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squeekenator
16-01-2008, 06:20
I'm considering collecting Tau, and I've been wondering about a couple of things.

1. Are mechanised Tau armies considered overpowered? I'm thinking of having 2k with 4 Fire Warrior squads in Devilfish, some Pirahnas, Hammerheads and the infamous jumping Crisis Suits. Is that sort of army overpowered?

2. What do Tau players do about MEQ and mechanised armies? Tau have a huge amount of anti-infantry firepower, but all I know of that can efficiently defeat heavily armoured targets is Crisis teams, Vespids and rail guns. Rail guns are too sparse to waste on MEQs when there are vehicles around, so that leaves all the anti-MEQ weapons with Crisis suits and Vespids. Is that just the way it is, or is there something I'm missing here?

NerdyOgre254
16-01-2008, 06:51
Right, lemme see here...
First of all this should go in the tactics forum, yiou'll probably get more help from them.
1. Mechanised Tau can be shortened to Mech-Tau. Go to a tournament and you'll most likely see a couple of players playing mech-tau. It's an optimised build for maximum kill, minimum financial and point expenditure, which most tourney armies are designed for.
2. Markerlights. 2 Maxed-out Pathfinder Squads with Devilfish Transports are good if you desperately need to get shots off.
3. Bottleneck. One tactic i've heard of is using transports to bottleneck an area. So what you could do is - a) zoom forward and drop the FW teams in cover, b) zoom the transports out to the sides so they get funneled into the FW teams line of fire.
4. With Tau weaponry, just google "Tau Battlesuit combinations" and you should find some good combos. Personally, i prefer to have two maxed-out units of Crisis Suits - one filled with burst cannons, and one filled with fusion blasters.
5. Sky Ray - IIRC the missiles need a markerlight to work, so this means that a PF unit is necessary. also IIRC, one missile can be launched for each markerlight hit, so if you get 6 markers, then you can release 6 missiles in one turn.
That's about all i can remember now. hope it helps.

superknijn
16-01-2008, 06:58
Don't forget that Sky Ray's have 2 markerlights of their own, that you can upgrade to BS4 with a Targetting Array.

Don't underestimate Battlesuits; you might feel disenchanted by looking at their stats and cost, they're very effective, as you can easily take quite a few of them.

squeekenator
16-01-2008, 07:01
I'm fully and painfully aware of how nasty battlesuits are, don't you worry.

If Mech-Tau is the standard tournament Tau build, then I might think of something else.

superknijn
16-01-2008, 07:24
I play a combined Tau army list. I actually use 3 full-sized Firewarrior squads not mounted inside Devilfish, backed up by lots of battlesuits, two squads of pathfinders and two hammerheads (or a 'head and a Sky Ray) for the mobile elements, with some further backing by a couple of Broadsides.
Still effective and actually fun to play.

I just hate mininimal-sized FW squads in devilfish; it just looks like you're only planning on winning, not on having fun,

The Orange
16-01-2008, 07:32
1. I've never considered mech-tau overpowered. It seems to be an optimized build (though I've never truly used it myself), I don't think anyone really calls it cheese. Thats what the hiding crisis suits are for ;). Before it, TBH I don't think tau really got any respect as a powerful army, and IMO they don't have a name as a power gaming army, just one that shouldn't be underestimated.

2. IMO, yes tau really lack a lot of anti-meq weapon. My personal solution is Ion-heads, and sniper drones. anti-meq suits are another option, but their expensive for the amount of firepower they dish out. I've got vespids too, but so far they haven't panned out. I got to keep trying out how to get them to work better. Another option I'd like to try is Broadsides with Plasma rifles and multi-trackers. Expensive, but heck, that's some pretty awesome anti-TEQ power per turn :evilgrin:.

As for your build, TBH it seems pretty straight forward and simple. Nothnig there that would really catch someone's eye unless you pull out some nasty tricks with those piranha?

Darkseer
16-01-2008, 07:39
Hi Squeekenator!

I've not long been playing Tau, but went a little bit crazy, buying over 5,000pts for Apocalypse.

They're an awesome army in every possible way.
The answer to all their problems is simple - SHOOT IT!

It doesn't matter who they are, how much armour they are wearing, you have the firepower to drop them.
The only thing you have to considering is:
1) your mobility
2) coordinating firepower

That's it.

The Tau are a very rewarding army for players who love tactical application of firepower.

Bregalad
16-01-2008, 10:57
Against MEQ consider one or two Hammerheads with ION Canons or 6-9 Hammerheads (up to 9 synchronized rail guns, but no template and slow!) with Shield drones and/or markerlight strategies (expensive pointwise).

And yes, Mech-tau variants are quite common, but that doesn't make them worthless.

Keichi246
16-01-2008, 14:13
Hi Squeekanator.

Mechanized Tau are one of those armies that people love to hate - but not necessarily for it's power...

