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The Guy
10-11-2007, 22:43
Combining CSM with IG in the same army? Could I do this? Would anybody have problems with it?
I want to combine some of the [beautiful] renegade militia on FW with CSM who worship nurgle. This would cost a lot though so it's a long way off at the moment.
And I don't have the apocalypse book so would it combining be allowed in smaller normal games of 40k?
Thanks

Torga_DW
10-11-2007, 22:46
Well the easiest way in a regular game would be to have 2 FOCs, 1 for your marines and 1 for your guard. It would require opponents consent of course, so depends on your regulars as to whether you could do it.

catbarf
10-11-2007, 22:48
If you use the Renegade Militia list, you can have a single squad of CSMs in the army, or three if you take a special character.

Aflo
10-11-2007, 22:49
I'd certaintly allow it, provided you did as Torga said: having 2 FOCs and if you asked my consent first.

The Guy
10-11-2007, 22:54
Ok thanks. Looks like I gotta start listing what I need.
Some other questions:
Does the new CSM codex cover death guard? Or does it have and special nurgle gifts?
And could I represent death guard with normal CSM?
And what do you think of using VC zombies for conscripts? :evilgrin:

Reaver83
10-11-2007, 22:56
i'm so tempted to just say 'no you can not do this, this is against the spirit and the word of the game and is evil evil evil'

But actually i wouldn't care, if you wanted to use a mixed FOC, 2 FOC's whatever.

Torga_DW
10-11-2007, 22:57
By death guard you mean plague marines? Plague marines are a troop choice, but thats about as far as it goes. Cult lists are gone, you can have a leader with mark of nurgle, but you can't have a specific plague marine leader.

Normal csm can be given the mark of nurgle, but they won't be specific plague marines as they have specialized equipment and stats.

That'd be cool, but might be a bit of a pain converting all the zombies to carry lasguns. wysiwyg and all that.

Reaver makes a good point. You can do whatever you want entirely and field it, as long as your opponent consents. Doing certain things will make it more likely that your opponent consents. But it always depends on the person in question. For pugs it becomes less likely, but with old friends it becomes more likely. Depends on who you play.

The Guy
10-11-2007, 23:00
But could I count normal CSM AS plague marines? They're cheaper and you get more in the box.

Torga_DW
10-11-2007, 23:04
Ah. Well i don't see why not, but i'm not an authorative source on the matter. I thought about buying plague marines but imo the models are just too ugly, and not in a nurglesque manner, so i passed them by entirely.

MooCow
10-11-2007, 23:05
I would say yes, but only If you paint them to look quasi-death gaurd.

The other cheap thing to do is: Do you have easy off Oven Cleaner? One of my friends at our LGS uses it for stripping paint and found that leaving minis in for an excess of 30 min will leave the Marine looking cracked and Dry, all Nurgly Like:D

But of course I would try,like, one marine at first and not dump the whole box in at once.

The Guy
10-11-2007, 23:09
Thanks for all your advice guys. Now working out how much this is going to cripple me finance wise.

Edit: If I had it a heart it would have just stopped....213!!! Not to mention all the paint and glue! Oh dear. Looks like I can't quit my paper round just yet then...

Bregalad
11-11-2007, 02:06
There will certainly be FW rules for that combo in the second Vraks book. On the other side, it may compromise game balance to just take the best of two different Codices. Try it out.

The Guy
11-11-2007, 11:28
But as long as I've payed the full price in points how would it affect balance?

Bregalad
11-11-2007, 11:47
Well, add three Hammerheads, three Prism tanks or three Falcons to your Tyranids, let the Falcons transport Genestealers and watch the game balance crumble ;)

Sideros Peltarion
11-11-2007, 13:02
Thats not the same thing though, as Eldar and Tau would never ally with Tyranids, whereas CSM and Guard is a logical alliance, so people would be more inclined to accept it.

Aelyn
11-11-2007, 13:11
Maybe try tweaking the FOC, so for example regular CSM squads take Elites slots instead of Troops, and just don't take many (if any!) higher-power models like Terminators, Obliterators and the such. Make it clear that the basic CSM are the cream of the army!

I'd be perfectly OK with you mixing these two armies, as long as a) there was at least a reasonable fluff behind it (as little as "Renegade Guard") and b) you tweaked the lists / FOC to suit said fluff (like I suggested above maybe, no Commissars, etc)

qwertywraith
11-11-2007, 14:00
The old Lost and the Damned PDF is still available. It allowed the mixing of traitor guard (including mutants and plague zombies) with CSM. It's out of date, but the list was balanced. All it would need is some tweaking to reflect the changes to the current CSM codex.

Templar Ben
11-11-2007, 14:26
But as long as I've payed the full price in points how would it affect balance?

Because GW doesn't balance the armies that way.

mistformsquirrel
11-11-2007, 14:31
The old Lost and the Damned PDF is still available. It allowed the mixing of traitor guard (including mutants and plague zombies) with CSM. It's out of date, but the list was balanced. All it would need is some tweaking to reflect the changes to the current CSM codex.

I agree with this. It may not be tourny-legal; but if your friends will let you (just ask them) this is the route I'd go.

In all seriousness, its very fluffy for CSM and renegades to fight together; though especially so if they're Alpha Legion; which in this case it sounds like you're doing Death Guard... still reasonable enough though. Nurgle Traitors aren't uncommon.

And there's the Vraks list as was noted; albiet thats just one unit of Chosen; its still something though.

(Plus their "We are in Disguise" rule is hilarious imho)

Mr Feral
11-11-2007, 14:58
If you use the Renegade Militia list, you can have a single squad of CSMs in the army, or three if you take a special character.

If you take Arkos The Faithless then the 0-1 restriction on Alpha Legion squads is lifted, so not necessarily just three squads.

The Guy
11-11-2007, 18:11
"Maybe try tweaking the FOC, so for example regular CSM squads take Elites slots instead of Troops, and just don't take many (if any!) higher-power models like Terminators, Obliterators and the such. Make it clear that the basic CSM are the cream of the army!"
That's a really good idea! I'd need to run it through with everyone first though.
I had another idea today. I'm going to have renegades riding chaos hounds and treat them as rough riders. This will be a long way of though as I still need to get all the basic stuff.

dcikgyurt
11-11-2007, 19:23
I'd let you use them no matter what. I like the idea of chaos being able to take traitor guard allies. It kinda makes sense on some sick and twisted level, but as most of the guys who've posted before me have said, check with the guys you play with first.

The Guy
11-11-2007, 19:59
As I can't be bothered to open a new thread I'll ask here.
Can somebody please [:angel:] list all the [in their opinion] nurgley type colours GW sells? There's too many to choose from.
Thanks.