View Full Version : Tomb Kings vs Lizardmen, 1500 points

14-01-2008, 00:42
My gaming gang have been playing a small tournament over the last months or so, and I've faced the lizardmen player a lot. I've -always- lost, however. I belive this is partly because he's a better player me, partly because Tomb Kings generally suck at anything less than 2000 points, and partly because Lizardmen seems like a pretty tough army for Tomb Kings to beat.

I've posted my list for the tournament on this forum before, and I belive it's pretty good, I've beaten orcs as well as chaos with it, but I just can't defeat the Lizardmen player.

Yet. I -am- learning.

This saturday, I fought him to a draw. (He had the most Victory Points). In the end, I managed to ruin it all and throw away my impending victory, but well into the fourth or fifth round, It really seemed like I would win. This is how it went:

During deployment, I was really careful - I've had my chariots slaughtered by his kroxigor more often than not, so I took advantage of the fact that I had more units, and carefully placed my chariots -last-, so that I could place them on the other side of the field compared to his kroxigors. I also placed my archers so they could threaten his terradons, which have been slaughtering my hierophant or my catapult every other battle. (I had realized how low the terradons toughness was, and that they would be vulnerable to my shooting). I also placed my hierophant in a block of skeletons, to further protect her against his shooting, and placed my carrions well away from his terradons, who would surely beat them in close combat.

By having more units than him, I thus managed to deploy to my advantage. And it worked, Indeed. His terradons and fire lizards moved forward on the left flank, while his infantry blocks and kroxigors advanced in the center and on the right flank. There was pretty much woods and such in the middle of the board, so units had to move through rather specific routes. When it was my turn, I moved my carrions up behind his infantry blocks to the right, march blocking him, and I placed my chariots before one of the routes between the woods, so that he would get charged as soon as he moved there. In the middle, I just stood back and waited with ushabti and a skeleton block, while my archers and catapult harrassed him.

With one of his two large saurus blocks threatened, he retreated a little with it, advancing in the middle with his other saurus block and his kroxigors. His terradons tried to charge my skeleton block in order to kill the hierophant in a suicide attack, but failed their fear throw. The next round, my archers killed two of them, and they eventually flew off the board.

His fire lizards shot once at my catapult, not doing much damage (I wouldn't have targeted the catapult if I were him; the chance of actually hitting the crew seemed to slim). The next round, they charged to the right, into the flank of the archer unit I had in front of my infantry block.They failed to annihilate the archers, though, and I could charge them with my skeleton block in the next round, breaking them and chasing them down. The hierophant, no longer threathened by either terradons or fire lizards, flew away to where she would be of use.

For some reason, he moved both his skink mages into range and view of my shooting, trying to get some magic missiles or a drain life of. It didn't go that well, (perhaps he forgot my chariots could shoot), and hunted by carrions, harrassed by shooting, both skinks eventually died.

My catapult wounded one kroxigor, and I then rushed forward with my ushabti, using the speed-spell to get a charge in. The krixogors lost big time (I've found they tend to lose versus ushabti even in drawn-out combats due to the ushabtis Initiative and Weapon Skill), and the surviving kroxigor fled. My ushabtis rolled 1+1 on their overrun move, though, which would prove to be disastrous.

Maybe getting a bit too bold, my chariots on the right charged his right infantry block (the central one had succumbed to panic for a while, but rallied). And here's where I made a great mistake, which cost me the game. Just the kind of mistake you absolutely cannot afford with Tomb Kings.

Let me try to illustrate the situation:


What I -should- have done here, was realizing the importance of getting a flank charge with the ushabti in on the block the chariots had charged . However, I overestimated my chariots, and dedicated only one spell on getting that flank charge, wasting the other one on Righteous Smithing. And I got what I deserved: my flank charge was dispelled. (I had thought he only had two dispel dice now, his last mage having died in the same round, but he argued he had three, because the dispel pool are accumulated at the beginning of the round. Judging by the book, I accepted this, wanting to play fair and all. Was he right?)

In the following round, my chariots, accordingly, failed to break the saurus block and started to crumble, while my ushabti was charged in the flank by his lone kroxigor. That was not a big problem per se, ushabti -always- wins versus kroxigors, but he then charged my ushabti with his scar veteran also. I still could have won that combat, boosted by my two priest, now reigning supreme, but then, in the fifth round, I did something even more stupid - I charged his kroxigor with my carrions. This, in turn, enabled his large infantry block to charge my carrions, whereas it could not have charged my ushabti as the kroxigor and the scar veteran was in the way. In the large multiple combat that ensued, the carrions of course took heavy losses, and my ushabti, of course, crumbled with them.

Thus, I lost the game, with 600ish points versus his 800ish or something like that. It was a draw, but it is a tournament where every victory point counts, so I lost technically still. It was my greatest success ever against this player, but of course I'm a little dissapointed still - I really, really could have won.

14-01-2008, 06:57
live and learn, right?
Well, you're not alone, foolish mistakes similar to that one ruins my battles all the time (at least I don't have to blame it on poor luck...)

warlord hack'a
14-01-2008, 08:32
and power and dispel dice are generated at the beginning of the magic phase, so it is then that you count how many power and dispel dice you have. So he should have had only 2 if by then his two skinks were dead. Looks like you have a good feel of what your army can do and although chariots rule supreme versus most enemy units, charging cold blooded/stubborn/unbreakable troops is not something chariots usually survive. You will win the first round most likely, but the second round you are toast..

16-01-2008, 11:55
Unless his scar veteran had the diadem of power in which he had stored dice from his previous turn then he should only have had the two basic dispel dice for turning up i believe.

Good battle report though and looks as if you are learning (a lot) from your games.

Good luck next time.

17-01-2008, 01:22
His SV couldn't take the Diadem, since it's Arcane, and only wizards can take Arcane.

You were unlucky, it's easy to get hot-headed when you think you've got something, so slip ups are natural, just roll with the punches as it was, at least you've learned something :)

I do have to say, I think he wasn't particularly clever concerning his Salamanders and Terradons.
First off - Salamanders should only've fought in combat if they'd been charged. They are a great fire-support unit, but whilst capable, aren't extended period fighters. A potential 10 shots per lizard is amazing, and he should've left them out of combat, perhaps finding some cover from the Archers instead of charging them. Wouldn't've wasted them that way.
The Terradons - should've flown over your units and taken out the war machine rather than going for your obviously supported Heirophant. Much greater chance of success, reduces risk from Archers and takes out important enemy, then can move on to harrassing the rest of your army.

Not to belittle your loss, and perhaps I don't get the chance element (because if you'd included that, we'd be here 'till next monday) but the LM guy seemed a touch on the naive side.

17-01-2008, 20:30
Well, yeah, of course, he made mistakes also. We all do, after all. However, -had- he managed to charge my infantry block with the terradons, my hierophant could very well have died. He would have had to roll for fear even if he preferred to charge the catapult, plus, my archers were pretty much blocking his line of sight to it. Trying to charge the hierophant, thus, seemed like a risky thing to do, but it could definitely have been worth it. He have won using that strategy once before.

Charging with the fire lizards was very stupid though, I agree. I really can't understand why he did that - maybe he was counting on breaking the archers, overrunning them into the flanks of my ushabti, thus preventing the ushabti from charging his kroxigors. If so, he forgot the skeletons are unbreakable...a mistake in any case ;)

Generally though, he's won every tournament we've had so far, even with -gnoblars- once (although, while I crushed them, no one else did). So he must be doing something right. Or, it might be that we others are just -that- bad. The wood elf player are improving, though - she slaughtered him once in this tournament. :evilgrin: