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View Full Version : 40k Veteran, Fantasy Beginner: Hordes of Chaos Advice



Lord Icklebum
11-09-2005, 21:14
Okay, so I've finally become a little bored with my 7000 or so points of Imperial Guard and am looking into playing Fantasy.

Since the Dwarves are getting revamped this December I've decided to go with them as my overall army, but in the meantime I want to get a nice 1500-2000 point Hordes of Chaos army, if for no other reason than they look cool.

So seeing as how I'm still fairly new at all of this I'd like to get your opinion on a good basic idea for an army.

I'm currently looking at an Undivided Exalted Champion, possibly mounted on a daemonic steed.

A Sorcerer or potentially a Slaanesi-marked Wizard (hey, if I'm going to play Fantasy I got to use at least some magic).

2 units of 16-20 Marauders, one armed with LA+Shield (because I like the way they look at they've got decent staying power for cheap) and another unit armed with flails (for counter-charges and general flanking with a punch).

At least 1 unit of Chaos warriors, possibly Chosen, in the 12-15 unit count vicinity. I'm going with HW+Shield just because it's so much more visually pleasing and generally more fluffy. They'd be on a large frontage and there to take or dish out a charge and then hold for the Marauders to support. These roles are reversible as well.

6 Chosen Chaos Knights. Undivided or possibly marked with Slaanesh if I chose to take the Wizard. If I mount the Champion he'd be riding with these guys, otherwise he'd probably be with the Warriors.

2 units of 5-10 Warhounds. Cheap screens that are there mainly to die and make sure my infantry gets to where it needs to be in relatively one piece. The biggest problem for me would be price and so, barring some amazing ebay auction, I won't be able to afford that many.

1 smallish unit of Furies, 10ish? They'll play the role that all furies play: To Die. And to take a few warmachine crews or wizards with them.

A Chariot for the general uses a Chariot has. My only complaint is how ugly the older models are.

A Chaos Giant. This is pretty non-negoitable, I fell in love with the big lug the minute I read his rules and snatched up a model for some trade-in. Potentially able to just lay waste to units, also good for laughs.


That's all the basic stuff I had in mind and the operative thing to remember is that I'm not in anyway a WAAC player nor do I want to destroy my opponents mercilessly. In fact my Imperial Guard army was very unorthodox (in that it was balanced) and still managed to win 9/10. My main goal is create a solid, balanced list that will be fun for both myself and my opponents.

The actual models I currently own are

16 Marauders, with HW+Shield
21 Warriors, all with HW+Shield (My friend gave me 9 when I first expressed interest in starting a HoC army.)
1 Champion of the Unmounted Variety
1 Sorcerer
1 Chaos Giant

I'm also interested in Marauder Horsemen, Chaos Spawn, a beastherd and possibly a few different daemons (or daemonettes rather), though I don't want to be tied down to one mark, it's just ruins the flexibility to me. That being said, I enjoy Slaanesh's mark the most and if anything would be inclined to use units pertaining to either the Keeper of Secrets or Papa Nurgle.

Thanks for reading in advance, and any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Icklebum, He of the Silly Name

Hywel
12-09-2005, 00:42
You have a good idea of the components of a chaos army already, just a few points...

Marauder units have to be 25 strong as far as I'm concerned and should always come with the LA and shield combination. These guys are referred to as mobile rank bonus and should by no means consider doing much killing. Combined charge with a chariot or some such is their job.
- I have never seen marauders with flails do anything worth the space on the field. the difference between a 4+ save and nothing is far superior to S5 in the first round of combat...

Chaos warriors are a bit awkward. elite infantry is tricky to use in this edition. A unit of 12 deployed in two ranks of 6 would be a nice support to the 25 strong marauder regiments however.... great weapons or additional hand weapons would be my choice for such a unit, but I agree, shields look better.

