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Los
30-10-2007, 06:16
Lord
Exalted Sorceror of Chaos, Lvl 4, Barded Chaos Steed, Staff of Change, Power Stone, MoCU 384


Hero
Exalted Demon, Lvl 2 Sorceror, MoCU, Chaos Disruption 360

Exalted Demon, Lvl 2 Sorceror,MoCU, Soul Hunger, Diabolic Splendor 355

Special
8 Chaos Furies 120

10 Daemonettes 150

Core
5 Maurader Horseman, Flails, Musician 81

1 Chariots of Chaos 120

5 Warhounds of Chaos 30

20 Mauraders of Chaos, Standard Bearer, Hand Weapon, Shield 130

Rare

1 Hell Cannon 270



Total Points 2000
Power Dice 10 (and a Power Stone)
Dispel Dice 10
I am completely new to Fantasy. I do not have an army yet and do not know the rules very well. I play 40k and have struggled to find fantasy figures that I actually like. Since I am in an new town that seems to have a lot of fantasy players I thought I would start an army. I based this army on the figures that I like the most, especially the Be'lakor, Hell Cannon, and Maurader models. I am going to include two Be’lakor models as my exalted demons. One will be dark blue with Lore of Shadow and the other Red with Lore of Fire. The red model will have soul hunger and Lore of Fire which I hope to use to roll for Flaming Sword of Rhuin. I figured I could run my Be'lakor brothers together with the Furies so that they can all benefit from Chaos Disruption and Diabolic Splendor. Send them back to take out artillery and then hit the enemy back lines. Hopefully their terror will work well with the Daemonettes Aura of Slaanesh. I also hope that 10 power dice plus the power stone are enough to get off some spells if not outright dominate the magic phase. My Lord will roll with one of the Maurader Horseman units and be screened by the Warhounds. I know that this is a really character intensive army but I figure that is good for two reasons: 1) I will have to paint less and 2) I will have to buy less. It would be nice if it was also a viable army and had a chance to win some games. Please give me a heads up as to if I have broken any rules with this list. In addition any comments you have would be appreciated.

Chi
30-10-2007, 06:29
You have way to few rank and file units and far to many points in heroes. Not to mention that your hero choice is illegal. Exalted Daemons take two hero choices. You currently have 4 hero slots and a lord choice...

Get more marauders and or beastmen.

Los
30-10-2007, 07:06
Oh crap guess I read that wrong. I thought I could have 4 heroes and 1 lord. But now when I read it again it looks like I can have a maximum of 4 characters total between 2k and 3k. I will repost with the corrections.

Los
30-10-2007, 07:24
Lord
Exalted Sorceror of Chaos, Lvl 4, Barded Chaos Steed, Staff of Change, Power Stone, MoCU 384

Hero
Exalted Demon, Lvl 2 Sorceror, MoCU, Chaos Disruption 360

Sorceror of Chaos, Lvl 2, Power Familiar, MoCU 170

Special
10 Chaos Furies 150

10 Daemonettes 150

Core
5 Maurader Horseman, Flails, Musician 81

1 Chariots of Chaos 120

5 Warhounds of Chaos 30

24 Mauraders of Chaos, Standard Bearer, Hand Weapon, Shield 154

20 Mauraders of Chaos, Chieftan, Hand Weapon, Shield 130

Rare

1 Hell Cannon 270

Total Points 2000
Power Dice 11 (and a Power Stone)
Dispel Dice 11

Ok think I have fixed my Character problem. Swapped out a demon for another Sorceror. Guess I can wait to run the other one at 3k :cries:. Or I could have dropped the Exalted Sorceror and kept my theme. Oh well. So now I have an extra unit of Mauraders, I also beefed up the original one to 24 and will run the new Sorceror in tha unit. Increased my furies by 2 and was able to get an extra power and dispel dice thanks to the Power Familiar. Now please let me know if I am legal. If so is this any better and do I stand a chance at winning some games? Will my magic make up for my lack of troops or will a lot of people be able to shut it down?

