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stashman
06-12-2007, 07:42
Not being very familiar with the O&G, why are you only rerolling 4 of the attacks? Frenzy and Hatred on a rider should both effect the mount as well wouldn't they? I thought they would both get +1 attack and reroll all misses on the first round.

Does hatred affect both rider and steed just like frenzy?

WLBjork
06-12-2007, 08:14
It does indeed.

stashman
06-12-2007, 22:14
Thanks for your answer.

Anaris
06-12-2007, 22:53
Which will hopefully be changed in 8th ed.

T10
07-12-2007, 10:48
Actually, ruling that these psychology rules affect the entire model solves lot of issues. Should you take Panic tests for the Dark Elf if the Cold One mount goes stupid? Can the mount restrain pursuit when the rider is freinzied?

If the whole model is subject to the same pschology rules then these problems go away.

-T10

Fulgrim's-Chosen
07-12-2007, 18:06
Agreed ! (To T10)

Plus...selfishly...hehe....it makes Daemonic Chariots of Khorne w. Double Juggernauts the most devastating Chariots in the game on the charge w. D6+1 STR-5 Impact Hits...followed by 10 (TEN!) WS-5//STR-5 "regular" attacks.

Good ol' Frenzy n' 7th Edition !

Arnizipal
07-12-2007, 19:58
Actually, the Mark of Khorne doesn't grant frenzy to a steed. It even explicitly forbids it.

theunwantedbeing
07-12-2007, 20:11
The daemonic chariots dont have the mark of khorne, they simply have the rule "frenzy".
Your thinking of mortal chariots.
Although without prior knowledge of the daemonic legion and its "quirks" its an easy mistake to make.
The same is true for daemons with the mark of khorne, the frenzy will benefit the mount of that daemon as the rules for daemons with the mark of khorne were not written with the intent of daemonic character's getting to ride any form of mount.

But otherwise the mark of khorne "frenzy" isnt as good as the frenzy that everyone else gets.

chivalrous
10-12-2007, 20:23
In answer to the Original post, the answer is Only if the rider is a character.

The rules for frenzy on page 52 state
states Frenzy affects both riders and their steeds
However
and it is a big however,

The only mention of a steed getting hatred from a rider is not in the psychology section but in the characters section under Mount's Psychology: Immunity to Psychology or Panic, Hatred, Frenzy, Stubborn, Unbreakable on page 79.

If either the rider or the steed is subject to any of these rules, the whole combined model is

As an example, a Cold One ridden by a Dark Elf character would be subject to Hatred (of High Elves) BUT a Cold One ridden by a normal Cold One Knight wouldn't be subject to Hatred (of High Elves) because it's rider isn't a character.


No, I don't understand it either, but at the moment Hatred cannot be given to a rider by a steed or vice versa unless the rider is a character.

If anyone has anything to quote from an official (e.g. FAQ) source quoting otherwise I'd be happy to hear it, I'd love for my Dark Rider's steeds, Chariot's Cold Ones and Cold One Knight's Cold Ones to re-roll their hits against High Elves.

theunwantedbeing
10-12-2007, 21:49
Page 79.
If the rider or steed is subject to any of these rules (meaning hatred,frenzy,whatever) Then all parts are affected.

The errata the GW site backs me up on this.

chivalrous
10-12-2007, 21:55
Page 79.
If the rider or steed is subject to any of these rules (meaning hatred,frenzy,whatever) Then all parts are affected.

Yep, that's exactly what I've said. But it's in the 'Characters' section, not the psychology section.

Frenzy is clearly mentioned as affecting both rider and steed (regardless of whether the rider is a character or otherwise) in the psychology section, but there is no mention of the same for hatred in the psychology section.
The only mention of hatred being shared by mounts and riders is in the characters section.

The original post wasn't specific about whether the rider was a character or otherwise.

chivalrous
10-12-2007, 22:35
Shiny! :D

I'd not seen that. Cold One Knights just made a return to my rosta.

knightime98
24-12-2007, 06:45
The GW errata is indeed very foggy. They did not answer as usual the question at hand in a simple straight forward way. They elude to the idea that mounts will benefit from a riders hatred but explicitly mention a (mount and character) right when they mention hatred. They also put the word, "OR" in the sentence... Meaning Cavlary, Chariots - then they add - OR a mount and character...

They can never make things easy can they. I would love to be on their FAQ team so that they would ANSWER the freaking question! Point blank without and, but, therefore, too and so on...

Templar_Victorious
25-12-2007, 14:26
Taking into account that a Warrior Priest makes the whole unit hate the enemy, their is another little quirk. Easiest would probably be to give the WP's horse hatred, but the hatred affects the entire unit, even though only the WP is a character.

That's only if the WP is mounted, of course.