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View Full Version : New Player, Which list is better? (bret-chaos)



AbyssRaven
25-10-2007, 11:32
Hi all!

Im looking to start a WHFB army along side my 40k army, and was wondering which of these 2 are better, or how can i improve each?
The first is a Bretonian army list (i love the idea of knights, its what drew me to WHFB).
The second is an Army of slaanesh. If i did this i would convert the whole force. Maurauders would be demonetes with only 1 crab claw, the other a shield arm. And the horns turned into hair. Chaos Warriors would probally be Dark Elf executioners, but with the chain mail turned to robes (green stuff fil lthe gaps) the heads made into more round helmets and the armour filed to be smooth armour plates (think that would make them diffrent enough?)
Was looking at an all female force, basically.

Any how, the lists! one is 1k, the other 750 (unsure what to add to make it 1k)

Bretonians

Marcas of Heartwood – 136pts
Paladin
Shield
Warhorse
Lance of Artois
Enchanted Shield
Virtue of the Joust

Jhonathen of two-rivers – 118pts
Paladin
Lance
Warhorse
Banner of Chalons
Virtue of Discipline

Core

Realm knights – 240pts
7 Knights of the Realm
Musician
Standard bearer

Realm knights – 250pts
7 Knights of the Realm
Musician
Standard bearer
Banner of Chalons

Peasants – 145
20Bowmen
Musician
Standard
Viliane
Braziers

Men of the Heartwood – 127
20 men at Arms
Musician
Standard
Viliane

Total 1001
Total: 20 Knights, 20 archers, 20 MaA

Chaos

Salmissra the Eternal, Exalted champion of Slaanesh – 170
Whip of Pleasure
Mark of Slaanesh

Core
Warriors of Slaanesh – 351
12 Chaos Warriors
Great Weapons (unsure how they fare in game, did it simply for the conversion plan)
Musician
Champion
Standard with Warbanner
Mark of Slaanesh

Tribe of the Fragile Rose – 157
16 Marauders
Shields
Light Armour
Champion
Standard with Warbanner
Mark of Slaanesh

Bringer of Pleasure – 130
Chariot of Chaos
Mark of Slaanesh

Total: 801
Models: 17Heavy Infantry, 16 Light infantry, 1 Chariot

**To expand I was thinking another unit and maybe 10 demonette’s and 10 hounds. Or all 200pts on demonette's. Or how about trying to squeeze ins ome knights? Or another chariot + some Maurauder horsemen (or some hound packs)


Thank you for any time, and assistance!

wildkarrde0
25-10-2007, 18:14
one thing to point out maurauders can't have marks of chaos

der_lex
25-10-2007, 18:35
Yup, they can't. Boosting their number to 20 could be a good way to go, though, since you can't field really them 4 by 4 in 7th ed anymore (need 5 for a rank bonus).

How many Chaos Warriors do you intend to field? Your list says 12, but from the points cost and the summary I'd say you intended 15? Personally, for a unit that big, I'd give them halberds instead of great weapons...that way you get to abuse their good initiative in prolonged combats. Also, give them and your Champ shields, it'll help them survive missile fire.

As for the chariot...never, ever give a chariot the Mark of Slaanesh unless you plan to put your character in it (which isn't a bad idea, really...the Whip really helps out if your chariot gets stuck in combat and flanked). Otherwise you'll end up with a chariot that's immune to psychology, which sounds good...until you realize that it can't flee as a charge reaction anymore. Chariots are only good when they're the ones charging...you don't want to end up taking a charge with them.

As for fleshing out the list...you'll need something fast to deal with mages and war machines, and some screens against missile fire while your infantry closes in. I'd advise two units of five Warhounds, and either a Marauder horseman unit (with flails and a musician...more command is wasted on fast cav) or six or so Furies...

Kadrium
25-10-2007, 18:53
The bret army is a more competitive list. Chaos warriors are so so.

I'm not seeing where you're getting 20 knights in that bret list though.

2x7 KotR and 2 heroes?

Belerophon709
26-10-2007, 00:05
The bret army is a more competitive list. Chaos warriors are so so.

I'm not seeing where you're getting 20 knights in that bret list though.

2x7 KotR and 2 heroes?

His list confused me as well.
I just figured it out though.

When he writes this:

7 KotR
Musician
Standard Bearer

He means this:

7 KotR + a musician (8th knight) + a standard bearer (9th knight).

It should have been like this:

9 KotR
-FC


People really should read the "How to post"-thread.

