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NightLord
04-12-2007, 06:41
Questions and concerns are listed at the bottom.

Lords and Heroes

Alith Anar
=245

Mage
Level 2
Ring of Fury
Silver Wand
Great Eagle
Unit total
=
240

Mage
Level 2
Jewel of Dusk
The seer staff of saphery
Unit total
=
180


Core Troops

20 spearman
Full command
Unit total
=
205

20 spearman
Full command
Unit total
=
205

16 archers
Full command
Unit total
=
201

Special Units

20 Phoenix Guard
Full Command
Unit total
=
330


5 Dragon Princes
Full Command
=
190


5 Dragon Princes
Full Command
=
190


Army total is 1981 points. My main question is what lores of magic should I give my mages. I think that either the lore of beasts or fire magic makes sense for the great eagle mounted one. Because he can maneuver around enemies and blast them or root their cavalry to the spot.

The other one I believe high magic is best in order to give my units in back support magic... Flames of Phoenix on incoming enemies... Curse of arrow attraction to assist my lord and also the ability to help pass break tests using courage of aenrion.

Does this seem solid. My main complaint is that I don't get to take shadow warriors. I just couldn't find the points. They will be the first thing I add when I go to 2500 points. Then sword masters. Thanks to everyone who suggests something.

PrinceElric
04-12-2007, 11:57
Your choice of lores seems well thought out, very solid. But, I don't think your non-mounted mage can have both a Jewel of the Dusk and a Seerstaff of Saphery (they're both Arcane items - so's the Silver Wand, so you couldn't move either over to the mounted mage).

As for Shadow Warriors, a minimum unit of 5x costs 80pts, which you could afford by reducing your Archer unit by 5 (to 11x) and eliminating the command group, which I have found to be rarely useful on Archers anyway...

UltimateNagash
04-12-2007, 13:53
Only piece of Command you really need is the musician, unless you're going to charge, then you take a standard...

Zensunni
04-12-2007, 14:05
Well your mage is Illegal. You have two pieces of arcane items on him. The seer staff and the jewel of Dusk. You cannot have both.

Also, I suggest you drop 6 archers and the full command. 10 archers is fine, if you want 16 thats ok but you do not always get a nice cushy hill to deploy them on then your stuck with a long line of 16 guys or several guys that cannot shoot.

I also doubt very much you will need a great eagle to fly around on with your other mage. This makes him incredibly easy to destroy and take out of the skies. Simple archers can do this. I suggest dropping the great eagle. These modification should give you the points you need for the Shadow Warriors. I fins the SW very useful.

Aranel
04-12-2007, 14:12
It all depends what army you are going to face. you seem to favour a rather offensive high elf army, with little shooting and moderate magic. Choose lores that will assist in the movement and combat phase. mage with the seerstaff could take shadows and select unseen lurker, or beasts with the wolf hunts. Against cavalry amries, gamble with metal and spirit of the forge. I agree you should get rid of the archer command, cut down another couple of models and give the banner of sorcery to someone. you definatly can't take two arcane items unfortunatly. good luck

NightLord
04-12-2007, 23:39
Well here is the reason I have the 16 archers with full command... Although thinking about it... If they are in combat they are not serving their purpose any longer... So I think the change is a good idea... Then I can put banner of sorcery on either my phoenix guard or my dragon princes and a banner of ellyrion for the other unit of DP. I will change the double arcane items... I didn't think of that when I made my army. If he is on a great eagle I can keep him safe I would think... In 40k I was able to keep entire units from getting shot with 12 inch moves only.

"As for command sections spearmen is a must have. The standard and musican can win a combat for you for sure. The archers? thats kinda ify it depends on you I guess. If the enemy wants to try to get some quick victory points with one of his fast moving troop types i.e. flyers, scouts, and fast cav, then having a unit of 16 archers with a full command may make him think twice about going after them. Heres the break down bro, lets say you have your 16 archers in a standard set up of 8x2 formation and you see that the dark elf guy you are playing is about to charge you with his 10 harpies, now since you know that on his next turn he is going to charge your archers you use some of the archers move to break down there formation to a 4x4 block of troops (even useing some of your move to do this you still get to shoot in the shooting phase) and now his turn comes up and he charges you stand and shoot, CRAP! you didnt get any hits. Now with the always strike first rule you get the 4 attacks for the guys in front. CRAP! not one F#%#ing hit. Now the dark elf guy is going to get to attack you back with 6 harpies holy crap the dark elf guys had some awesome luck and hit with all 6 harpies! now out of that 6, 5 wound you are having a bad day man! ok now combat resoultion, the dark elf guy killed 5 of your archers so that means he gets 5 points you got no kills BUT!!! you out number him you had 3 full ranks and a banner! thats 5 for you 5 for him its a tie! BUT wait you gave your archers a muscian so YOU WIN THE COMBAT!!!"
-Argument for keeping full archer command.

