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OrlyggJafnakol
03-03-2008, 10:38
Can the Emporer actually communicate verbally with a member of humanity? Does he make his commands known to the Custodes and through them his wishes are made known? I have read that his mind is now fractured into many different personnas, and that each personna has a spercific task, and so do these communicate with each other in anyway? Could a human witness the Emporer having a conversation with himself?

Vesica
03-03-2008, 10:47
Hmmm good point, i wonder if he can still speak or failing that talk via telepathy to his custodes.

Imagine what it would do to a normal person to see the Emperor having an arguement with himself lol.

Sidri
03-03-2008, 10:49
I never heard about "multi-personality" thingie, but I know that he usually does not rule directly - only several facts exists about when he personally spoke - and this only through Custodes...

So I think that he speak with Custodes - but not anybody else...

pookie
03-03-2008, 10:49
no the emp cannot 'speak' but instead telepathicaly communicates, strangley enough tho, the Emp has split his 'personallity' so that he can better lead/help mankind. ( read the Chaos Child for a actual conversation between a Inq and the Emp.)

LordFulgrim
03-03-2008, 10:54
I also never heard of the split persona, very interesting. I always believed the emperor could no longer speak since his body is pretty much being kept alive and is on the brink of death. Maybe in the beginning he could still talk but as time passed on he must have slipped further and further away. It's only his mind that is still "alive".

Gorbad Ironclaw
03-03-2008, 11:26
I think the split personality came about in the Inquisitor War series. It's quite old, and even for that time it have(IMO) a rather strange take on the 40k universe. Personally I wouldn't pay it to much attention.

As for communicating with others. Not any longer. He had some limited ability to talk to people right after he was put in the Golden Throne, but that didn't last very long and no one have had any communication from him in a very long time; he no longer guides humanity except as a spiritual focial point and through the Astronomicon.

OrlyggJafnakol
03-03-2008, 11:32
If the chaos powers can communicate with those you are open to such things then surely the Emporer could also through the power of the warp? If the Emporer was the greatest pysker humanity every produced, if his mind is alive then surely he should be capable of telepathic communication.

If you consider the fluff that is available, most notably the Inquisitor rulebook, perhaps his lack of communication has more to do with the powers that be (high lords of terra) limiting his access to others (perhaps even the custodes) to preserve the status quo?

Jim
03-03-2008, 12:06
If the chaos powers can communicate with those you are open to such things then surely the Emporer could also through the power of the warp? If the Emporer was the greatest pysker humanity every produced, if his mind is alive then surely he should be capable of telepathic communication.

If you consider the fluff that is available, most notably the Inquisitor rulebook, perhaps his lack of communication has more to do with the powers that be (high lords of terra) limiting his access to others (perhaps even the custodes) to preserve the status quo?

True - however I would think that it is rare that one of the Chaos Gods communicates directly with a 'mortal'...I would imagine that most humans contact with them to be through Deamons (Greater or Lesser).

This could apply to the Emp. where no one is in direct contact with him but he makes his wishes/plans known through others - ie Living Saints, etc...

I also agree with Pookie that the Inquistion War series is pretty wacky and should be taken with a pinch of salt as it came from a time when GW did not impose as much 'creative control' on products produced in their name....although with the recent HH CCG & CS Goto BL books you could say nothing much has changed!

Jim

OrlyggJafnakol
03-03-2008, 12:21
This could apply to the Emp. where no one is in direct contact with him but he makes his wishes/plans known through others - ie Living Saints, etc... Jim

How does he make his wishes known? Images in the mind, visions, dreams? If he can send such things why not send simple words?

BrotherAdso
03-03-2008, 12:26
Hmmm. Are we sure that the communications that the Inquisitors have are actually with the big E himself?

I always thought one of the most deliciously dark aspects of 40k was the fact that the Imperium was ruled fanatically in the name of an Emperor who could never rule or even contact his subjects. The dumb leading the blind, so to speak.

Have I just missed some important pieces of fluff, or is this idea of unquestioning and unprovable faith still part of the 40k ethos?

Adso

nagash66
03-03-2008, 12:26
Hey Inquistion War series is a great source for fluff long buried by GW and contains obscure references to everything and anything want to know what a jocaero looks like read the Inquistion War series want to know what the Emperors mental state it read Inquistion War series want to...

darknation
03-03-2008, 12:42
The way I see it, the emperor is the 40K version of Terri Schiavo. He says "Buuuuuh" and the imperium hears "Burn the heretics".

pookie
03-03-2008, 12:49
the Emp doesnt communicate with anyone afaik, the Imperium is ruled in his name only, with his ideals supposedly behind the orders given by the High Lords.

i was assume that ( and taking the Inq wars book into account ) the Emp has too much to do holding the Imperium together to have the energy to speak directly to mortals. ( when i say holding the imperium together, i mean things like the Astanomicon (sp) which is a direct 'impulse' of the Emp)

Jim
03-03-2008, 13:09
How does he make his wishes known? Images in the mind, visions, dreams? If he can send such things why not send simple words?

It would be too easy? :D

...I think that is exactly how he communicates with the outside world - also I remember from somewhere that The Emperors Tarot is influenced by Him...so he can give hints to His loyal followers of events that will come to pass

Jim

jedipenguin
03-03-2008, 13:19
The emperor communicates by typing in CAPS! I saw it in the Inquisitor books so it must be true :P

Sepharine
03-03-2008, 13:43
In response to OrlyggJafnakol,
Although his mind is alive, multiple pieces of fluff suggest that the abillity to use psychic powers is influenced by bodily state. Take for example the second Gaunts Ghost book where a warlock fails to use powers that he had mastered at one point due to old age. Same with Perils of the warp, if psychic powers affect the body, surely the body will affect psychic powers?