Timk1111
30-10-2007, 11:37
Gday, and welcome to chaos.

Your lord is still illegal. The staff of change can only be given to a model with the mark of Tzeentch. Its stated just above the item description.

Id probably go with a Daemon prince and 2 level 2 sorcs for your character setup.The extra points spent on the Prince give a way better stat boost than the points for the Sorc. He can buy more items, too, and id go for Soul hunger and Blade of the Ether, so he can punch through enemy cavalry. The prince should also give you a healthy option for hunting Dragons and things.

I dont think your unit choices are all that bad at all. Just a few tweaks really. Drop the furies down to 8 (they will do the same job) and get the 2nd unit of Marauders upto 25 as well. 2 big blocks of troops is a great idea.

10 daemonettes wont hold there own on the battle field. Not quite strong enough. You really need 20 to get anything out of em. Id swap em for 5 mounted daemonettes. Almost the same, but you lose 1 rank, have more attacks and are twice as fast. Theyll be great in the flank of an enemy, as well as war machine hunting.

You will also need to find a way of giving your marauders some light armour. Theyll need it in close combat as well as against shooting.

Other than thats, i likes it.

Rergards, tim

Los
30-10-2007, 15:47
Thanks for the info Tim. Man I swear I thought I did a good job reading the codex. I am sure glad these forums exist to straighten me out. Guess I will have to adjust the list again. I will set up my characters as you suggested, although I was interested in Chaos Disruption in order to limit the possibility that my Daemon got shot down, plus the added benefit that it would also affect my Furies if he was attached to them. Is it very beneficial? Also I figured if I kept the Daemon as Exalted he couldn't be picked out of the group if he went with the furies. But you are probably right in suggesting to bump him up to Prince. Given that he is probably the best looking model in the army he deserves it. I wasn't planning on running the Daemonettes head on into anything. I was hoping that their relatively fast movement of 5 would help me get the drop on other infantry and support my Marauders by hitting from the side. Plus I am trying to only buy models I like and I am not very fond of the Nurgle Mounts. Although I am sure it would be better to do it that way. Anyways stand by for the new list, but still feel free to comment on anything I have mentioned strategy wise.

Timk1111
30-10-2007, 21:32
Fair enough with the daemonettes, but the mounted ones will have the drop on EVERYTHING. The foot ones are fine, its just because they are immune to psychology, they cant flee from a charge,so a clever opponent will make sure their flanking days are numbered.

Also, as the daemon prince is a flier, he cant join units, and unit of flyers can never have anyone join them anyway, so upto you. Ether blade and soul hunger will work wonders, and should make up for his lack of strength against larger foes.


Good lcuk, tim

Belerophon709
30-10-2007, 21:57
Also, as the daemon prince is a flier, he cant join units

Incorrect.

BRB p. 72:

"Characters mounted on flying creatures cannot join units. Characters mounted on chariots can only join units of chariots."

A Daemon Prince / Exalted Daemon doesn't count as being mounted on a flying creature - as such he can join units as normal, including daemonettes (mounted or unmounted), although either he (in case of him joining regular daemonettes) or the daemonettes (in case of him joining the mounted ones) will have their movement hampered by his presence.

Timk1111
30-10-2007, 23:22
Oh, good stuff indeed!

Thanks for that one!

Tim

Los
31-10-2007, 02:31
All right good stuff guys, thanks. Glad to have you your help Bel! Now here is my new list:

Lord
Daemon Prince, Lvl 4 Sorceror, MoCU, Master of Mortals, Soul Hunger, Chaos Disruption 540

