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northoceanbeach
17-02-2008, 22:10
Quick 2 questions.

1. Any books where the salamanders chapter is the main focus

2. Are bikes and attack bikes against fluff.

I know that there is increased gravity, so land speeders and jump packs are out. But I see from my limited knowledge no reason to not take bikes. They are ground based, just like rhinos, and I know Sallies take lots of rhinos.

Thanks.

Shaper Shakra
17-02-2008, 23:05
No books that I know of (they do have an Index Astartes article though), and bikes are used but not that common.

Leftenant Gashrog
17-02-2008, 23:15
I know that there is increased gravity, so land speeders and jump packs are out. But I see from my limited knowledge no reason to not take bikes.


I actually think people make a bit too much out of Nocturnes gravity, it cant be all that extreme or else there wouldn't be a human population living on it.. Land Speeders and Jump Packs would be less efficient due to the gravity (as would all vehicles) but they would still work. Personally I think the mountainous and volcanic nature of the planet would be more of hindrance, which would preclude the use of Bikes and Attack Bikes since all of those would have trouble traversing crevasses and lava flows which a Land Speeder could simply fly over (albeit at a slower speed than on a more terran world since it would be diverting power to keeping it upright that would usually be making it move faster), I'd lean towards Jump Packs being less common as well, since all it takes is one bad landing or a strong wind and your in the lava..

PondaNagura
18-02-2008, 00:06
i dont think the Sallies would train purely on Nocturnes, since most of the battles they actually fight are offworld. plus agrav/jump packs would prob be utilized more...bad landing or not, it's those types of hazards that lead to better warriors. If bikers were taken, i'd prob give them the skilled rider ability.

Captain_Rory
18-02-2008, 05:26
Salamanders wouldnt train on Nocturne a lot. They have never fought there. But jump packs are ok, as once you ar3e used to it you would be much better than enyone else.

Goruax
18-02-2008, 22:44
It's not necessarily the fact that they train on Nocturne, or even that it has a higher-than-Terran gravity.
The simple fact is that the growth of their neophytes is altered by this gravity (as they grow up on Nocturne and/or the other moon/planet).

Codex: Armageddon had their initiative reduced by 1 to reflect that, whilst still superhuman, their reflexes were slower than other Astartes, which would lend them to less hectic and reflexive activites.

Vesica
18-02-2008, 23:30
But surely a marines alterd body would be able to withstand the Gravity? if not why would they intetionally hamper themselves?

Seems abit weird about them having -1 intiative. I think it would be fine them using speeders and jump packs but maybe not as much as say Blood Angels or other fast attack orientated Chapters, But in the end its really up to you and you can always make a reason why they have them.

PondaNagura
19-02-2008, 01:12
actually the -1 I thing never made sense to me. if you live on a high-grav planet yes, you would be hampered in such conditions, but since most of the battles are fought offworld if anything they would get an initiative bonus...it's like going from the earth to the moon or mars where you'd weigh less in comparison and could bounce all over the damn place.

icegreentea
19-02-2008, 01:33
I thought the slower reaction thing was a geneseed thing, not an environmental thing. Their geneseed gives them superhuman reaction times, just not as superhuman as the other SM.

Mireadur
19-02-2008, 08:36
Anti grav tech shouldnt be affected by a greater gravity. It's antigrav! you could scape a planet grav attraction without having to move really fast. You wouldnt get affected by inertial forces either.

heretics bane
19-02-2008, 15:42
actually the -1 I thing never made sense to me. if you live on a high-grav planet yes, you would be hampered in such conditions, but since most of the battles are fought offworld if anything they would get an initiative bonus...it's like going from the earth to the moon or mars where you'd weigh less in comparison and could bounce all over the damn place.

QFT-
It would be lke training in a heavy suit or underwater as soon as your out you would be faster as you wouldnt have the resistance going against you.


But surely a marines alterd body would be able to withstand the Gravity? if not why would they intetionally hamper themselves?


A marines body is very resistant but not totaly undestructable, if your born,raised then train for X amount of years on the same planet your gonna feel the effects of high gravity around you.

Couldnt you say that for every other chapter? the BA recruit from a world with huge amounts of radiation,Fenris is freezing, the DA live on a rock etc.They dont intentional hamper themselves there just playing the hand the got dealt with, and how would it hamper them it could come with some advantages aswell

Fixer
19-02-2008, 15:52
The reasoning behind the Salamanders lowered numbers of assault troops, bikes and land speeders was attributed to Nocturne's fluctuating gravtity. Thanks to Prometheus adding a huge gravitational pull and either partially cancelling out or adding to the native gravity depending on their current relative position Landspeeders might be able to fly high in the sky one day, and the next week struggle off the ground due to the forces exterted upon them.

As such the Salamanders have only limited time to train and require additional planning and resources in order to have the assault marine and fast attack units. On a day where a 10ft drop is equivilent to a 30ft drop the last thing you want to due is hurl your valuable marines into the sky with a rocket pack on a planet filled with lava and sharp volcanic rocks.

Combined with the Salamander's 'patience over haste' approach to warfare the Salamanders can field far less fast choices than a conventional codex marine chapter. The assault troops they do field are no less effective though.