-2007, 21:26
THere still is a piece fluff depicting Khorne with a little more aspect to it than the Blood God.

One of my codices has a few lines on Ulrik the Slayer of the space wolves. Becasue of his martial prowess, slaying 8 or so Khorne Bezerkers single handedly in hand to hand combat, he has the singular honour of receiving a salute from the World Eater legion, a feat no other space marine has accomplished. It was also a bit of a dubious honour...

What does this imply? Instead of charging more Bezerkers into combat with Ulrik, they respected and appreciated the martial prowess of Ulrik. Thus Khorne does not only live for slaughter and blood.

I believe it's actually from the 2nd Edition SW codex itself, from the text of Ulrik's own entry. IIRC, it was only 3 Berserkers, but on the other hand, the salute didn't come just from the World Eaters legion, it came from the World Eaters Primarch--Angron himself! However, it also doesn't say anything about the World Eaters having stopped fighting him at that point. I don't see anything to indicate that they did, and in fact, it doesn't make sense. This was in the middle of a swirling melee, so it's not like Ulrik was standing there waiting as berserkers charged him until Angron told them to stop. I don't think the fighting stopped after Angron saluted Ulrik.

Mr_Rose
09-11-2007, 00:33
With that whole "sending fesh hounds after the slayers of the innocent" bit, has no-one else considered that it might be the dying innocent and/or their relatives who are summoning the Flesh Hounds by virtue of vengeful wrath? Even if they don't do it on purpose, Flesh Hounds are drawn to slaughter and bloodshed and the desire of said innocent for destruction of their enemies could easily act as a suitable focus, no?

Or in a more round-about way; their dying wish is for vengeance, in defiance of their deaths, and as they merge with Khorne in the warp (having been killed in his name) they set up a sort of resonance within the maelstrom of rage that is Khorne in the Warp that blips a couple of Flesh Hounds into reality in the vicinity of their deaths.

TheDarkDaff
09-11-2007, 02:02
I think the Siege of Terra is a good example of what Khorne is about. Where are the World Eaters during the seige. Right at the gates of the emporer's Fortress fighting the Defence forces while the Emporer's Children are of slaughtering the unarmed civilians for the fun of it.

Captain Stern
09-11-2007, 02:09
I believe it's actually from the 2nd Edition SW codex itself, from the text of Ulrik's own entry. IIRC, it was only 3 Berserkers, but on the other hand, the salute didn't come just from the World Eaters legion, it came from the World Eaters Primarch--Angron himself! However, it also doesn't say anything about the World Eaters having stopped fighting him at that point. I don't see anything to indicate that they did, and in fact, it doesn't make sense. This was in the middle of a swirling melee, so it's not like Ulrik was standing there waiting as berserkers charged him until Angron told them to stop. I don't think the fighting stopped after Angron saluted Ulrik.


I'd forgotten about that little story. Very cool.

Champsguy
09-11-2007, 03:16
Khorne hates wusses. What self respecting warrior would offer the skull of a 12 year old girl to Khorne? That's like spitting in his face. "Hey, thanks for the awesome killy superpowers, Khorne. I used them to kill this 4 year old. He was a tough bastard, let me tell you."

It's not like Khorne has a problem with slaughter, but killing the helpless and the innocent when you should be out kicking ass and fighting people worthy of combat and glory will make the Blood God pretty pissed at you. A warrior of Khorne should never EVER pass up the chance to engage in glorious combat for the chance to kill some helpless people. Khorne doesn't want to be associated with wimps.

Captain Stern
09-11-2007, 03:33
That's definetely in keeping with the depiction of Khorne in the book Renegades. It's not that Khorne feels sorry for innocents and weaklings killed in his name and that his anger arises from this. No, it's because killing such unworthies is an insult to his martial honour. The actions of his subjects reflects on Khorne himself.