Warhounds, my favourites. Unfortunately, they cost a bomb for 6pt models... I like to run 3 or 4 small units. They're great at blocking charges, luring frenzied troops, providing cover from missile fire, flanking... they're fantastic. In my slaaneshi army, they can run and die all they like, nothing else panics.
A place where their use is forgotten is deployment. If you have 4 30pt units of hounds, plus say a spawn, soem furies and a beastherd (as I do) thats 7 deployment slots without showing anything about where your strength lies. Most armies have finished deploying by then... take advantage.

Furies, I'd say 10 is too many. They're only capable of taking on war machine crews and amrch blocking anyway. A unit of 6 or 7 is much easier to keep out of charge arcs, hide from shooting and squeeze into awkward places with. You might find 10 both expensive and difficult to use.

Characters are all personal taste... I'd avoid daemon steed unless you go for a steed of slaanesh: the 20" charge makes up for the added vulnerability. Chaos units are tough but still need to itneract with their characters, so the biggest bang for buck comes from using them in the marauders. I'd not put them in chariots - those things cause enough damage without help.

I'd recommend following your own thoguht of getting a beastherd. Mortals struggle against scouts and skirmishers. 125pts gets you 6 gor and 12 ungor with full command - more than capable of seeing off anything your opponent will have in rough terrain with few exceptions.


Oh, parting words and ones to note:
Mounted daemonettes are the best unit you can lay your hands on. There will be no more nipping round flanks with fast cavalry for your opponent, his fast cavalry will be very dead.

Most of all - take what you enjoy.

Lordmonkey
12-09-2005, 02:04
I'd say break up the furies into 2 units of 5. Daemons don't panic and it'll be far easier to hide them from the enemy while they sneak up on enemy artillery crews, etc...

nice, sort of large-ish units of chaos warriors (12-16) are handy as a solid backbone to the army. Dont be surprised if they panic and run off the table after 3 or 4 casualties though, unoless your slaanesh or undivided, so dont splash out on them too much. Same applies to marauders, except proportionally more (30? ^-^)


A place where their use is forgotten is deployment. If you have 4 30pt units of hounds, plus say a spawn, soem furies and a beastherd (as I do) thats 7 deployment slots without showing anything about where your strength lies. Most armies have finished deploying by then... take advantage.

Yup, i do this a lot with my ghouls, dire wolves etc... in my vc army. 30pts of cheapness that gives nothing away to your oppon ent is the bestw ay to bring your heavy cc unit to bear in the correct places. A cc army that gets surrounded/flanked is screwed - always try to control the battle as much as possible.
Marauder horsemen are good flankers, but mounted daemonettes are SO much better.
Spawns are useful for holding things up that you REALLY dont want getting into the wrong places (heavy flankers?) or for supporting charges - then again, chariots are better at this, but twice the price!

Markconz
12-09-2005, 02:40
I'd say break up the furies into 2 units of 5.

Nice if you could. Unfortunately they are a 0-1 choice. 6-8 is a nice number, 6 if you are Slaneesh of course :) If using Slaneesh then you mght want to get harpies and stick them on 25mm bases.

Lordmonkey
12-09-2005, 02:46
Nice if you could. Unfortunately they are a 0-1 choice. 6-8 is a nice number, 6 if you are Slaneesh of course :) If using Slaneesh then you mght want to get harpies and stick them on 25mm bases.

ack, i forgot ;)

smaller then, at least. i'd say 6.

Neknoh
13-09-2005, 18:56
I say look at the Tactics Consolidation thread for further advice, seeing as you have allready gotten perfectly good tips on what to do.

The only thing I can say about the Wariors is that if you decide to mark them with Slaanesh, give them the Raptorous Standard, Hallberds and Shields.
Trust me, nothing hurts more than them... except for Knights... but the Knights are more expensive

athamas
13-09-2005, 20:09
one thing i have been told [im starting a slaaneshi army] is that chosen knights are a points sink... they get an extra attack yes, but they still die to boltthrowers and the like rater too well,and its better to take another unit of knights...


also chosen warriors with GW and shields rock... they can have a 2+save when reciving a charge, or on the charge lay sown alot of GW attacks.. and have a 3+ save normally, making them rock hard as foot troops!

oh, and slaaneshi magic is cool!