AbyssRaven
26-10-2007, 02:50
Sorry my bad. I just noticed the post about listing Command as non independant entries.
its 16 warriors, 9 bretonians.
Dropping the MoS from the Maurauders and Chariot will allow me to get the maurauders up to 20.
To add to the list i was thinking chariot + 2x6 warhounds.
Though instead of the chariot i could take 2 maurauder horseman units + warhounds

der_lex
26-10-2007, 03:01
Why do you want to field 16 Warriors? You'll be left with a straggler behind your ranks that way. A 5x3 block of 15 warriors would be enough.

I've heard before that wanting to field units of 6 is a 40K thing. Don't know if that's true, but fielding your Warhounds in units of six is a bit of a waste (financially as well, those metal buggers are expensive). Units of 5 will do a fine enough job at screening your army.

I wouldn't go for a second chariot if I were you. You're better off with a unit of 5 marauder horsemen with a musician and flails, and perhaps a Chaos Spawn (with Mark of Slaanesh, if possible), if you have the points?

AbyssRaven
26-10-2007, 04:25
haha units of 6 is very 40k. The Core of my SPace Marine army is 4 units of 6 with a medium and long range Armour Penetration 2 weaponry.
Bad habbits i guess

I thought things ranked in 4's (since all the pic's i saw had them in units of 4)

Im in the process of writing a 2k bret and 2k chaos army. Will post them indevidually, see feedback then decide which i will play.

thanks for all the tips so far they have helped alot!

der_lex
26-10-2007, 04:36
Under 6th ed rules, units ranked in fours. Under 7th ed, you need five models for a rank. Chaos Warriors got shafted pretty hard because of this...they basically lost a rank (because a unit of 20 isn't really worth its hefty cost).

If you go for 2k with Slaanesh, be sure to include a caster or two (Slaaneshi magic is nasty, nasty stuff) and a unit of mounted daemonettes.

AbyssRaven
26-10-2007, 10:14
Thems the plans. was thinking roughly
Lord mounted
Exalted sorcerour on slaneeshi steed lvl 4
2 x 15warriors
4Knights (lord makes the 5th), maybe chosen
Mounted demonettes
then the rest in maurauders

need to flesh out the list thougbh properly

Kadrium
26-10-2007, 13:52
Thems the plans. was thinking roughly
Lord mounted
Exalted sorcerour on slaneeshi steed lvl 4
2 x 15warriors
4Knights (lord makes the 5th), maybe chosen
Mounted demonettes
then the rest in maurauders

need to flesh out the list thougbh properly

Take an exalted champ instead of the lord. You can actually field two exalteds with 50pts of magic gear for less than the cost of 1 lord with 100pts of gear.

One unit of warriors is plenty. Warriors are really under-performers for the most part. Take more knights as your hammer unit. Your warriors can follow up with their slower movement and help clean up where needed, but 2 units of them is a lot of points wasted for less performance than your knights will give you.

On your warrior units, instead of 15 warriors in 3 ranks, try 12 in 2 ranks of 6. They get more attacks against ranked infantry that way. To make up for the lost rank, add a war banner. It's cheaper than 3 warriors, and you can't lose that CR by taking casualties, like you can with a rank of soldiers.

With that setup, you end up with 6 warriors able to attack instead of 5, and the same CR. If you take heavy casualties to the unit, you can only lose 1 CR from losing a rank, instead of the 2 CR you can lose with a 5x3 block.

I'd probably take 5 knights and slip the lord in as well, so you need to lose two models before taking panic.

Use the points from dropping one of the warrior units and trimming the other to buy another unit of knights.

Little Aaad
26-10-2007, 14:09
I'd probably take 5 knights and slip the lord in as well, so you need to lose two models before taking panic.



Panic checks as Slaanesh?

AbyssRaven
26-10-2007, 16:49
Bretonian 2k List (scrolldown alittle t the fix list) - http://warseer.com/forums/fantasy-army-lists/109627-2k-bretonians-first-shot.html

Chaos 2k list - http://warseer.com/forums/fantasy-army-lists/109668-2k-slaanesh-warband.html
(on this thinking dropping the 15walking demonettes for another 5 knights, and dropping 1 maruader horseman forma unit to getanother chosen knight)

Kadrium
26-10-2007, 16:53
Panic checks as Slaanesh?

Nice to meet you, I'm Retarded. :D

AbyssRaven
26-10-2007, 17:23
Nice to meet you, I'm Retarded. :D

Pug dressed a sdarthvader.
Thats allwin, not retarded :p

And i was kind of wondering about that 2, i thought slaanesh didnt really panic (masochists seem to like being beaten up)