PDA

View Full Version : How rare are eldar twins, triplets and so on?



Ninjaguiden
21-01-2008, 17:42
I ask this question mainly because I'm planning to start a corsair fleet commanded by three triplets, using their mutual psychic bond to coordinate their combined fleet with deadly skill.

However, I could settle for twins if triplets are indeed extremly rare.

Any info/suggestions/veiled threat are welcome;).

TheBigBadWolf
21-01-2008, 17:47
I think eldar children are even rare as the processes takes several stages its not like humans, its all in xenology but i dont remeber if there is anything about twins. I would say that twins or triplets are excedingly rare but hey i think it sounds like a good story

Eetion
21-01-2008, 17:49
With Eldar you could have 3 brothers/soisters rather than trins/triplets, and still be able to argue the psychic bond.

malika
21-01-2008, 17:53
IIRC twins were even more bonded together than normal brother's and sisters, twins were crucial to control Eldar titans.

Ninjaguiden
21-01-2008, 17:55
With Eldar you could have 3 brothers/soisters rather than trins/triplets, and still be able to argue the psychic bond.

True, but triplets still sounds more tempting. Anyway I now seem to recall that amongst the CWE twins and the like often operate titans, since thier bond makes them a very good team.

Kage2020
21-01-2008, 19:14
Everyone together...

It all depends on your persona preferences...

'Fluff' just mentions that they are rare. However, if triplets (or more) were common, then it would be less likely that the Eldar were "dying."

As to Xenology? Five strand DNA? Methinks that Spurrier had just watched The Fifth Element... :D

Kage

MrBigMr
21-01-2008, 19:43
Are we talking about twins or identical twins? I mean, twins aren't that uncommon, while identical ones are far more.

But either one, I'm willing to bet they're faaaaar rarer among the Eldar than humans. Aren't twins sort of a biological error? Like albinos? Things just go... wrong. As a byproduct of evolution, humans are more prone to such things, but the Eldar are engineered and shouldn't possess such malfunctions in their biology. And isn't the Eldar mating far more controlled than the human wham-bam-thank-you-ma'am? They need to "do it" few times along the pregnancy, implanting more gemate each time. And the female would also need to prepare herself.

Or that's what I've understood of the thing. So if it's that controlled, the Eldar would probably have less chance of getting twins, unless they want to, I suppose.


As to Xenology? Five strand DNA? Methinks that Spurrier had just watched The Fifth Element... :D
Quad helix DNA.

gaunty14
21-01-2008, 19:48
not to mention their reproduction rate is so slow, the chances of them even having offspring is low

Kage2020
21-01-2008, 20:22
Quad helix DNA.
To be fair to myself, I've been trying to put that book out of mind. So much potential wasted on War in Heaven conspiracy theories...

Kage

MrBigMr
21-01-2008, 20:31
To be fair to myself, I've been trying to put that book out of mind.
Ok, I'll bite. What's the problem? The aliens are too alien or what?

malika
21-01-2008, 20:34
Biologically speaking they dont make sense...doesnt really matter that they're aliens, they are just biologically impossible in some cases. That and the giant c'tan/old ones/eldar conspiracies are kind of getting to everybody's nerves I think...now the Eldar are involved in the Tau's evolutionary process?

Kage2020
21-01-2008, 20:35
I just found it to be a very poor book, MrBigMr, that's all. Partially because I had such high hopes for it, but just the way it was done. The poor pseudo-science didn't work for me either, but there we go.

And as for the story? It seemed yet another vehicle for getting the C'tan and Old One conspiracy theorists jumping with joy.

Kage

carlisimo
21-01-2008, 20:51
I think I've also heard of the link between Eldar twins/triplets and Eldar titans.

Just pretend you're North Korea and have all triplets deposited into special orphanages...

Kage2020
21-01-2008, 21:11
Aye. It's exceedingly old 'fluff,' which means that most people tend to ignore it. Or, at least, the argument seems to be that it should be ignored. I would personally argue that it needs some moderation, but that's about it.


