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Flame Boy
12-09-2005, 19:02
I'm just wondering about something. In 2nd edition, Ork Stormboyz were essentially younger Orks who unlike older Orks seemed to have a strange obsession with discipline and training which older Orks generally found quite amusing.

Are Stormboyz still considered as rather odd young Orks going through a passing phase of regimented behaviour, or have they just been altered into being generic Orks that just like strapping dangerous machinery to them?

TheSonOfAbbadon
12-09-2005, 19:47
They're just crazy Orks that got enough teef to buy a rokkit pack. That's all.

malika
12-09-2005, 19:57
Stormboyz could eventually turn to Khorne in the old background, I dont know if they still do that...

GuRu
12-09-2005, 20:00
Stormboyz could eventually turn to Khorne in the old background, I dont know if they still do that...
They don't. Apparently, orks as a whole can turn to chaos... unfortunately.

malika
12-09-2005, 20:03
So the Orks could only turn to Chaos if the whole race turns to Chaos? :wtf:

GuRu
12-09-2005, 20:06
Eh? No, all orks can turn to chaos, not exclusively stormboys.

malika
12-09-2005, 20:15
Okay well that isnt too bad, but the thing was that the StormBoyz would turn more quickly to Khorne or something, which was kind of intruiging.

Flame Boy
12-09-2005, 20:16
They're just crazy Orks that got enough teef to buy a rokkit pack. That's all.


That's somewhat depressing... I was warming to the idea of a Themed Ork army based on Blood Axes with a rather deranged Warboss using a mob of Stormboyz because they were the easiest to convince to join him with their un-Orky traits, but that old fluff seems to have been left out nowadays. It would kinda make sense in the old fluff, but without it, it's just a troop choice.

Not that I would actually make the army, it's just nice to have 1001 concepts for armies floating around in your noggin'. Helps keep you sane at work to spend all day dreaming about making armies you'll never actually get round to starting... :p

Maybe I should stop daydreaming and paint and finish my existing marine army, eh? :D

malika
12-09-2005, 21:12
okay...that was very enlightening :rolleyes:

Personally Im more a fan of the 2nd edition Stormboyz, especially the whole "Nazi with jumppack" look just kicks more ass than the "***** with giant rocket on his back" deal :eyebrows:

acme2468
12-09-2005, 21:36
Well I use that old Fluff about Young orks being more regimented and orderly to explain why my Slugga boys all look so much alike.(I'm using the old plastic goff boys). Accordingly that mob is called "Dem Youngins". My Stormboys I see as more veteran troops.

Khaine's Messenger
12-09-2005, 23:36
Personally Im more a fan of the 2nd edition Stormboyz, especially the whole "Nazi with jumppack" look just kicks more ass than the "***** with giant rocket on his back" deal :eyebrows:

Of course, the fact that this backpack looks like something you'd shoot off on the 4th of July (well, locally at least; I can't really speak for all of you ;) ) really saps some of the suspension of disbelief from the situation. If it was more like the Rocketeer (or perhaps these bozo's (http://www.dp9.com/Products/629.htm)) or a SM jumppack (the old "turbofan" looking ones would look pretty good on Orks, I'd wager), or even a bizarre application of Orkoid gyrocopter tech (not so much like these chaps (http://www.dp9.com/Products/632.htm), but you get the idea) or stolen grav-chutes, or even just throwing them away entirely in favor of bikers, it would go a long way towards me even giving a moment's credence to the idea.

Of course, I'm of the firm opinion that jumppack troops are bunk period! My primary interest in "Stormboyz" is in their rebelliously ordered lifestyles. 'twould be interesting if they retconned it so they were the ones more likely to become 'ard boyz or kommandos (more like their "stormy" Imperial counterparts ;) ) rather than being jumppack goofs--perhaps making the jumppack guys the equivalent of Madboyz.... But eh. *shrugs*

Lord Lucifer
13-09-2005, 01:37
In 2nd edition, Ork Stormboyz were essentially younger Orks who unlike older Orks seemed to have a strange obsession with discipline and training which older Orks generally found quite amusing.

They're just crazy Orks that got enough teef to buy a rokkit pack. That's all.
These two points are not mutually exclusive

Stormboyz are the least Orky Ork you're ever likely to meet.
They like discipline and order, authority, drilling marches, take pride in their appearance, and believe tactics and planning are important. In short, they're crazy.

Proper Orks like to keep a firm footing on the ground so they can give the enemy gits a taste o' the ol' boot levver. Orks take pride in being ded Orky, and no self-respecting Ork would EVER use a jump pack.

This means those strictly regimented lunatics, the Stormboyz Korp, are about the only Orks that would consider using jump packs.


