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View Full Version : Are there any Space Marine chapters solely focused on Naval warfare?



Ktotwf
20-10-2007, 01:06
I realize that the Black Templar and Imperial Fists are very navy oriented for SM, but I was really curious to know if there were any Astartes Chapters whose sole role within the Imperium is Naval battles?

Minister
20-10-2007, 01:18
Some chapters are based heavily around boarding actions, but none are designed for naval battles per se. Indeed the Imperial Navy tends to get a mite ticked off when Marines start looking like they're challenging their supremacy in the realm of void combat.

Belisarius
20-10-2007, 01:35
Astral Claws before they went over to chaos were created for the sole purpose of guarding the shipping lanes of a sector versus renagades and pirates. Would imagine that ship to ship warfare while by no means the only thing they trained for was a major one. Furthermore one need only look at the current fluff for the red corsairs to see that is indeed their primary focus.

BrotherAdso
20-10-2007, 01:42
Also, there's some wonderful fan fluff out there for the Space Sharks that links them to Rogue Traders, serving as super-escorts and privateers and small-scale planetary assault units. They're depicted as rather like their namesakes -- swiftly striking through the void, tearing enemy vessels and isolated settlements asunder.

I think a far more interesting idea could be the Imperial Marines -- the specialized boarding and ship-to-ground troops of the Navy itself. Not the Imperial Guard, not the Adeptus Mechanichus, but the Naval Marines.

-Adso

Green-is-best
20-10-2007, 02:24
Also, there's some wonderful fan fluff out there for the Space Sharks that links them to Rogue Traders, serving as super-escorts and privateers and small-scale planetary assault units. They're depicted as rather like their namesakes -- swiftly striking through the void, tearing enemy vessels and isolated settlements asunder.

I think a far more interesting idea could be the Imperial Marines -- the specialized boarding and ship-to-ground troops of the Navy itself. Not the Imperial Guard, not the Adeptus Mechanichus, but the Naval Marines.

-Adso

That would be cool! I've always wished that GW would explore aspects of the Imperial military machine beyond what's already established. Imperial Guard Special Forces? Yes, please! Imperial Guard Air Cav? Yes, please!

Andromak Seydon
20-10-2007, 04:52
Alas my friends naval battles are the sole focus of the Imperial Navy. SM only have ships to get around from one place or another. while some chapters have more naval power than others (such as crusading chapters such as black templars, imperial fists and dark angels) no chapter is solely focussed on naval combat. methinks that the imp navy would get mighty ticked, mebbe to the point when they would call the inquisition on that chapter.


though, i do like the idea of them space shark/Uber-ship-security thingies

Born Again
20-10-2007, 05:01
It depends what you mean. Yes, there are some chapters that are fleet based while others, like the Astral Claws, protect shipping lanes as mentioned above. But in all cases they do so in boarding actions, where the shock assault tactics of Marines can really come into their own. It would be quite a waste spending so much time, money and resources on creating and training humanity's finest super-warriors to be elite killing machines if they were just going to sit on ships and fight naval battles. So, by the definition of a naval battle as ships shooting at each other, no, there is not.

I second the motion to have more mentioned about other Imperial forces!

Vaulkhar
20-10-2007, 05:05
Imperial Marines would be cool, but I can see the Inquisition starting to have a problem with it under the 'separation of powers' rule. Orbit to ground at anything much more than company scale is most definitely the province of the Imperial Guard, with the Navy providing the taxi service.

But yes, units of Naval Provosts (who are basically ship security troopers) would be a cool thing to explore.

starlight
20-10-2007, 05:27
I think that a WH list would be a good starting point for Imperial Naval Marines, but I doubt that any Chapter Master would allow his Space Marines to become *Navy* per se. The largest *Marine* vessel is a Battle Barge, which is limited in it's capacity to carry out ship to ship combat.

Not saying that it couldn't be done, and if you showed up for a BFG game with a Marine force, I'd play...assuming I had a Fleet, but it wouldn't really have an impact on a 40K game, so whatever you want to write for a background is up to you.:)

BrotherAdso
20-10-2007, 10:57
I agree with everyone here, Marines would never develop true naval warfare capability -- they are too few to crew such vessels, their training too specialized, and their resources too limited to maintain a real battlefleet. Marines follow the Codex, mostly, and it doesn't have much to say on building and using battleships or cruiser squadrons.

Well, that and the whole Inquisition / Lords Solar getting PO'ed thing.

