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Twaun007
18-12-2007, 23:05
I know that this subject has been posted once before, but I could not locate it within the archives.

So, if possible could one of you archival servitors bring up the information.

examples would be....
999.m41, 687.876.87, etc....and how they are interpreted by time, day, month , year, century, millennium?

-Twaun007

The_Patriot
18-12-2007, 23:09
he Imperium has developed its own method of recording dates, which needs a bit of explanation. Most importantly, the years are "Anno Domini", so the dates themselves are the ones that we are familiar with now. A typical date as Imperial scholars write it would look something like 0123456.M41. Let's divide this code up to explain each part:

Check 0
Year Fraction 123
Year 456
Millennium M41

Check Number

The check number refers to the accuracy in the date, with 0 being the most accurate and 9 being the least. Class 0 or 1 refers to events that occurred in the Sol system, with each increasing number being a further degree of separation from Terra.

Year Fraction

For record-keeping, each year is divided into 1000 equal parts, numbered 000-999. Note that this is not generally used by Imperial citizens, but is simply for administrative use.

Year

This is the year within the millennium, running from 001-000. For general dates, often only the year and millennium (below) are included.

Millennium

This is the millennium in which the event occurred. Most "recent" events in the Warhammer 40K universe occur in M41, or the 41st millennium. An event in the present (as of 2007) would have occurred in M3.

Link (http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Imperial_Dating_System)

Brother Siccarius
19-12-2007, 03:25
Now the harder part is actually finding the dates in the more recent Fluff.

Lord Damocles
19-12-2007, 12:19
Now the harder part is actually finding the dates in the more recent Fluff.

999M41. What more do you need?:eyebrows:

Lord Malice
19-12-2007, 12:34
You can even keep the date current with our own, which would make the current Imperial date roughly 0.972.007.M42

Mechanicus
19-12-2007, 15:27
Though, of course, the date isn't universal across the Imperium. Some areas are behind Terran Standard, others in front.

warmaster_dan
19-12-2007, 15:32
The imperium also doesn't use months, instead just using a number from 1-365 to identify the day

honsou3
19-12-2007, 19:31
Millennium

This is the millennium in which the event occurred. Most "recent" events in the Warhammer 40K universe occur in M41, or the 41st millennium. An event in the present (as of 2007) would have occurred in M3.

Link (http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Imperial_Dating_System)

Wouldn't the current date be M2?

imperial_scholar
19-12-2007, 20:03
Wouldn't the current date be M2?

No
Warhammer 40,000 <- the game name 40,000 being the AD year
All imperial Records go up to M41.
It's the same thing that in 1990's (or 1900's) Fox was '20th Century Fox' althought it was 1900's.

So we're in the 3rd Millennium. 2000-3000 (or 2999.9999999999).
The 2nd was 1000-2000 (or 1999.9999999999)
The first Millennium was 0-1000 (or 999.9999999999).

If your a programmer.. it's the same way that the first Array Starts with 0.

Mechanicus
19-12-2007, 20:09
The imperium also doesn't use months, instead just using a number from 1-365 to identify the dayNot officially anyway. There are examples (Siege of Terra) where months are used, but I concur that generally, for example, right now (using GMT) would either be day 353 or year fraction 965 of 007.M3, with the year fraction used in official papers, and the day for everyday usage. :p

Oh, and I've just noticed:
For record-keeping, each year is divided into 1000 equal parts, numbered 000-999. Note that this is not generally used by Imperial citizens, but is simply for administrative use. A very small point, but it's 001-000 following the gregorian calendars tradition. ;)

Lord Malice
19-12-2007, 21:22
Oh, and I've just noticed: A very small point, but it's 001-000 following the gregorian calendars tradition. ;)

lol


For any date which uses colloquial time keeping it is usual to put a check digit of 9 and miss out the year fraction.

Wintermute
20-12-2007, 06:49
So we're in the 3rd Millennium. 2000-3000 (or 2999.9999999999).
The 2nd was 1000-2000 (or 1999.9999999999)
The first Millennium was 0-1000 (or 999.9999999999).


Err no

There wasn't a year zero in the dates are

1-1000 - 1st Millennium
1001- 2000 - 2nd Millennium etc

So where are we if we use the dating system used by the Imperium of Man?

M3?

NO we are not, because this assumes history began in 1AD or 1CE. We have just ignored everything which happened BEFORE 1AD/1BC ie all of history dated BC or BCE :eek:

IncubiLord
20-12-2007, 09:08
Actually, the 3ed BGB explicitly states that RL years 1001-2000 would be an M2 suffix (see page 269 if you've got it). Apparently a lot of the BC years are either unimportant or use a negative M-value (there's 1000 years before 1 AD that use the zero M-value, too). ;)

The_Patriot linked to a fairly good reference, though whoever copied it made the mistake of saying that the year-fraction starts at 000 when the 3ed BGB says the year-fraction starts at 001. 000 is 1000 in the Imperial dating system.

The book also has a couple examples where they literally break down a given date (let's use 0123456.M41 again here) and write it out in what we would consider the normal (year) format.

Our example is in the year 40456 AD.


The year-fraction is a bit odd, since it essentially divides the year into 8.76-hour parts, but they note that it's not supposed to be common use and I suppose it makes as much sense as 12 unevenly-sized collections of 28-31 days.

Our example date would be 44.53 days into the year, but less than 44.895 days into the year (that's the 8.76-hour difference and taking into account that the GW date starts at 1) - indicating that it is the afternoon of February 14 (between 12:43 (pm) and 21:29 (9:29 pm)).