EndlessBug
05-12-2007, 00:01
NightLord, firstly, the rules have changed, you now need ranks of 5 to get a bonus, so 15 would be your ideal number in this case. Also, 2 units of 10 each (220) is far more flexable than 16 with fc (191). Harpies will struggle to beat the archers in any case, you're hitting on 4's (assuming short range and u moved or they charge) killing on 4's with shooting, so that's 2.5 dead just from stand and shoot (assume 2) that unit of 6 is now 4, in combat same again but only 6 attacks, 1.5 dead, on averages that's 4 dead out of 6, 2 attacks back kills 1 if he's lucky. End result you slaughter him and still have that other unit of 10 to fire at another target.

I see your reasoning but tbh you should be gearing the combat units for combat and the shooty for shooting.

I would also swap the jewel (as many have pointed out it's illegal) for a scroll just in case you get that 1 REALLY nasty spell.

Your mage will definately die very quickly, unless of course you have spells without LOS requirements. In either case you have absolutely no need for him to be on the eagle anyway, manouverability? your spells have a decent range anyway and you're not going to go charging units with it... I hope.

50 pts from eagle + 91 from the archers = 141 pts to play with.

With this you could:
get
5 Shadow Dancers
Banner of sorcery for the Phoenix Guard
upgrade Jewel to Scroll

that pretty much fixes it out.

as for the lores, I'd suggest high magic most cases with maybe fire/metal/shadow depending on the opponent. Personal pref though. Your choices on lores seem v good!

Xzazzarai
05-12-2007, 00:02
Just the fact that you need FIVE to make it a complete rank for CR.
Archers aren't ment for combat. No armour, no weapons - nothing. Let them do what they do best - shoot. Even if the do get command, that won't help them in combat very much.
Reduce the archer to 10/12, drop the commande and put the points where they can be usefull.
5 shadow warriors perhaps?

NightLord
05-12-2007, 00:32
Thanks guys! Wow... Long time since I last played fantasy... I recall all these rules now of course haha. That seems like a good idea for the archers. I will maybe just take 10 and a bolt thrower. Drop great eagle and use the extra points for banner of sorcery. Thanks everyone! It is much appreciated!

Fate
05-12-2007, 02:47
To be honest, i don't like spearmen, yeah, they look good and strike in 3 ranks, but the Str3 is kinda crappy.
I don't use Special Characters so i won't go on rambling about it but still if going magic, you'd be better off with 4 mages.
Have you thought about 25 points in magic items for chapions? The skinsliver is a must have. No matter what, an advantage to have the first round is more than good.
I haven't done the math (nor will do) for the other units, but the dragon princes with full command cost 200 pts, not 190. 30 x 5 = 150 +20 +10 +20 = 200 pts.
Another point you need to review about your list ;)
For last and really not least! Where are the bolt throwers dude? They are the very core of any elf (wood elves excluded). No Elf is complete without it's tree loobing machine lool.

NightLord
05-12-2007, 13:43
haha! I thought you weren't going to do the math?

I will review that. I am using spreaman because they are core... I don't really like them all that much... But they are better then any other core and they can create a solid wall for me.

I was originally going to go heavy magic but thought it was to many points for probably to little.

Anywho thanks for the advice. I will try and squeeze some bolt throwers in there.

Fate
06-12-2007, 03:07
For magic i bring a heavy load of it, and by heavy load i mean an average of 15 power dice plus the ring of fury and ring of corin. Now that's a pain in the ass for most players to handle.

Also IMO i think you overrate your spearmen, yeah they are a block, yeah they might even survive if lesser units dare to aprouch them, but really, the core units suck big time, so with a couple of archers you have the minimum needed and wasting as little points as possible.

NightLord
06-12-2007, 04:02
I would feel like an unfair opponent if I did not include core units... Although in the army book it says the militia are only used in times of dire urgency. Just feel like a terrible person haha. I am not a big fan of the spearman and archers but I think that they may find uses... I will consider removing one of the blocks of spearman though. Because I really hate putting them together... (Gotta love metal models that don't take hours of your day to position correctly... Basically painting is fun haha.)

I will rewrite my army list and edit it into this post when I get a chance... This should free up some points for cooler units.