Flame Boy, none of the Ork background's really changed, it's just unfortunate that the 3rd. ed. Ork codex came out during G.W.'s 'Less Is More' phase of Fluff/Rules ration

Instigation
14-09-2005, 04:03
Well it has changed: The orks have gone from been silly comic relief in previous editions to more serious "mongol" horde like barbarians who loot and pillage and what not.

Its mostly their imagery that has changed to be fair, but alot of the fluff with them has also now become much more serious. IMO i prefer orks the way they are now to what they used to be...makes more sense since it is the "grim darkness of the far future" and not the "comic relief darkness of the far future"

Lord Lucifer
14-09-2005, 09:51
Instigation's Post
That black/white simplified comparison really, really trivialises basically everything about the Orks thus far.

They were never really silly. That was mostly through interpretation.

And they haven't really changed, other than to be relatively ignored or viewed exclusively through the context of them being a dangerous distraction in a serious conflict, insofar as current background portrayal goes.


I could, and probably will, go on at great lengths about the Orks and their many virtues
And I'll do so on the 26th of September (NZGT on the 24th and 25th, too much painting and not enough time :()

But suffice to say, though they were always fun and more than a little off-centre, they were never really silly except as a result of personal interpretation

charlie_c67
14-09-2005, 10:11
I'd also like say that the randomness added an enjoyable factor to playing against and (I assume) with them. You could face the same army twice in a row, one time you'd walk right over them, the other you'd get your backside handed to you on a plate. Not many armies can give you such unpredictable games nowadays.

Wiseman
14-09-2005, 10:57
i never versed the old wacko orks, but from what ive heard they were a nice change from the routine butchers of the universe

Instigation
14-09-2005, 11:10
They were never really silly. That was mostly through interpretation.

Thats exactly the way orks are now actually. They can both be interpreted as silly or they can be taken more seriously now and seen as space barbarians.

The way orks were before was silly. I still took them seriously because it is my personal preference to do so and this was also possible due to the fluff written about them from the 3rd person - such as the 2nd war for Armageddon - and it was after reading this which also got me hooked on orks for the first time.

However, every bit of fluff written from the orks point of view or even from alot of the orks source books (forget their names) but things like orks going off into the wild to breed and more specific to this post how stormboyz were young orks that then got wilder with age, well, it just seems silly. They were just a bunch of drinking, brawling and cigar smoking lowlife humans pretty much....geee what race does that remind me of....squats? See the thing that universally changed with ALL the races in the transition from 2nd ed to 3rd ed is that they all became proper alien races insofar as is possible since fluff is still written by humans.

So the orks have changed quite alot since second edition. Their entire image has totally changed, no longer are they basically just savage, drunk green humans, they are now a fully dedicated alien race with their own sense of character and personality. Then ofcourse there is obviously the fluff which while still retaining alot of the slapstick for those who enjoy it now paints the orks as a much more serious and I should say much more appropriate, to the dark age of the 41st millenium, threat.

I would definately like to hear though what your oppinion is of the orks and their virtues and im assuming you mean more specific to 2nd ed?

Lord Lucifer
14-09-2005, 12:09
I believe they've been typecast as violent, unthinking thugs in 3rd/4th edition, that rather than making them more alien they've merely been sidelined into the most human of archetypes, the common bully.

It seems the general consensus nowadays is that they're mindless homicidal automatons with magic pixie dust making their technology work.

Nothing's changed, it's simply that background material hasn't been made available for purchase for some time.

I'll get back to this for sure, and I do appolagise for not having a full response now
And curse you for tempting me with my favourite topic of discussion... curse your black heart! :p

Flame Boy
14-09-2005, 19:59
Nothing's changed, it's simply that background material hasn't been made available for purchase for some time.

I'll get back to this for sure, and I do appolagise for not having a full response now
And curse you for tempting me with my favourite topic of discussion... curse your black heart! :p

Thankyou, consider my black heart cursed! :D

I would imagine the fact that old fluff does not resurface as a warning. Sure, there is nothing yet to contradict the background I have questioned, but with each new piece of backgroun, I would argue that the overall essence of a race shifts subtly. With the direction that 3rd/4th edition Ork fluff heads, it steers subtly away from older fluff. We no longer have Makari the banner-waving Gretchin in the background. Is this because his jokey nature made him out of touch with the newer background, that he seemed a redundant model, or did the little git finally fail his 2+ unmodified dodge save? Sure, you could resurrect the model and I'm sure you could find a use for it in a 4th edition Ork army, or at the least, just make him tag along behind your warboss, but is that what Orks are about these days, or just a fond memory dug up from years ago?

I would prefer to see the idea of squads of Stormboyz parading around the Ork camp for hours on end, but if that fluff still existed, wouldn't there have been a slight trace of it when they released Gorkamorka, with "Yoofs" bunching together and marching around? It seems to have dropped out of the Ork background by this point, unless the player artificially adds that to their Mod's theme, and that is the player's interpretation of the background, rather than the background in general.