The reason (as far as I've experienced) people hate Mech Tau is because it ruins their expectations of how the game is going to go. A certain percentage of gamers see it as an "internet build." (Of course, I've also noticed that many of those same gamers have no problem using 6 man las/plas squads, so your milage may vary...)

People who build "shooty" armies hate Mech Tau because it is very good a focusing firepower on narrow fronts. The relative speed and range of the Tau allows them to manuver out of fire lanes and focus firepower on key weak points. This negates some of the advantages that the "shooty armies" try to accomplish.

Versus assault armies - Mech Tau is basically a giant game of "keep away". You keep your squishy Fire Warriors away from the whirring chainsaws and ravening claws of the enemy. This annoys the enemy, who are undoubtedly looking forward to taking advantage of the famedTau weakness in CC. Skimmers can also be hard to take down with CC.

The funny thing is - Mech Tau builds tend to lack a lot of anti-heavy infantry crunch power. A huge portion of the Tau armory is s5 AP5. Since each Devilfish is near 100+ points, they are points not spent on real offensive power.

I must admit - my primary gaming opponent *stopped* complaining about Mech Tau when two things happened:

1) Ater a series of games when he thrashed me *easily* as I was trying to see if I could create a viable gunline army with the new codex and 4th ed rules. The answer was No. Even though I had more raw firepower, too many assault units could make it across the board and into my face for me stop them. And once that first assault happened - it was all over but the screaming. Add to that Drop pod marines and "Fear of the Dark" librarians? After about a half dozen games - we both realized staitc gunline tactics probably weren't gonna work.

2) I then built the "all battlesuit" army that (2 min fire warrior squads, 1 mid sized kroot squad, 9 Crisis suits, 12 stealthsuits, 9 Broadsides) This list was very fun for me to play, but it wiped him off the table several times with minimal losses for me. He wound up despising it so much that he threatened to stop playing me... (This army build also only works if there is the recomended 25% table cover. Without enough cover - this list is a quick way to a shallow grave)

It was pretty much around that point that we both realized that Mech Tau or "Hybrid" lists were not nearly as good *or* bad as people on the internet claimed. Yes - Mech Tau lists are pretty good at VP denial. But they are also not terribly good at raw killing power. For real anti-heavy infantry work - the Crisis suit pretty much is the only viable choice.

In the end, we realized that manuver and focussed fire tactics are pretty much the only things keeping the Tau even close to competitive. Mech Tau and Suit Tau are really the only ways to do this...

BigBadBull
16-01-2008, 19:29
Against MEQ's Don't laugh , I run 3 full squads of Sniper drones. Marine players either don't know what they are , or don't realise that 9 rail rifles ,a stealth feild generator, and upgrade on BS can take them out. Ion cannons on Hammerheads can help too, but then you loose a big part of your Anti tank.

Suits with Plas and Missles are good too. Stealth suits can really annoy them esp with Fusion blasters. I don't know about the Cyclic Ion blaster ( limited use and only one modlel can carry it)...

So far the bugs are worthless in all my and several others tau play.

Mr Zephy
16-01-2008, 22:03
Cyclic Ion Blaster is actually quite good against high armour opponents. High BS means that the RoF can be used to counteract the low strength to get the AP1 wounds.

Greatoliver
16-01-2008, 23:45
Take a look here: http://www.advancedtautactica.com/academy/MTT/ for some tactics on mech tau.

fwacho
17-01-2008, 07:12
I'm considering collecting Tau, and I've been wondering about a couple of things.

1. Are mechanised Tau armies considered overpowered? I'm thinking of having 2k with 4 Fire Warrior squads in Devilfish, some Pirahnas, Hammerheads and the infamous jumping Crisis Suits. Is that sort of army overpowered?

2. What do Tau players do about MEQ and mechanised armies? Tau have a huge amount of anti-infantry firepower, but all I know of that can efficiently defeat heavily armoured targets is Crisis teams, Vespids and rail guns. Rail guns are too sparse to waste on MEQs when there are vehicles around, so that leaves all the anti-MEQ weapons with Crisis suits and Vespids. Is that just the way it is, or is there something I'm missing here?

Okay so I played in a 14 man rouge trade tourney on satureday...
there were two tau players there. one was playign mech Tau (I had the honor of being crushed by him myself...I might had a chance but melta guns never hit)

All the other player effectively made the sign of the cross against the Tau players and hoped they wouldn't have to play them. (it didn't help that fish of fury guy was being a rear end to begin with) Fish of fury will win you game but no one will like you. what you suggest in level one is somethign I woudl only use in ultra compeatitve toruneys where there are no points allotted for sportsmanship.

as too two. plasma missile pod on suits works great agaisnt MEQ's, dreadnoughts, falcons and light vehicles. (I had one suit knock off three dreads by himself in a game I played today).

Firewariors are actually good for shooting dead MEQ's as massed rapid fire is very successful. aslo an Ion head hammerhead work pretty good too. Vespids are a waste. unless you really love the model just forget them.

Oh.. you can do fish of fury and save your score so long as you don't include any hammer heads.