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View Full Version : Invocation of Nehek Clarification



Elyas
17-04-2005, 15:56
Hey all, this is my first post on Portent...very exciting :D

Anyways, my question is: by casting IoN, can I raise a unit of skeletons to above 30 models (or a unit of zombies to above 40 models)? There is nothing in the spell description that says I can't, but in the unit descriptions for skeletons and zombies, the max number you can field in a unit is 30 and 40 respectively.

Also, where are the rules for a brace of pistols? I can only find the rules for single pistols in the rulebook. Does a brace just count as having two pistols?

Darmon
17-04-2005, 16:35
You can raise as many skels/Zombies in a unit as you like to... A friend of mine ended with..87 skels.. Not a nice unit to encounter.... :( (BTW, after the number went over 40 he wrote down how many he had because lack of models...)

anarchistica
17-04-2005, 16:43
Brace of Pistols...there's a mention of a pistol in each hand on page...91 i think. Perhaps alos on page 92. There's probably a bit about it in the Empire and OK books too. In any case, they allow you to shoot once each turn and make all your attacks S4 AP in the first round of combat.

EvC
17-04-2005, 20:38
You can raise as many skels/Zombies in a unit as you like to... A friend of mine ended with..87 skels.. Not a nice unit to encounter.... :( (BTW, after the number went over 40 he wrote down how many he had because lack of models...)

If you run out of appropriate models, then that's the end, no more can be added to the unit. You were too fair on your opponent!

taer
18-04-2005, 03:20
Brace of Pistols...there's a mention of a pistol in each hand on page...91 i think. Perhaps alos on page 92. There's probably a bit about it in the Empire and OK books too. In any case, they allow you to shoot once each turn and make all your attacks S4 AP in the first round of combat.

And how does this relate to zombies? :D

Elyas
18-04-2005, 03:48
And how does this relate to zombies? :D

See the bottom of my first post :D (I didn't want to make another thread just to ask about pistols...)

taer
18-04-2005, 03:54
Now I feel like an illiterate bilge.

Festus
18-04-2005, 07:10
About the Models part:

Yes: If you don't have the models at hand, you cant create new ones.
This is a deliberate attempt at capping the number of models to raise IMHO.

It is not that much of an issue with Skellies and Zombies, as they are easily available and often worhtless if added to an already large unit, but with Horrors, this gets annoying:
If you don't have any more horror models, I don't let my oponent create any more.

Greetings
Festus

anarchistica
18-04-2005, 19:11
That's only to sell more models and to prevent stupidity at tourneys. Disallowing people to do this in a friendly game makes you an *******. Unless, of course, they're bigger ********.

Elyas
18-04-2005, 19:32
I agree w/ you anarchistica, but I'm just wondering what would happen if you flank/rear charged a unit of skeletons whose rear end doesn't exist...just imagine how far back the unit goes???

Festus
18-04-2005, 20:52
Hi

That's only to sell more models and to prevent stupidity at tourneys. Disallowing people to do this in a friendly game makes you an *******. Unless, of course, they're bigger ********.
As you should know, I can indeed be an ******* at times ;)

But usually this is only a problem if they try to stretch it, like say 3 units of 10 horrors each, and trying to create more units of horrors out of my units and stuff. Yes, then I start to becom a mean *******...

Greetings
festus

anarchistica
18-04-2005, 20:53
Use proxies? We always got tons of other minis and empty bases for this.

MarcoPollo
19-04-2005, 22:33
What is a neat trick especially if you use this as a main strategy is to create bases out of all the bits of skellies you have. It does not take too many bits, or too much time to paint and model a hand coming out from a grave. My good buddy does this all the time. He has about 30 skeletons/ 40 zombies coming out of the grave to represent raised skeletons and zombies. It didn't take him long to make them and it seems fair that he actually has a painted model for what he is using. This, he found was acceptable in tournaments, no problem.

For me, if I am playing for fun, I don't care too much if he wants to proxy. But, it can get annoying and I too can take advantage of the rules if I am feeling like my generosity is being taken advantage of.

Elyas
19-04-2005, 23:14
Another question: do any of the necromancy spells require LoS? It isn't specifically stated in the spell descriptions, and I can't remember if it mentions it in the rulebook (I lent mine to a friend...).

Dargon
19-04-2005, 23:54
The "Gaze of Nagash" spell requires line of sight (Magic Missile), but all other Necromancy spells don't.

Very useful for keeping your vulnerable necromancers in the fight (so to speak), but at the same time out of danger.

Just a thought...

McMullet
20-04-2005, 10:31
I don't see why you should be allowed to have more models in a unit than you have actual models - I wouldn't turn up at the start of a game and claim that a unit of 10 models was actually 30, but I didn't have the models. Why is IoN any different?

Major Defense
20-04-2005, 18:20
I hope I never have to play at a GW store or wherever you people play as strangers. I detest the idea that I'd have to buy an entire 2000 point army just to play it and find out what doesn't work and needs to be replaced. Talk about a sucker consumer!

BTW, me and the three guys I play with are all investing heavily in the models and painting whenever we get the chance. I just don't want to have my army ready after 7th edition comes out!

McMullet
21-04-2005, 10:47
Well, that's different. If you're trying an army, or a unit for an army, out, then I have nothing against proxying. An established army is a different matter though, if you want to play a miniatures game properly (i.e., NOT to try out new stuff), then, well, call me crazy but I like to play against an army of miniatures and not an army of little bits of paper.

EvC
21-04-2005, 17:19
I'm an undead player myself, but I still consider it an issue of MY OWN fairness over raising models I don't have. If I run out of models then I don't raise any more. If I ever play another VC army or a Chaos army I'd hope they'd show me the same courtesy. Hell, especially if was the horror spell- they're not even worth victory points!

Festus
21-04-2005, 17:24
Hi

I am fully with McMullet here:
If you try out new things, by all means, use proxies before you invest in the proper thing.

But if you decided to play VC, how hard can it be to have another Box of Skellies and /or Zombies to have the proper models for your proper army?

Greetings
Festus

Elyas
21-04-2005, 20:00
Remember though, that with an all-out necro VC army at around 3k points, you could be raising like 40-50 zombies a turn if left unchecked (and that's only an average...). Even at 2k points, you still have the potential to double your army size by the end of the game (in ideal conditions)...

Moi
02-05-2005, 06:21
What is a neat trick especially if you use this as a main strategy is to create bases out of all the bits of skellies you have.

I was looking for a good idea to do just that! Thank you very much, you saved me a lot of money! ;-)

As for playing with ou without the figures, I say that in order for a fun game to remain fun for your opponent, you shouldn't field troops that you can't represent with figures except when you opponent agree or when you're testing things. In a tournament or regular gaming (not regular gaming with some competition spirit under the game I call practices before tournaments), it's unacceptable. Either way, doing what's fine with both you and your opponent is always the right choice!

super_steve
02-05-2005, 20:05
another question on ION. can you cast this spell in combat? or any other spell in the VC book that doesnt need LOS?

steve

Festus
02-05-2005, 20:37
You mean, while your Necro is in combat?

Yes, of course. being in h-t-h does not keep a wizard from casting...

Greetings
festus

Moi
03-05-2005, 03:56
... it only prevents to shoot magic missiles or to cast spells stating it specifically.