On the Imperial Marines: I would run them using the Witchunters. Inquisitor or Cannoness would be the 'Commandant' or 'Psy-Guide'...I can see a force which has to fight around Warp engines, navigators, and possibly inside space hulks as wanting either a psyker to help them out (Inquisitor) or a squad of truly armed and ready shock troops (cannoness and celestians) to flush dense areas out. The majority of the force would be Stormtroopers with "boarding shotguns" and other weapons appropriate for melting bulkheads and dousing enclosed spaces in promethium, if you get my drift. Death Cult assasins would be 'special boarding and infiltration agents'...get in, get to the enemy bridge, and kill the captain sorts or things.

Did anyone find that fan page I was talking about for the space sharks? With their re-imagined fluff?

-Adso

Minister
20-10-2007, 11:15
The "Imperial Marines", or Naval Armsmen as they are more correctly known, are a regular feature of the fluff. Shotguns and autoguns are the most common weapons, chosen to reduce the chance of rupturing conduits or hulls. Most are flak armoured, with a few units wearing carapace. Naval Security also also maintains units equivalent to the Imperial Guard Storm Troopers, who exchange hellguns for shotguns when shipboard. They are generally lead by their own NCOs and line officers of the Navy (who are as a rule most enthusiastic when it comes to a chance to grab glory in a boarding action).

Less modern RMC, more the Marines of the 19th century.

BrotherAdso
20-10-2007, 11:54
Oo, really? Could you link/refer me to where I can find that stuff, other than a few isolated references I can remember in the BFG book?

To get back to the OP's question: Here's the page with the fleet-oriented fluff on the Space Sharks, they're down towards the bottom of the page:

http://www.philipsibbering.net/WH40KRP/WH40KRP_Concepts_%5BAA_Chapters%5D.htm

Minister
20-10-2007, 15:37
Armsmen and/or Naval Security turn up in the novels Execution Hour, Shadow Point, Maleus (or possibly Hereticus), Crossfire, and a couple of others. There's also a splendid article on them in one of the old White Dwarfs. The issue number, unfortunately, seems to be missing from the White Dwarf database.

Sabbad
20-10-2007, 16:14
And the Last Chancer novels, 13th Legion most prominently of all/

unwanted
20-10-2007, 16:41
As for SMs, there are one "Angel"-chapter, highly specialised for boarding. They were mentioned as participants in the 3rd War of Armageddon, and had a picture in white dwarf. Red armour and flame-patterns... Name escapes me...

Colonel Deal
20-10-2007, 17:53
The Naval Armsmen also get some mention in some of the Gaunt's Ghost novels, IIRC First and Only and Sabbat Martyr, focussing on the frigate Navarre which escorts the Tanith troopships.

Vaulkhar
20-10-2007, 19:22
In game terms...stormies with shotguns, possibly with flamers and grenade launchers as options?

dr.oetk3r
20-10-2007, 19:50
Weren't the harbingers big in the whole Navy thig?

Leftenant Gashrog
20-10-2007, 20:01
The Exorcists are actually somewhat notable for their fleet: The original Badab War IA article from WD101 specifically noted that the few surviving Tiger Claws 'fought their way through the Exorcists blockade'. The Emperors Shield IA noted their fleet was engaged in heavy fighting around the Armageddon systems jump points trying to stem Ork reinforcements into the system. Their ships also accounted for 2 out of 3 Battle Barges and 3 out of 8 Strike Cruisers in the 'Famous Ships of the Gothic War' list.

baphomael
20-10-2007, 20:01
A chapter wholly dedicated to naval combat? A mighty waste of Battle Brothers, methinks. What would all those tactical squads do with themselves? Hope they get a chance to board something?

Champsguy
21-10-2007, 15:22
Sure, why not?

They probably wouldn't be solely big ships (though I think they could certainly get away with having a decent sized fleet -- the Inquisition doesn't have the time or energy to hunt down loyal SM chapters just because some Admiral has his panties in a wad). However, I can easily see a moderate fleet with lots of specialized boarders. Personally, I'd like to see a squad of Terminators teleport onto the bridge of an enemy ship, and then simply point the assault cannons at the ceiling and fire. "Hull breach? I have pressurized armor..." ;)

You could build some nice 40K terrain that looked like the inside of a ship. Just agree with your opponent beforehand not to use vehicles ('cause that's just silly).

malika
22-10-2007, 12:33
I think that Space Marine Chapters wouldnt really overspecialise in one thing. Sure they have some specialisations. (close combat oriented, siege, etc) but they wouldnt just become focussed on one thing. For armylists and gaming this idea is fun, but remember that Space Marines are very rare, so if a Space Marine chapter is responsible for protecting a few sectors they would have to be able to fight in many different styles, not just one.

And sure there are Chapters out there who are better in naval combat than others, but this doesnt mean they are a "naval combat" Chapter.