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forthegloryofkazadekrund
11-12-2007, 08:36
belakor and the bloodcrushers charge a high elf bolt thrower like so

bloodcrusher = bc
belakor = bb
elf = e

BC.E
BC.E
BC.BB

the elves get the snot kicked out of them and all die, belakor decides to stay where he is and overrun with the bloodcrushers - because he has to -, the question which came up last night was can he go through belakor with the bloodcrushers on the overrun move of do they have to stop when they hit him, i think he cant because you cant move through your own men and it says they move straight forwards

DeathlessDraich
11-12-2007, 09:48
belakor decides to stay where he is and overrun with the bloodcrushers - because he has to
Which? I know he has to pursue :p


the question which came up last night was can he go through belakor with the bloodcrushers on the overrun move of do they have to stop when they hit him, i think he cant because you cant move through your own men and it says they move straight forwards

"he go through belakor"??
The rules have been interpreted in 2 ways:

1) An overrun move is to move "directly forward as if they were pursuing ... to their front". - an unfortunate copy of the 6th ed rules.
Therefore units in multiple combats overrun straight forward, *stopping if they encounter friendly units*.

In your scenario, both units have to pursue in perpendicular directions. If the first unit (*biggest US* - BC) does not overrun far enough it will block the second unit's (Belakor's) overrun move.

2) An overrun move is a "special pursuit move". Therefore the units electing to pursue/overrun will *all* do so in the direction determined by the unit with the highest US - diag 43.1.

I use (2) because (1) only works by borrowing rules from 'pursuit' - the bit between *...*. Therefore all pursuit rules should apply with the exception of 2 overrun rules. (charging and auto restrain).
i.e. in your scenario BC and Bel overruns to the right.

T10
11-12-2007, 11:13
By raw you move pursuers one unit at a time, starting with the unit with the highest Unit strength. If executed strictly in this manner then units that engaged the same enemy from different sides will be pursuing in the same direction and tend to get tangled up in each other.

Around here we have come to a gentleman's agreement that during movement of pursuers the units models that were involved in the same combat will not obstruct each other. We typically roll for pursuit for each unit and then move them to final positions that seem natural. Units that roll high are naturally moved first as give the slower units more room.

-T10

Makaiju
11-12-2007, 13:46
Sooooo…. Here is my question about this (I’m sorry for bringing something up while knowingly not having the rule book at my side).

Isn’t this all specifically covered in the rules?

Under the flee and purse rules, doesn’t mention about moving through friendly units with no problem?

Don’t the rules even talk about movement that ends your unit inside of another of your units?

Again, I can be wrong but I believe that over run is just an extended pursuit rule. So it should have the same basic movement rules as a regular pursuit. (I.E. no exception listed, then default back to the pursuit rules.)

theunwantedbeing
11-12-2007, 14:35
You persue from the highest unit strength first?
Where is this rule?
I cannot seem to find it.

Either way, in that situation the bloodcrushers would immediately halt when they reached belakor as you are not allowed to move through your own troops.
So if you want to overrun then its a good idea to let be'lakor overrun as well otherwise he will be in the way.

Although as flying troops can move over interposing troops, if the situation was reversed then be'lakor would be able to overrun over the bloodcrushers as he can fly(and thus move over friendly troops).

The only time you can move through friendly units is while fleeing, and that tends to cause panic tests.

DeathlessDraich
11-12-2007, 15:52
it's on pg 46

forthegloryofkazadekrund
11-12-2007, 16:13
You persue from the highest unit strength first?
Where is this rule?
I cannot seem to find it.

Either way, in that situation the bloodcrushers would immediately halt when they reached belakor as you are not allowed to move through your own troops.
So if you want to overrun then its a good idea to let be'lakor overrun as well otherwise he will be in the way.

Although as flying troops can move over interposing troops, if the situation was reversed then be'lakor would be able to overrun over the bloodcrushers as he can fly(and thus move over friendly troops).

The only time you can move through friendly units is while fleeing, and that tends to cause panic tests.


i thought that they would have to halt because belakor was in the way as you cant go through your own troops

thanks for the clarification :)

EvC
11-12-2007, 17:12
2) An overrun move is a "special pursuit move". Therefore the units electing to pursue/overrun will *all* do so in the direction determined by the unit with the highest US - diag 43.1.

I use (2) because (1) only works by borrowing rules from 'pursuit' - the bit between *...*. Therefore all pursuit rules should apply with the exception of 2 overrun rules. (charging and auto restrain).
i.e. in your scenario BC and Bel overruns to the right.

I'm sure the rules for over-running specifically say that the unit must moves straight forward, thus also granting an exception to the usual pursuit rules about pivoting before pursuit.

T10
11-12-2007, 21:00
p43

-T10