Hero
Sorceror of Chaos, Lvl 2, Barded Chaos Steed, MoCU 144

Sorceror of Chaos, Lvl 2, Power Familiar, MoCU 170

Special
8 Chaos Furies 120

10 Daemonettes 150

Core
5 Maurader Horseman, Flails, Musician 81

1 Chariots of Chaos 120

5 Warhounds of Chaos 30

5 Warhounds of Chaos 30

25 Mauraders of Chaos, Standard Bearer, Hand Weapon, Shield, Light Armor 185

25 Mauraders of Chaos, Chieftan, Hand Weapon, Shield, 160

Rare
1 Hell Cannon 270

Total Points 2000
Power Dice 11
Dispel Dice 7

Okay I redid the list, crossed my fingers and hoped I didn't make any mistakes this time. Made my Daemon a prince. Got light armor on one of the Maurader units at least. Beefed the other one up to 25. Dropped down to 8 Furies. I added another unit of warhounds to screen the Daemonettes. Thanks for pointing out that fact about them not being able to flee from a charge. For my daemon I guess I will take Lore of Fire and hope for the Sword as I didn't pick up Ether Blade. If he gets to cast that sword on himself he should be a powerhouse. I lost a power stone in this makeover. Also I redid my Dispel Dice because I had the wrong idea about how they were generated. Think I got it right now though. Its got me worried however because I have no spell scrolls and I have fewer dispell dice than I thought I would. Haven't gotten any feedback on magic yet. I was hoping to come out on top in most games and get some spells off for movement and buffing.

Belerophon709
31-10-2007, 08:32
If you're gonna run the troops section of the list like you are, with no marks aside from Slaanesh, I would highly recommend making your DP Slaanesh as well and giving him the following gifts:

-Master of Mortals
-Diabolic Splendor
-Soul Hunger
-Blade of Ether

Mark of Chaos Undivided does nothing for him as he's already immune to psych being a daemon. Mark of Slaanesh gives him the strike first ability, meaning that you get to strike before chargers even, meaning you can employ your DP as a tactical tool as well, especially with Soul Hunger and Blade of Ether.
The Slaanesh lore is probably one of the toughest lores in the game if use correctly. Takes practice to use well though, but once you get there it's just gravy :D

Just a thought.

Los
31-10-2007, 09:57
I was hoping that the MoCU would allow me to re-roll instability tests. Does it?

But your idea about the Slaanesh is cool, I checked out the spells and they do seem very good. Plus the strike first is appealing. I didn't figure I needed it because of his high Initiative but if I understand you right, the MoS strike first is very effective as a counter to charges and may likely discourage anyone from trying to charge a unit he is in.

chaos-nightwing
31-10-2007, 11:25
If u are saying "HE" as the Daemon Prince, He cannot be in a unit! In 2000 pts, hell connon is far too exopansive for the game. In ur army list, the character take up too many points. U need to drop the daemonic gifts of change ur daemon Prince into a lord of Chaos.
Ten demonettes isn't going to do much as if three of them die, they will have to take LD test, make them very easy to run away. This can be easierly achieve with fire ball of other cheap spell. swap the for more flyers of chariots. And gice the other group of marauders Light Armour (LA) too.

Los
31-10-2007, 18:22
I think Bel cleared up whether the DP could join units above. Maybe he can only join other Daemons though? I am not sure. Yeah I read that the Daemonettes are vulnerable to even bow fire. Which I would be more worried about as I would have pretty good magic defense. Was hoping my Hounds could screen them however. Maybe I could drop them though and use the points elsewhere. I saw some interesting lists with few models. Most included knights as the majority of units taken, just units of 5 or 6. Kind of interested me.


*Okay found the answer to my own question. Daemon cannot join mortal unit.:evilgrin:

MarcoPollo
31-10-2007, 19:32
5 mounted demonettes are vastly superior to 10 regular demonettes for the same price.

Also, characters costing more than 350 pts are a waste IMO at 2k.

Think about a beastlord of Tzeetch all tooled up costing ~340 pts. Now that is good value. But a demon prince at 500+ pts, and you are wasting alot of points on one model.

