View Full Version : 2000 Brets vs ogre kingdoms

28-12-2007, 20:49
To be fair, my opponent didn't want to play against my brets but did to be nice. I haven't used my brets for a long time, and really wanted to get the dust off.

This was my list:

Prophetes lvl4 w/ chalice of malfleur (245) *heavens*
Damsel lvl2 w/ horse (115) *life*
Damsel lvl2 w/ horse (115) *life*
Damsel lvl2 w/ 2 dispell scrolls (150) *beast*
ASB paladin (74) (Remember that brets get an extra character)

8 KoTR w/ FC (216)
8 KoTR w/ FC (216)
8 KoTR w/ FC (216)
9 KE w/ full command and errantry banner (221)
21 Skirmishing archers w/ villein (152)

5 Peg knights (275)

Total: 2000

His list was something like:

Tyrant w/ thundermace
brusier w/ tenderiser
butcher w/ 2 dispell scrolls
butcher w/ 2 dispell scrolls

4 irongut w/ full command *tyrant*
4 irongut w/ full command *brusier*
4 bulls *butcher*
4 bulls *butcher*

2 leadbelchers
2 leadbelchers

The terrain was a mix of forrest but pretty open in the center.

He deployed with the leadbelchers on either flank and then the ironguts behind the bulls.

Since my mounted mages had those nice life attack spells that require line of sight I didn't start them in units and hide them behind some trees in my center in which were my archers and other mages. On the right I had a unit of KoTR with my ASB, and on the left I had my other three lances with the general in the center unit and the KE on the left, and the pek knights to the left of them.

I planned to hold him at bay with the lance on the right while I hit him with magic and arrows and then smash the other side with three lances and the peg knights helping with flank or rear charges.

The game started with my brets praying.

The ogres took first turn and moved up slowly and carefully. Thanks to the fact that I had 8 dispell dice to his 6 power dice I was shutting him down pretty good until he got irresitable force and force the lone lance on the right to take a panic test. They failed and ran off the board :wtf: His shooting didn't really come to anything.

On my turn my mages moved out to blast the leadbelchers on the right (I had to protect that flank somehow...), the peg knight moved up on my side of a forrest so next turn I could charge if he moved up or I could move behind him, and my knights moved up to be about 14 inches away. I got both my life spell off on the leadbelchers but they were stopped by dispell scrolls. The only things he didn't stop was me turning my vellein into a bear, and letting my archers reroll tohits of 1. With that my archers shot at the leadbelchers and caused 1 wound. (Yes! I'm totally retaking that flank...)

Turn 2 he declared a charge against my knights and I laughed and said I would hold, then stopped when I saw he was only couple of millimeters away from getting the charge off :eek: His leadbelchers moved up as did the rest of his army. I made sure to shut down his magic phase (even used a dispell scroll) The leadbelchers on the left opened up on my generals unit and did 2 wounds to themself and only one knight fell. His other shooting didn't do anything.

On my turn I declared a charge on the leadbelchers with my KE, the irongut behind them (with bruser) with my generals unit, and my other unit charge the bull unit that had failed the charge. The angle would have meant a flank charge. The bulls ran and I caught them running into his other ironguts with his tyrant. After moving my units I was reminded I had to take fear tests, and with a nervous hand I rolled but everything was fine. My mounted mages went into the trees. My peg knights flew behind him to be ready for next turn and we went to the magic phase. My life mages were dispelled with dice and scrolls and I didn't cast with my other mages because I wanted to keep my champ as a bear, and my archers rerolling 1's to hit. It was then I was told it wasn't a remains in play spell (damn it!). My archers tried to hit the leadbelchers but it was all a waste.

In combat my KE smashed into the leadbelchers, killed only 1, but with no wounds back I ran him down and into the unit behind to help the general. The bruiser made a challenge and I accepted with my vallant. I did 1 wound to him and he did 2 back that turned into 3 wounds. My other knights killed 3 ogres and he killed 1 KE with his gut lord. He ran and I caught him. In the other combat there was no challenge and so after I killed 1 ogre, he told me that he had the thundermace and brought it down killing 2 knights his other ogres also killed 2 knights. I lost by 1 and ran but made it away by 1 inch.

At this point he game up. Things were looking goo for him at the start but it was quickly turning around.

So glory to the Bretonnians. 25-4-4 :skull:

28-12-2007, 23:21
he told me that he had the thundermace and brought it down killing 42knights
Now thats impressive! :D

Nice going, though not exactly a surprising result. Not the strongest OK list I've seen :)

28-12-2007, 23:36
Now that would have been good... :)

(Fixed now)

He would have killed more than 2 easily but rolled terribly for his partials.

Jack of Blades
31-12-2007, 10:13
Don't think you can turn your villein into a bear >_<

Great Brep.

31-12-2007, 13:24
Harsh game for the Ogres, not a suprising result though. What turn did you get to, 3?

31-12-2007, 16:29
Have enough problems as it is with my armies against the Bretts, not sure what OK would have to do to win, especially with all that magic...

31-12-2007, 17:39
EvC: Not even... just the end of turn two.

