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jdt
10-02-2008, 03:33
I often play versus skaven and i'm not able to win a game so....if you can give me some tips, i' would be very happy!!!!

-Highborn-
crimson death (35)
blood armour (20)
heart-stone of darkness (45)
sea D. cloak (9)
234pts

Sorceress
2 x dispel scroll (50)
dark steed
192pts

Sorceress
Power stone (25)
Tome of furion(15)
Dark steed
182pts

Noble
Battle standart
standart of slaughter(35)
140pts

2 x 19 Warrior with shield
full command
354pts

20 warrior with shield
full command
185pts

5 Dark riders
90 pts

20 executionner
full command
war banners
275pts

7 harpies
91 pts

cold-one chariot
spear
97pts

war hydra
220pts

5 cold one knights
full command
190pts

IronBrother
10-02-2008, 04:06
i think if you drop one unit of warriors, and replace them with some warriors armed with repeater xbows, you could start to whittle down some of the horde, before your fear causers hit. i would drop the bsb and put the standard of slaughter on your executioners, and then put banner of murder on cold ones. an with the extra points give your dark rider crossbows and a musician. just some suggestions for playing against rats, against all others this looks good for an all comers list.

Violadudester
10-02-2008, 04:49
Solid list overall. My buddy plays Skaven often so I am proficient in dealing with their bag of tricks and can give some tactical suggestions.

A naked noble? Drop something to at least get him a SDC and HA, or drop him all together, what I am about to suggest for your list really won't be useful with a BSB.

Drop the Cold One Knights, as they are pretty much useless against Skaven's Jezzail teams; they'll be target numero uno I assure you. The same applies with the chariot, drop it as well.

I believe having 2 RBT's and at least one unit of RxB Warriors will help a lot. The key to defeating skaven is to cause as many panic checks as you can before he zergs you, and obviously shooting helps to solve this. Focus fire on one unit at a time till you cause 25% casualties, then move on to the next (or until you run out of units to shoot with). With the right dice rolls you'll cause a unit to flee, and when Skaven flee, they are very hard to rally as their ld. bonus from ranks goes bye bye. The shooting in my list is about 2 units of 10 RxB Warriors, 2 RBT's, and 2 units of 5 Dark Riders with RxB's. With that said, put RxB's and a musician in that unit of Dark Riders, they own! Also think about getting a unit of 5 Shades; a march blocking and an annoying scouting unit pumping out a possible 10 shots per turn is very helpful!

Your magic looks great. Concerning the sorceress with the tome, I'd either mount her on a Pegasus, put her on foot, or get another unit of Dark Riders to stick her in. Having both casters your lone DR unit is not good, nor is having one out all by her lonesome.

Hope this was of some help, good luck :cool:

Uriain
10-02-2008, 06:17
It would help a bit if you could give a general summery of what your friend takes, but I will assume that it is either a Grey Seer on Screamin Bell or SAD type list. Here is my opinion.

Lord is great, I equip mine the same way and he works very well for me. Get rid of one dispell scroll and take the Crystal of Midnight, that way you can use it on his Grey seer after drawing out his dispell dice. They are not very high ld and you have a good chance of him loseing a good spell. It is my opnion that the Tome is only worth it on a High Sorc, simply because she has the PD to use it properly. I would take a Dark Star cloak instead and the Seal. This is a good combo, or for my 2 lvl 2's I take one with a Scroll and Seal and the other (who goes with crossbowmen) The Dark Star Cloak and Life Taker.

Onto the troops. I like the big units of spearmen. I use a unit of 18 corsairs with FC and a unit of 24 Spearelves. So here is my suggestion. Drop one unit of 19 spearelves. change it into 12-15 RxB Elves (I use 14 then have the Lifetaker Sorc join unit, 9 Xbows across plus her is alot of shots ^_^ ) The shooting will help you out a ton, and as long as you have your lord close to your infantry they will hold the line. Your Hydra can go with one unit, and your Lord (who I will explain next) can go with the other. I put my Lord in a charriot, and have him hit things with either the Hydra or a unit. He works damn well, and just takes a bit of manouvering to keep alive (IE useing terrain to your advantage)

Your Dark Riders NEED RxB. It makes them so much better. They also need a muso so they can rally when you bait (which works well against plague monks). Even consider bumping them up to 6. Your executioners are way to big imo. I have found that a unit of 12-15 works well, though I use mine as a single unit of 12 with Champ and muso which hits flanks or light stuff that I can get a charge off against. With my setup they are cheap enough to throw away if needs be but can still hit hard when needs be, and they are less of a target because they are not so big. I think your Coldone Knights should be brought up to 6 strong and givin the warbanner, which is a really good combo. It allows them to break smaller units fairly often. On a note of coldones, I also think you should completely do away with the noble, I dont think your list really benifits from it.

Last couple things, Hydra..awesome, love it I custom built my own and use it every game, almost always makes its points back either by combine charges or occupying war machines. Great flank breaker. Harpies, I am in the Shades camp when it comes to these two usefull skirmishers. I find the shooting works better for me, but for you against skaven Harpies are good, if you got rid of something (couldnt tell you what lol) then I would suggest getting both, but Harpies will work well for you. If you have the points left over, I would try and get a bolt thrower or two. I use 1 in my list and find it helps when you focus fire on a unit, can really add some good dmg, or allows you to keep fast cav away from the flanks of your troops.

All in all though a good list. To recap.

My suggestions:

Highborn in Charriot

1 unit of Spearelves into 14 RxB

One sorceress has either dispell scroll/Seal or Dispell Scroll/Crystal of Midnight

Second Sorceress has Dark Star Cloak/Seal or Dark Star Cloak/Lifetaker (then be put in RxB)

Cold Ones bumped up by one and givin war banner.

Executioners bumped down, possibly to 12 with Champ and Muso (used for baiting and flanking)

Harpies possible trade for shades (personal preference on your part)

Dark Riders NEED RxB and a Muso, possibly bumping them to 6

If points left over, a Bolt Thrower or Two

As for tactics, throw all your shooting in a middle/one side of the board. Try and place shooting last so you can focus fire a good portion of his army. Dark Riders and RXB and Bolt Thrower (if you take) can really put the hurt on T3 creatures. Magic should be Dark imo, lots of good spells, plus the movment phase will be important to you so stuff like Black Horror/Dominion/Word of Pain will be excellent, plus if you get soul steal, watch him weep as a 1/4 of a unit drops everytime you cast it. (My empire and Highelf opponents hate that spell with a passion) Knights can either go behind your executioners (who you can use to bait) or run up with the Lord on a charriot etc. Combined charges will win you the day, and dont be afraid to roll your DR into the flank if you think its going to be Iffy. Rather run right through them then not at all eh. ^_^ Good luck with the battles

jdt
10-02-2008, 14:42
thank's for all post i will try you're strategies