Los
31-10-2007, 20:11
Yeah I was trying to keep model count low. But maybe I won't worry about it too much. Came up with a new list:

Lord
Exalted Sorceror of Chaos-Lvl 4, Barded Steed, Skull of K., Pwr Stn, Mocu-369
Hero
Sorceror of Chaos-Lvl 2, Pwr Fam., MoCU-170
Aspiring Champion of Chaos-Shield, Book of Sec., MoCU-127
Exalted Champion of Chaos-Great Wpn, Helm of Many Eyes, MoCU-129
Core
25 Mauraders of Chaos-Shields,LA,Chief,SB-195
25 Mauraders of Chaos-Shields,LA,Chief-185
6 Maurader Horseman-Flails,Chief,Music-108
6 Maurader Horseman-Flails,Chief,Music-108
Chariots of Chaos-120
Chariots of Chaos-120
6 Warhounds of Chaos-36
6 Warhounds of Chaos-36
Special
8 Chaos Furies-120
4 Minotaurs-Blood Kine, Great Wpn, MoCU-196
Rare
Hell Cannon-Spell Brkr-295

10 PD (+Pwr Stone)
7 DD (1 Dispel)
Ttl Points 2314

Okay for a 2500 point game how does this look? I got room for another unit. I was thinking another block of Marauders, I bigger block of horseman, or another unit of Minotaurs.

Lucky24/7
31-10-2007, 21:16
If u are saying "HE" as the Daemon .
Ten demonettes isn't going to do much as if three of them die, they will have to take LD test, make them very easy to run away. (LA) too.

Mmm intresting .... I always thought they were immune to phicolgy and therefore didnt take panic tests ...... but hey what do i know ?

Belerophon709
01-11-2007, 00:28
If u are saying "HE" as the Daemon Prince, He cannot be in a unit!

Where are you getting this? It just isn't true. He can join units. Period.

@los: Yes, the unit he joins has to be daemonic and must also be of the same "mark". That means you can't stick an undvided prince into a unit of daemonettes or a slaanesh prince into a unit of plaguebearers for example.

Disregards the comment about daemons taking panic tests as well - as Lucky pointed out they are indeed immune to psych and won't be taking panic tests.

As for your latests list:

I disagree with how you've equipped your sorcs. Not going to go into it now.
I'm just gonna say that you should lose the Bloodkine in your mino-unit. For one, he doesn't get 'Look out, Sir!'. Secondly, a standard is better. It adds +1 to your CR. Your Bloodkine gets a 4th attack which may do nothing at all. Of course he can challenge and do what champs do in general, but the downsides outweigh the upsides. Save the Bloodkines for Doombull lists.


Bele

Los
01-11-2007, 01:32
Easy enough Bele. Blood Kine is out and add a Standard Bearer. Anyone have thoughts on left over points? Mentioned I would like to choose from another block of Marauders, Horseman, or Minotaurs. But of course feel free to give other suggestions.

chaos-nightwing
01-11-2007, 10:27
-give ur chariots both MOT for cheap power dice.
-Drop both champs in the M horsemen as the M Horsemen is use more to flee when the enemy charge of to use as flank.
- u might want the give ur aspiring and exalted champ MOT so u can strenten up ur magic and also tzeentch magic is really decent, with missile, trick, prtection and others.
-drop one squad of ur Marauders and make the other full command.
-with all the spare points u might want knights, or some chaos warriors with mabe MOT or MOK to support the srmy since u do not have any really close combating troops. in this way u can use magic to kill, close combatas supports.

Belerophon709
01-11-2007, 10:34
-give ur chariots both MOT for cheap power dice.


Just to continue what he's saying: "....and chariots that will panic constantly and refuse to charge when you need them to."

;)

Los
02-11-2007, 00:43
Yeah I was thinking about the MoT for the chariots, but decided against it just cause I was planning on painting black and they wouldn't really look like MoK. I know they could still have MoK but I like to make my models look like whatever they are representing. Still it is tempting. Bele has a point to though. If I need them to charge a unit that causes fear the MoCU is nice for being able to take two tests if I need to.