Most Eldar craft-worlds have their own Titan forces whose crews work together with an Infinity Circuit.
The Infinity Circuit is used in many forms by the Eldar, where other races would use computers and similar devices. Each Infinity Circuit is imprinted with the character and memories of a living Eldar through the process of 'soul-grafting' (Failleanam). The Eldar's body is left as a mindless husk, but his thoughts live on in the Infinity Circuit. Soul-grafting is seen as the ultimate sacrifice that an Eldar can make for his people, and the ancestors and relatives who live on within Infinity Circuits are treated with great respect. They are revered and marked by the title of Tuisich-Novasmair, which Imperial sources normally translate as Lord-Phoenix.

The Infinity Circuit of an Eldar titan is normally mounted in the centre of the crew compartment, and takes the form of a large and intricately faceted piece of carrecenad, the 'soul-stone' which forms the basis of Infinity Circuit technology. Unlike their Human counterparts, the crew of an Eldar Titan is not physically connected to the machine; smaller chips of stone set in headbands allow the crew to meld psychically with the Infinity Circuit and the highly-sophisticated Mind Impulse Units it controls.

An Eldar Phantom crewman is immediately recognisable by the Spitit Stone he wears upon hisforehead. Upon becoming a Titan crewman, a ceremonial band is wraped around the Eldar's head; almost immediately, the band bonds to his skull and sends tendrils into his brain. The headband bears a small chunk of Spirit Stone taken from the Titan that the Eldar is to serve. Upon taring his place in the cockpit, each crewman psychically links with the Titan using the fragment of the stone. In effect, the Titan and crew become a single entity. The band may only be removed upon the Eldar's death.

Like all Eldar, a Titan crewman bears a Spirit Stone on his chest that, upon his death, will preserve his spirit for a short time. The shape of this stone often reflects the symbol of the Eldar's clan: the Fir Lirithion, for instance, have heart-shaped stones.

Because of the close links that are required between the Titan's crewmembers and the Titan itself, it is usual for each crew to consist of Eldar from one family. This affords them a great deal of respect within the craft world's hierarchy, as a family must be truly worthy to serve in a Titan clan.

When in battle, each crewman wears a close-fitting boiler suit that contains the life-support systems he needs. His boots are made of a slightly adhesive substance that is ideal for moving around the organic tubes and passageways that cris-cross the Titan. When outside the Titan, each Eldar wears either a jacket or a coat for warmth. Like the boiler suit itself, these topcoats bear the Titan's rune and victory symbols on the left shoulder, and the Eldar's clan symbol on the back.

The Phantom has a crew of four - three living Eldar and one Infinity Circuit. The Infinity Circuit is normally mounted in the centre of the crew compartment in the Titan's head, and the living crew -frequently blood-relatives of the Infinity Circuit - occupy couches around it. Unlike their Human counterparts, they do not have specific functions. Each crew member is equipped with a headband in which is set a fragment of the carrecenad stone; by means of this they merge their minds with the Infinity Circuit, forming a composite mind capable of handling multiple thoughts and actions. This mind is linked to the Phantom's mechanical systems by Mind Impulse Units which are far in advance of those used by the Imperium. The relationship between a Phantom's living crew and its Infinity Circuit is intimate and all-sharing; they know each other totally, and are marked by their ability to finish each other's sentences and thoughts out loud. In any other Eldar, this would be unthinkable presumption, but Titan crews are know for the closeness they develop and the eccentricities that arise from it. To Eldar outside the Titan Clans, they are almost a race apart.
This is a small fragment of the wider piece, so hopefully this won't get locked down because of GWLP... ;)

Kage

superknijn
21-01-2008, 21:24
Triplets with a psychic bond? Heck, if they'd be anything like real triplets, they'd be at eachothers throat more often then not. Well, not really life-or-death, but they wouldn't like to be stuck up with eachother all the time.

Let's just say that being one myself, I find GW's representation of triplets quite, well, overly mystified. ;)

thearchiver
22-01-2008, 00:53
Do eldar titans still have crew? I thought they changed it to more like titans are just bigger wrathlords that have a muilt person soul stone core.