Sanjuro
13-09-2005, 22:46
Judging from your post, I'd say that you already have a pretty good idea about how a Chaos army works. All those options can be quite daunting in the beginning. You will never be able to fit it all into a 2000 pts army, so you need to pick and choose.

Main thing: what type of army do you want to play? An infantry-based horde, elite infantry, cavalry, monster mash or mixed bag? There are other variants, but these are the main ones you usually see.

From what I can gather, you have more or less already settled for a mixed bag. This is good, since it will be fun to play with, will teach you alot about various Fantasy tactics and strategies, and can still be quite 'ard.

Some thoughts just off the cuff:

- Chosen Knights are generally very expensive and too easy to counter to be worth 45 pts per model (more if you factor in command and marks). However, this is not to say they are a no-go. They can be used with great success, and especially versus opponents that are somewhat lacking in the missile department. They are more or less a point-and-click unit (something you should be familiar with, coming from 40k as you do) and you will want to get them into combat with the most expensive unit on the table as fast as possible. Maybe screen them with hounds for one turn - otherwise, it's just a matter of getting the charge (and sometimes you don't even need that!).

- Chariots are invaluable to your infantry. You will find that your ranked units lack that extra oomph that will tip the scales in your unquestionable favour. Marauders are great cheap static CR, but lack the killing power to reliably win combats. Warriors are great killers, but lack the numbers to reliably win against troops cheaper than them (pretty much any infantry in the game). Chariots are what you need in this case - that extra swing that will guarantee a break test with lots of minus modifiers. You need to learn one phrase when playing this game - COMBAT RESOLUTION.

- The support units are where it's at. You have a rock-solid core of tough infantry and smashy cavalry. Ok, now you need the odd bits to counter whatever dastardly plans your opponent will try to use against you. This means flyers, unbreakable spawns (or, as in your case, a Giant), skirmishing beast herds, fast cavalry, hounds, etc. Without your auxilliaries your main regiments are an easy match for a cunning opponent. But with enough units on disruption duty, you will be able to dominate the movement phase - one of the most important aspects of Warhammer Fantasy.

Lord Anathir
22-09-2005, 00:45
i too am looking to start a hordes of chaos army. My first army, is ermmm...high elves. Ive got a few questions to the hordes of chaos pros out there. Particular units that i will include in my army for sure are: one unit of 6 Chosen Knights, one unit of 25 Mauraders, 2 Chariots. 2 units of 5 warhounds, 5 Maurader Horsemen, 6 Furries, beastherd
I am not sure about what else to add to my army. There are tons of options. The units that im thinking of:
Giant (but i dont like his susectibilty to missile fire, especially being a large target and no armor, playing elves i know of easy it is to take something like that down in one turn or so with magic + shooting)
Trolls (really like the models, but dont like how they suffer from stupidity)
Hellcannon (not sure if the rest of my army will be strong enough if i spend to much points on it)
dragon ogres, minotaurs, but they are also pretty succeptible to missile fire.
anotehr unit of mauraders
another unit of horsemen
more warhounds

suggestions? thanx

User Name
22-09-2005, 04:37
As said before marauders do need to be in 25 strong.

chosen warriors should be 12 to cut costs

giants with mutant monstrocity are awsome

6 chosen knights(without charicter this unit is just too many points to risk loosing, which will happen all the time.) are a little steap if you want to have some support units and more flavour. That being said yuo still want more hitting power. I recommend 4 minotaurs with champ and stick, I play nurgle which gives them a 4+ armour save, but they can only have the same mark as your general, just other options you will have to concider.

Magic is risky and large investment and will slim down the number of troops you will be able to have which is bad in chaos.

warhounds are best in units of 5 for reasons said above

beastherds are the best thing ever in a chaos army, 20 with full command for 151

marauder horsemen or centigors for more punch are an option if points are left over

exalted champs on demonic mounts with that sword that gives more attacks for unit strengthin base to base is actually verry killy.