Just so I get it str8 what exactly is FC?

i.e. For marauders would that be a Chieftan, Standard Bearer, and Musician?

Belerophon709
02-11-2007, 07:15
Yup, FC stands for 'Full Command', meaning champ, standard and musician.

chaos-nightwing
02-11-2007, 09:38
Why would the chariots panic constantlly when u charge?" and how about my other suggestion? He do need some close combating troops otherwise, he will be flattened since he's not playing tzeentch heavy magic.

Los
02-11-2007, 23:54
I am not totally oppossed to the MoT like I said but still may not go that route. And I have some extra points to get to 2500. Since you think I lack hitting power I could add the Knights you suggested Chaos or more minotaurs. Just not sure which. I wanted to keep the 2 units of Marauders for my center, but if needed I could shave some points here and there. Reduce horseman to 5, hounds to 5, pull out a few marauders and place my heroes in their ranks, etc.. So what do you guys think would fill out this army best.

chaos-nightwing
03-11-2007, 09:01
Sounds good. Write out the list and we shall see it in a more general way so we can fix it up or u know... help

Chi
03-11-2007, 21:10
Yeah I was trying to keep model count low. But maybe I won't worry about it too much. Came up with a new list:

Lord
Exalted Sorceror of Chaos-Lvl 4, Barded Steed, Skull of K., Pwr Stn, Mocu-369
Hero
Sorceror of Chaos-Lvl 2, Pwr Fam., MoCU-170
Aspiring Champion of Chaos-Shield, Book of Sec., MoCU-127
Exalted Champion of Chaos-Great Wpn, Helm of Many Eyes, MoCU-129
Core
25 Mauraders of Chaos-Shields,LA,Chief,SB-195
25 Mauraders of Chaos-Shields,LA,Chief-185
6 Maurader Horseman-Flails,Chief,Music-108
6 Maurader Horseman-Flails,Chief,Music-108
Chariots of Chaos-120
Chariots of Chaos-120
6 Warhounds of Chaos-36
6 Warhounds of Chaos-36
Special
8 Chaos Furies-120
4 Minotaurs-Blood Kine, Great Wpn, MoCU-196
Rare
Hell Cannon-Spell Brkr-295

10 PD (+Pwr Stone)
7 DD (1 Dispel)
Ttl Points 2314

Okay for a 2500 point game how does this look? I got room for another unit. I was thinking another block of Marauders, I bigger block of horseman, or another unit of Minotaurs.

Looking alot better...

brambleten
03-11-2007, 22:56
i always like to see mauraders in a list... they are much easier to kill with blowpipes than chosen khorne knights :D. i personally think that the hell cannon shold be dropped and more actual chaos warriors were put in, due to their amazingness, but its your list

Los
04-11-2007, 02:57
Yeah I like the Marauders. In fact if its legit still I wouldn't mind doin a Archaon list. B4 I redo my current list any thoughts as to what I should add.

Oh and glad to hear you think its looking better Chi.

chaos-nightwing
04-11-2007, 06:53
Firstly. the list is a little weak at magic. Since this is an undivided list, i would say that putting in marks of all gods is always good.
-thinking of giving one of ur hero MOT cna help alot since Tzeentch magic is soooooooo nasty and really useful, also give u a fair amount of magic for support.
-yep i personally agree with bramblatern so i wont reapeat that again
-drop the furies and change them to screamers (6) 198pts
-drop the power stone
-drop the as champ and the 185pts marauders for a group of knights (maybe chosen)
-make the other marauder full command and bust them up to 30 instead of 25.

Try them. beacause ur army again, is laking magic for sopport. The army is also full of meat shields such as Marauders that arent good at combat, which is not what a chaos army should be full of. that's why i say u need Chaos warriors and knoghts. The chosen suggestion might be too expensive in 2.5K but ull see how u go. with the rest of the spare pts. i would say go for some dogs of war. i would put in a slave giant. but its really ur choise.