FatOlaf: I actually found that ogres can do very well against brets. The brets needing to pass a fear test to charge can really ruin their day fast, and if they have enough gnoblars they can bait/absorb/control the charge enough to counter them.

warlord hack'a
04-01-2008, 19:43
I think that adding some gnoblars to an ogrs list is always good. People somehow think that gnoblars are a waste of points, well them consider them waste! I'd rather have a lance run down 40 points that do not cause panic in nearby ogre units, than 105 points that can cause panic in nearby ogre units. Gnoblars give you diverters, missile fire soakers, rank bonus and deployment choices for only 40 points! maybe this will convince some OK players:

take three naked bulls, they cost 105 points. Now they charge a unit of 20 gnoblars, costing 40 points. The gnoblars will have sensibly moved far enough forward to avoid impact hits. Now first the gnoblars can sharp stuff the ogres but let's forget that. Ogres attack: 9 attacks at 3+ gives 6 hits, S4 vs T3 gives 3+ to hit, so that's 4 dead gnoblars. Hey, the combat is a draw as the gnoblars have +3 ranks and +1 outnumber.

So even versus simple gnoblars ogres need a bellower, or extra hand weapons, or a flank to win combat when they charge. And the gnoblars have no less than 65 points left to spend on other things..

05-01-2008, 02:21
So even versus simple gnoblars ogres need a bellower, or extra hand weapons, or a flank to win combat when they charge. And the gnoblars have no less than 65 points left to spend on other things..

Heh, if anything hack'a, your example only proves that Ogres are more of a liability in an Ogre Kingdom army then Gnoblars. Poor Ogres...

As for the battle report... Didja really need four wizards? In a Brettonian army of all things?

05-01-2008, 20:34
Would you rather I took 3 more lances?

I didn't think so ; )

Sergeant Uriel Ventris
05-01-2008, 20:57
I thought that Bretonnians could only use spells from two lores. I started with them and downloaded the cards off of the GeeDub site to make some nifty props for my games. I know they can use beasts, but I thought they only had one more. And I think it's life, not heavens. Maybe I'm crazy, but could someone check their book and let me know what's up?

I don't know why everyone is so afraid of Bretonnians in general. It really depends on the player, I think. My buddy, who is not very tactically-minded can easily get overwhelmed by my Orcs and Goblins. Then again, I field lots of fast-moving flank chargers like Squig Hoppers and Spider Riders. I have, however, not really heard many good things about Ogre Kingdoms. Which is a shame because the minis are awesome. I was thinking about making a Gnoblar horde once after I read the article in a White Dwarf a while back... you know, when White Dwarf was interesting and fun.

06-01-2008, 20:20
The hero level can only have life or beast, but the lord level can also pick from heavens.

People just generally hate brets. The main problem people have is that they don't take throw away units and then they get smashed. Kind of like getting smashed by magic because you didn't take any dispel scrolls.

Most experienced players don't have a problem with brets.

warlord hack'a
07-01-2008, 15:17
well, what currently does give brets an advantage is that they can still be three wide to get rank bonus while the rest of the world needs to be 5 wide. This is something I hope they will fix in the new bret armybook as it makes the lances quite powerful at this moment, especially since now two can fit nicely to the front of any enemy unit.

But you are right, throwaway units are a bliss against brets, or just baiting and fleeing, works wonders as well!

07-01-2008, 17:15
Well it sure makes them VERY offensive, but the lance formation does have it's drawbacks. If it gets charged then you only have 3 models to fight with, and it also is very vulnerable to flank charges.

If there are throwaway units or bait units you can be sure you're going to have trouble. Plus if you flee the countercharge then you lose that ward save you gave up turn 1 for...

I don't think they need to change the lance rules, I think they keep the theme of the army that crush anything on the charge, but they also NEED the charge.

07-01-2008, 17:38
Would you rather I took 3 more lances?

I didn't think so ; )

From a background perspective... yeah, more knights and less cowardly magic users.

Oh well, your kick butt army of mounted doom, not mine. Sadly...

Most experienced players don't have a problem with brets.

Heh, can't argue with that. If I tried everyone would realise I'm inexperienced.

Touche Malorian, touche.

07-01-2008, 18:45
I hope they don't change the lance rules. Bretonnians work like heavy cavalry is supposed to. Charge in, smash through a unit and turn around for another go. If they change that, they might as well change the wood elves ability to move forests around the table. Every army needs a little flavor!

warlord hack'a
07-01-2008, 21:02
i am not talking about changing the lance rule, only about bringing them back to what they were: one model less neede per rank. Nobody asked me if I would mind fielding my gobbo's 5 wide instead of 4, but still I have to do that now to get a rank bonus.

I am fine with lances being three wide and my units 4, but now it's 3 versus 5.. Still I ain't scared of lances, the green knight, now HE is scary..

08-01-2008, 10:29
4 wide would be fine, and just make it simpler for when you want to decide what models you want to put in the front rank! A bit less static CR on the Knights wouldn't be a bad thing, really.

08-01-2008, 15:06
I wouldn't complain if they made it so you only get the rank bonus on the charge.

warlord hack'a
09-01-2008, 08:39
yes but that is all you need as if a unit holds against a bret charge then the next round the brets are taost anyway, how about only getting the rank bonus on the rounds when NOT charging (the knights pack tightly together, forming a single block or something) ;-).

09-01-2008, 14:32
But that would go against what they are trying to do with brets. They are trying to force you to get the charge, and if they changed rank bonus's that way then it would be a step in the wrong direction.

It probably wouldn't matter anyway since most of the time brets get charged it's on the flank and they lose their rank bonus's anyway...

warlord hack'a
10-01-2008, 07:06
I will be fine with lances when they are 4 wide, period. That also makes them even less manouverable, which is a good thing..

10-01-2008, 15:48
I actually liked the triangle formation of old. I know it was a headache games mechanics wise. I find the 3 wide formation kind of strange but I don't feel 4 wide is appropriate either.