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Red_Lep
03-11-2007, 02:12
I've been trying to build a decent 1000pt list but I'm having some trouble. I have an idea of what I want but I can't get to how I'd like it.

I was thinking:

Heroes- 171

Captain- 108
~Heavy Armor
~Extra H. Weapon
~Pegasus
**Hunt Warmachines

Paymaster- 63
~Heavy Armor
~Halberd
**Go in Pikemen
.................................................. ............................
Core- 410

Pikemen(19)- 220
~Full Command

2x Light Cavalry(5)- 95
~Musician
~Spears
~Bow
**Harass and March block
.................................................. ............................
Special- 60

Halfling Archers(10)- 60
**Guard Hot Pot
.................................................. ............................
Rare- 50

Halfling Hot Pot- 50
.................................................. ............................
Total- 691

I'm seriously lacking something with hitting power so I might swap the Halflings and Hot Pot to a Giant, good idea? Also, what should I use to back up the Pikemen? Duelists, Ogres, Dwarfs?

All help appreciated.

Stella Cadente
03-11-2007, 02:43
Can DOW take any cannons? it might help against Chariots and enemy war machines

Duelists if I remember correctly can be a good back up unit for pikemen, but I suppose dwarfs would make a good line holding unit

Horn
03-11-2007, 03:35
You can't give your captain an extra hand weapon because he's mounted. A lance + shield would be a better idea.
The paymaster would be more survivable (a VERY good thing, as your whole army takes a panic test if he dies) with a handweapon + enchanted shield, and more survivable still if mounted (but then he won't look so good in your pikemen unit).
The pikemen are reasonable infantry, but pretty expensive. I'd give them heavy armour, and look into taking a bigger unit (difficult at low points, I know, but then maybe you'd be better off with dwarfs), as they're prime targets for missile fire and really need to engage the enemy with at least 4 ranks to be effective.
I'd swap the bows for shields on the light cavalry: 5 S3 BS3 shots isn't even enough to kill a lone wizard with any regularity, and it's a pretty steep jump in points.
The halflings + hotpot are pretty good and nicely thematic.

So what you have is a big expensive block of infantry with a tempting character in it (which will melt instantly if flanked), a cheapish flying hero, 2 light cavalry squadrons, some archers and a stone thrower. Ideally you'd take another 2 infantry units so your pikes couldn't be flanked, but that's way too expensive at 1000 points. I'd recommend first that you get some duellists to screen your pikes, to reduce deaths by handgun, and hopefully redirect some of the less desirable charges, and then either Ironguts or heavy cavalry to help support your pikes against the heavily-armoured troops they can't kill.

Red_Lep
03-11-2007, 13:05
Can DOW take any cannons? it might help against Chariots and enemy war machines

Duelists if I remember correctly can be a good back up unit for pikemen, but I suppose dwarfs would make a good line holding unit

They can take a cannon but its rare and I like the Hot Pot better if its between the two.


You can't give your captain an extra hand weapon because he's mounted. A lance + shield would be a better idea.
The paymaster would be more survivable (a VERY good thing, as your whole army takes a panic test if he dies) with a handweapon + enchanted shield, and more survivable still if mounted (but then he won't look so good in your pikemen unit).
The pikemen are reasonable infantry, but pretty expensive. I'd give them heavy armour, and look into taking a bigger unit (difficult at low points, I know, but then maybe you'd be better off with dwarfs), as they're prime targets for missile fire and really need to engage the enemy with at least 4 ranks to be effective.
I'd swap the bows for shields on the light cavalry: 5 S3 BS3 shots isn't even enough to kill a lone wizard with any regularity, and it's a pretty steep jump in points.
The halflings + hotpot are pretty good and nicely thematic.

So what you have is a big expensive block of infantry with a tempting character in it (which will melt instantly if flanked), a cheapish flying hero, 2 light cavalry squadrons, some archers and a stone thrower. Ideally you'd take another 2 infantry units so your pikes couldn't be flanked, but that's way too expensive at 1000 points. I'd recommend first that you get some duellists to screen your pikes, to reduce deaths by handgun, and hopefully redirect some of the less desirable charges, and then either Ironguts or heavy cavalry to help support your pikes against the heavily-armoured troops they can't kill.