Seeing has Lord-Phoenix and The Infinity Circuit now have slighty differnt meanings im not sure how much else of that block of fluff would be ruled as out dated.

Kage2020
22-01-2008, 04:31
Remembering, though, GW has a tendency of reusing words to describe different things. Furthermore, if anything it could point towards a history of development of these artefacts.

And, of course, it was just a way of having something "kewl" and Eldar-sounding while trying to sell Adeptus Titanicus and Space Marine. ;)

Kage

MrBigMr
22-01-2008, 04:42
At least the FW Eldar titans come with a dude sitting inside the head, so they must have some sort of a corporeal crew in there.

Dominus_Serui
22-01-2008, 12:18
Neh, I like the background of there being some kind of ridiculous ritual tradition to the Eldar crew of their Titans, its yet another example for why the whole lot of them are going to hell, the Titans are a mix of wraith-construct and Eldar crew because that way they don't have to send Warlocks jogging after them in the midst of a battle.

Chaos and Evil
22-01-2008, 12:34
Do eldar titans still have crew? I thought they changed it to more like titans are just bigger wrathlords that have a muilt person soul stone core.

Warlock Titans are crewed solely by the dead. In fact, not only just any dead, but the most powerful dead farseers and warlocks of the craftworld, all bound into being part of the giant psychic machine.

Phantom and Revenant Titans are crewed by living Eldar.

Kymar
22-01-2008, 13:07
... Aren't twins sort of a biological error? Like albinos? Things just go... wrong. As a byproduct of evolution, humans are more prone to such things, but the Eldar are engineered and shouldn't possess such malfunctions in their biology. And isn't the Eldar mating far more controlled than the human wham-bam-thank-you-ma'am? They need to "do it" few times along the pregnancy, implanting more gemate each time. And the female would also need to prepare herself.

In us humans at least, twins are not really an error, its pretty common for other mammals to have a litter of offspring (think dogs/cats/rats/etc). Mind you, multiple births are rare in most primates, so in that respect us humans are a bit odd.

All and all, multiple births are a helpful mutation, for though the pregnancy is a bit more dangerous and more likely to have a premature birth, it is biologically more efficient and in the long run can greatly influence the survival of a particular family unit. It has been purposed that one of the key reason Homo Sapien Sapien (our particular sub-species of human) out competed their competitors, is because of the increased fertility that multiple births allow.

If the Eldar are capable of multiple births, that would be a good thing and a very useful trait for them to resist extinction.

MrBigMr
22-01-2008, 14:38
On the subject of Eldar titans, is there any word if any more will be available for Apocalypse? I've only seen stats for the light ones (Revenant or what ever). Is there any with close combat weapons? I had this crazy idea involving 3 Eldar titans, but need them to have CCWs.


In us humans at least, twins are not really an error, its pretty common for other mammals to have a litter of offspring (think dogs/cats/rats/etc). Mind you, multiple births are rare in most primates, so in that respect us humans are a bit odd.

All and all, multiple births are a helpful mutation, for though the pregnancy is a bit more dangerous and more likely to have a premature birth, it is biologically more efficient and in the long run can greatly influence the survival of a particular family unit. It has been purposed that one of the key reason Homo Sapien Sapien (our particular sub-species of human) out competed their competitors, is because of the increased fertility that multiple births allow.
Yeah, sorry, that is true. I got my biology mixed up. I remembered some cases where one egg cell would double up once fertilized or something like that. In any case, there are sort of errors compared to multiple eggs being fertilized. In those cases you only need them to detatch at the same time.


If the Eldar are capable of multiple births, that would be a good thing and a very useful trait for them to resist extinction.
I'm still pretty certain an Eldar woman has control over her body (somehow the Bene Gesserit from Dune come into mind), so I would assume they would want to avoid such things, from the reasons given already by you. I doubt birth is as dangerous to them as well, so it's better to bring them one at a time into the world and see how they fare, before making more.

I don't doubt the Eldar wouldn't do it if it's in their favor, but it rarely is these days. It takes plenty of work to train the young ones and all that. And with all the threats from outside and within, it's best to keep things in check and in your pants.