The check-number is a little more complicated than they indicate on that site, too.
0-1 is indeed the Sol system.
2-5 are the steps away from contact with the Sol system at the time the date was established (2 means that this planet was in contact with Sol, 3 means contact with a source that would be a 2, and so on).
6-8 indicate that the system was out of contact with any of the lower numbers for less than a year, up to a decade, or more than a decade, respectively.
9 indicates an approximation.


So, our example time/date is:
The afternoon of February 14, 40456, sometime between 12:43 and 21:29, with what would be considered to be complete accuracy to Earth-standard time.



If you really want to calculate the date from a GW expression:

Break the date (CFFFYYY.MM) into the chunks C - FFF - YYY - MM

* Subtract 1 from MM and multiply by 1000.
We'll call this result millenium (guess why).

* Divide YYY by 4 to determine if it's a leap-year.
If the answer has a decimal point, use FFF minus 1 times .364 for the day, otherwise use FFF minus 1 times .365. Round up if there's a decimal (but write that decimal down) and figure out what day that number is on the calendar (day 45 is February minus 31 for January = 14). If YYY and/or DDD is 000, use 1000 instead of 000.

YYY is the year (replacing 000 with 1000 if appropriate), and the number you just calculated is the day (which you hopefully translated to the month and the day instead of leaving it as the ???th day of the year).

* The fraction from the last step, times 24 (ignoring this result's fraction, but again, write it down), is the hour (in military-time - 1:00 pm is going to come out as 13:00). Translate it for a 12-hour clock if you'd like.

* The fraction from the last step, times 60, equals the minute.

* Combine the above for a year, date, and time.
Millinnium + Year = year.
The Day calculated is the month and day of the month.
Hour + Minute = time of day.

* The resulting time is the last 'tick' of the clock, so to speak - the next number available for use is 8 hours and 45.6 minutes later. Thus, the actual time can be the number above or anything up to 8 hours and 45.59999 minutes later.


If you follow the above instructions, you should get the results that 0.001.001.01 is the first 8.76 hours of January 1, 0001 AD and 0.000.000.20 is the last 8.76 hours of the year 2000 (in December, of course). These would be, according to the 3ed BGB, the correct corresponding times.

Wintermute
20-12-2007, 17:49
Thanks for the indepth explanation.

I'll dig out my copy of the 3rd Ed BGB and have a look.

schoon
21-12-2007, 02:37
You can also find an in-depth explanation here (http://www.scholaprogenium.com/calendar.html).

LordXaras
21-12-2007, 10:48
So where are we if we use the dating system used by the Imperium of Man?

M3?

NO we are not, because this assumes history began in 1AD or 1CE. We have just ignored everything which happened BEFORE 1AD/1BC ie all of history dated BC or BCE :eek:YES, we are, because the Imperial calendar is based on the christian one. Why history would enter into it I can't understand.

EDIT:

Actually, the 3ed BGB explicitly states that RL years 1001-2000 would be an M2 suffix (see page 269 if you've got it). Apparently a lot of the BC years are either unimportant or use a negative M-value (there's 1000 years before 1 AD that use the zero M-value, too). ;)

1BC-1000BC = M1, the first millennium.
1001BC-2000BC = M2, the second millennium
2001BC-3000BC = M3, the third millennium

The Imperium doesn't need to count further back, and if it did, what would be the problem of using negative values? I don't see how anything is made unimportant.

IncubiLord
21-12-2007, 23:55
You can also find an in-depth explanation here (http://www.scholaprogenium.com/calendar.html).
Again with a little disagreement between the site and the 3ed BGB on whether dating starts at 000 or 001, but it's pretty decent.

1BC-1000BC = M1, the first millennium.
1001BC-2000BC = M2, the second millennium
2001BC-3000BC = M3, the third millennium
Not to be a pedantic, but you seem to have switched BC and AD around.

AD is the current standard, with BC essentially being the negative values of AD (give or take a human lifetime ;)).

The Imperium doesn't need to count further back
Mankind lost interest in the dinosaurs, evolution, and all the pre-historic stuff? 40K is an even more depressing time than I thought.

and if it did, what would be the problem of using negative values? I don't see how anything is made unimportant.
The joke is the idea of having negative millennia when dealing with the 'first' millennium and so forth:

"The zero-ith millennium, that ended with the beginning of that Christianity thing..."

"And way back in the negative millennia, large lizards ruled Terra...."

It just sounds silly.

Sebastian Thor
03-01-2008, 02:52
See my sig. ;)

People are right in claiming this to be the 3rd Milenium. After all, it's the 21st century.

1-100: 1st Century, 1st Milenium
101-200: 2nd
801-900: 9th
901-1000: 10th
1001-1100: 11th Century, 2nd Milenium
1101-1200: 12nd
1901-2000: 20th
2001-2100: 21st Century, 3rd Milenium

It's still the "2000's", but the 21st century. After all, there was a century of years before we got to the "100's".

As for why they would use this callendar in the 41st Millenium, I would imagine that no-one really knows where it came from, having been lost in the depths of time. But noone can be bothered to change it, as it seems to work.

Colonies might have local callendars that work from date of colonisation, but interstellar time works as the Earth dictates dammit!

chromedog
03-01-2008, 04:33
AD (year of the tyrant*) may be the common usage, but where I am we use CE (Common Era) and BCE (Before Common Era) - I tend to hang around with practical science types. It is the 3rd Milennium CE. According to our political lords and masters, though, they wish it to be still back in the 2nd (both the guy who lost the election and the new guy pine for a 1950's world, but I digress.

I have the original article from Chapter Approved back in the late 80s and it is as The Patriot says there.

Still, that's RT for you. GW can't even keep their made up universe consistent.


*Yes, I know this is but one interpretation of the words Anno Domini. "Year of our Lord" is another. All are still interpretations.