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tanglethorn
20-11-2007, 01:31
I'm somewhat new to Fantasy having played it many years ago and then dropping out because there were no players in my area. I'm getting back into it and have almost 1500 points of Lizardmen and 500 points of Dwarves.

WHen a unit has Hand weapons and Great Weapons, is it legal to charge a unit with Great Weapons and then switch to Hand weapons on the next combat phase? For example, on my turn I charge with Great Weapons since I strike first. My opponent loses combat, but does not flee. Then on his turn he continues with the same combat and starts to roll to hit. However, before he starts to roll, can I declare my Troops drop their Great Weapons and switch to their Hand Weapons and Shields? Or am I stuck using the weapon I originally charged with until the combat is over?

I am having a hell of time trying to locate the specific rule.

Thanks.

guillaume
20-11-2007, 01:46
well, the thing is some units can take great weapons and hand weapons. You just pay for more.

However, the way it works is as follow:

You chagre with great weapons. You have your combat, then in that same combat phase (still your turn), your opponent hits back. You CANNOT change weapon then, you must keep with great weapon.

Now assuming that no one flees.

Next turn is your opponent turn. Let say your opponent hit first (better initiative, or won combat previously), you CAN change weapon then and go for hand weapons and shield. Then when your opponent is finished with his combat and you hit him back, you MUST use hand weapons and shield.

There is some flexibility, but not within turns, only between turns.

keep in mind that not everyone has access to great weapon. for the lizzies for example you could have your scar vet with GW and HW and shield, and switch when you need power or protection. you just cant use them together. Does that make sense?

xeolx
20-11-2007, 01:49
Nope, you must stick with whatever weapon option you choose throughout the entire combat. So if you start with the great weapons, then you must use the great weapons till either your troops or the enemy breaks.

tanglethorn
20-11-2007, 02:00
Thanks! That helps.

So does this also mean that Orc Choppas only get the +1 S on the first round of a COmbat? After the combat is over and they start a new combat with another unit they again get the +1 S?

I think I am struggling with GW's definition of a Combat round.

Festus
20-11-2007, 07:50
Hi

p.54 of the BRB details that you have to keep the same weapon during the whole combat engagement. You may not change (There is an exception for Brettonnian characters only, but this is a side phenomenon) the weapons while engaged in combat.

Festus

Elrond
20-11-2007, 08:43
You cannot switch your chosen weapon for an entire engagement, also if the combat lasts after more than one turn (page 54 of the RB). :)

blurred
20-11-2007, 09:01
So does this also mean that Orc Choppas only get the +1 S on the first round of a COmbat? After the combat is over and they start a new combat with another unit they again get the +1 S?

Yup. Orcs with choppas gain +1 S on the first round of each combat they engage in.

Griefbringer
20-11-2007, 09:21
So does this also mean that Orc Choppas only get the +1 S on the first round of a COmbat? After the combat is over and they start a new combat with another unit they again get the +1 S?


Yes.

Essentially, as long as there are enemies continuously in base-to-base contact with a unit, it is in a continuous combat and cannot change weapons etc.

mav1971
20-11-2007, 13:28
I've had it happen where my unit of marauders with flails(+1s 1st round of combat) charged a unit of dwarfs and won. The dwarfs fled and rallied in their turn. I charged and won again. They fled and rallied. Happened 3 times in a row.

ZomboCom
21-11-2007, 19:58
flails are +2s in the first round...

Luisjoey
22-11-2007, 19:31
What about Lances, Knights fight with the lances the whole battle?

(well thinking they count as a hand weapon after the charge as if were swords)

theunwantedbeing
22-11-2007, 19:34
Lances count as lances all through the combat they simply dont offer any bonus after the charge.
If you charged in with a lance and had your steed killed you wouldnt then get the hand weapon and sheild bonus as your using your lance.

Unless you were a bretonnian of course who had a lance and a magical weapon that counted as a hand weapon(or somehow got your magic weapon turned into a hand weapon).

Griefbringer
22-11-2007, 19:38
Unless you were a bretonnian of course who had a lance and a magical weapon that counted as a hand weapon

However, the Bretonnian magic weapon that counts as a hand weapon (Sword of the Quest) requires questing vow, which prevents character from taking a lance, so you cannot have the two on the same character.

Luisjoey
22-11-2007, 19:42
This happens to mounted characters with magic weapons or other weapons and steed, if they charge they use the spear but in subsequent turnos they still use the lance
How i could use a magic weapon?

Griefbringer
22-11-2007, 19:47
If you have a magic close combat weapon, then you have to use it in close combat - you cannot choose to use any mundane weapon instead. Whether you are mounted or not makes no difference.

The only difference are Bretonnian characters with mundane lance and magic weapon, who have a special rule making them to use the lance on charge and magic weapon afterwards.

Luisjoey
22-11-2007, 19:53
A friend of mine that plays High Elves one day TRIED to do me this...

A unit of Elf Spearmen (you know fight in 3 ranks 0.0) then i charge him and he told me that he fights in three ranks and have armour save +4... X.x! he told me that the front guys take a hand weapon (sword) with the shield +4 and the spearmen behind fight with their rank.

This is not valid donīt?

I was thinking about if the spears counts as a hand weapon and if i could use it in combination with the shield for bonus +4 too! Is a hole in the rule?

Griefbringer
22-11-2007, 20:05
Spear is a spear, not a hand weapon.

And the whole unit of spearmen fight with the same weapon, whether that be spear or hand weapon - you cannot have part of the unit fighting with different weapon (at least not without special rules).