Captain: Didn't see the no E.H.W. if mounted, my bad :rolleyes:

Paymaster: I'll swap him to the shield but I'd rather not mount him cause, like you said, he won't look so good in the Pikemen.

Pikemen: I've always been told that the Heavy Armor was a waste on them. And I was really wanting to go 24+Paymaster but like you said, they are expensive. I'm gunna try and find the point though.

Light Cavalry: Good point, thanks.

Learning how to guard the Pikemen was pretty much the whole reason I posted, thanks for the advice. How would you kit the Duelists? I'm thinkin' I'm gunna take Ironguts.

Thanks guys.

Horn
03-11-2007, 14:09
Well heavy armour will make a difference against everything short of lances, great weapons, and handguns. That leaves a whole lot of things that will kill 1/6th less of your troops for a 1/10th increase in points. I really don't know if it's statistically the most effective use of points, but it's a much better deal than the 1 point light armour costs, which is only useful against S3 attacks. If you had the choice between no armour, light armour, and heavy armour, it'd be a toss-up between no armour and heavy, I think. As you have to take at least light armour, heavy is preferable (in my humble opinion).

With duellists, they're best with either pistols or additional handweapons. If you model them with pistols and a couple of knives each, you should be able to choose which you want them to count as depending on your opponent's army (a one-shot pistol is pretty much a close combat weapon anyway): pistols versus dwarfs, additional hand weapons versus skaven, and so forth.

Red_Lep
03-11-2007, 17:22
How does this look?

Heroes- 199

Captain- 110
~Heavy Armor
~Shield
~Lance
~Pegasus
**Hunt Warmachines

Paymaster- 89
~Sword of Might
~Enchanted Shield
~Heavy Armor
**Go in Pikemen
.................................................. ............................
Core- 536

Pikemen(24)- 294
~Full Command
~Heavy Armor

Duelists(8)- 72
~Pistols
**Meat shield for Pikemen

2x Light Cavalry(5)- 85
~Musician
~Shields
~Spears
.................................................. ............................
Special- 204

Halfling Archers(10)- 60
**Guard Hot Pot

Ironguts(3)- 144
**Back up Pikemen
.................................................. ............................
Rare- 50

Halfling Hot Pot- 50
.................................................. ............................
Total- 989

I realise the Pikemen unit is absurdly expensive but it needs to be huge.

Horn
03-11-2007, 19:07
That seems pretty good. The pikemen are something of a liability but hell playing DoW instead of themed Empire is a liability anyway. Probably not the most competitive of lists, but it's fluffy and reasonably balanced.

Red_Lep
03-11-2007, 19:32
I don't mind it being a liability aslong as its fun and fluffy. Thanks for the help Horn.

brambleten
03-11-2007, 23:03
ironguts are a nice addition
the pikes arent actually that expensive, when you copmare them to 20 saurus with full command at 270pts.
id go for either this list or one with dwarves and a cannon.

Red_Lep
03-11-2007, 23:30
I was wanting to add Wizards as my other two heroes at higher points, where should I put them?

Horn
03-11-2007, 23:38
Saurus do have a rather large advantage in having LD8 and Cold Blooded, and a slight one from T4 and a 4+ save in combat, although obviously they're not as good versus light infantry/cavalry. Plus you can always take 15 of them without making them useless. A closer comparison would be to High Elf Spearmen, who in 6th edition seemed roughly even with pikes, and in 7th make pikes look pretty bad, really.

Not that they're terrible or useless, it's just they're not the easiest unit to use, particualrly at low points.

Horn
03-11-2007, 23:40
I was wanting to add Wizards as my other two heroes at higher points, where should I put them?
Well, in some infantry unit would be the standard choice, but without knowing more about your planned composition or tactics it's hard to say more really.

Red_Lep
04-11-2007, 00:30
I was wanting to have two units of Pikemen working together but Wizards should stay out of battle. In a unit of Crossbowmen maybe?