Its somewhat like the philosophical discussions of body and mind, is the mind part of the body or is there a mind and a body? even if you would say theres a form of dualism in the above case, the interaction between body and psyche would still be there and quite possibly 2 ways.

In short, I'd say that its unlikely that the Emperor communicates in such manner. I vote hes a corpse on a chair.

Sidri
03-03-2008, 14:05
As far as I know he CAN communicate, but does this rarely - the best example is the foundation of Adeptus Sororitas - his Custodes Captain invited several sisters to visit Emperor and after small chat they turned against that Arch-cardinal (I don't remember the name)... The same story about st. Thor - when he announced that won't lead the Ecclesiarchy guess what? Custodes Captain had a word with him, after that he agreed.

So Emperor can but do not communicate - first of all it may be difficult for him and he reserves it for special occasions. Secondly he may leave day-to-day questions to politicians - High Lords....

Chaplain Dionitas
03-03-2008, 14:19
As far as I know he CAN communicate, but does this rarely - the best example is the foundation of Adeptus Sororitas - his Custodes Captain invited several sisters to visit Emperor and after small chat they turned against that Arch-cardinal (I don't remember the name)... The same story about st. Thor - when he announced that won't lead the Ecclesiarchy guess what? Custodes Captain had a word with him, after that he agreed.

So Emperor can but do not communicate - first of all it may be difficult for him and he reserves it for special occasions. Secondly he may leave day-to-day questions to politicians - High Lords....

The guys name was Goge VanDire


Is the Inquisition War still considered canon? The only reason I ask is because The book Space Marine supposedly isn't

OrlyggJafnakol
03-03-2008, 14:20
I vote hes a corpse on a chair.

If he was completely lifeless then surely the astronomicon would not function? Perhaps the choir keeps it going without him?

nagash66
03-03-2008, 14:28
I dont think they could, i mean the astronomicon would require a huge amount of power to function i just dont think they could handlle it, also if he was just a corpse the tarrot would also go dead which as far as i know is working like always

Jim
03-03-2008, 15:24
The countless psykers in the choir provide the raw energy of the Astronomicon and The Emp.'s job is to direct and focus it into the actual beacon if I remember correctly!

@ Chaplian Dionitus: I can't believe GW would ret con the novel 'Space Marine'...

...unless they fear the 'Gay Space Marine' implications throughout?...or maybe it was the talking Tyranid Zoat...or maybe because it had Squats and Ambulls in...possibly because they eat Titan Princeps brain's and then pilot a Imperator like experts...it could be because it mentions Necromunda and GW don't like Specialist Games anymore...perhaps the sado-masochist Chaplain and his full body 'you have to be naked for it to work boys' pain glove is not in keeping with the Imperial Fists pure and honest theme...could it be the infamous 'Ice skating Space Marine Scouts' sequence?...um...

Actually maybe I can see why....

Jim

DapperAnarchist
03-03-2008, 15:26
I know that in RT it says that the Emperor makes declarations which are carried out by the High Lords - and that probably how the government is presented. Current fluff implies that he is now unable to communicate more than once every few centuries, or perhaps only when his power is boosted by the faith of the Imperial people - so during the Thorian Reformation, he could communicate. And the Emperor does more than direct the Tarot and the Astronomicon - he is the central part of the Soul Binding ritual. Were he dead, that wouldn't work.

ryng_sting
03-03-2008, 20:25
Direct contact only occurs in the largely outdated Inquisition War series. The Big E became a minor warp power, or 'god' upon his acension, and enjoys the the privilges that go with it - including the power to influence the material universe. No, we're not talking about action on the scale of the Chaos gods, but he's still capable of pulling his finger out when the need is great enough. Think of the Reign of Blood - Sebastian Thor, the Storm of the Emperor's Wrath, and the Sisters of Battle's sudden switch of allegiance.

Btw, the Emperor callibrates and focuses the Astronomican. The raw power comes from sacrificial psykers, whereas before it came direct from the Emperor himself.

Deus Mechanicus
03-03-2008, 20:36
Direct contact only occurs in the largely outdated Inquisition War series. The Big E became a minor warp power, or 'god' upon his acension, and enjoys the the privilges that go with it - including the power to influence the material universe. No, we're not talking about action on the scale of the Chaos gods, but he's still capable of pulling his finger out when the need is great enough. Think of the Reign of Blood - Sebastian Thor, the Storm of the Emperor's Wrath, and the Sisters of Battle's sudden switch of allegiance.

Btw, the Emperor callibrates and focuses the Astronomican. The raw power comes from sacrificial psykers, whereas before it came direct from the Emperor himself.

Though the Emperor communicating with Alicia Dominica isn't outaded inquisition war fluff it's very recent. So there's definatly precedent of the Emperor communicating in current fluff

pookie
04-03-2008, 08:14
Btw, the Emperor callibrates and focuses the Astronomican. The raw power comes from sacrificial psykers, whereas before it came direct from the Emperor himself.

Would this be because his powers are waining? would the first sign of his 'true' death come about when the Atronomican fades and dies out? and if so would he be able to communicate this so thats oemthing else can be set up? or more Psykers sacrificed to sustain it?

DantesInferno
04-03-2008, 09:45
Though the Emperor communicating with Alicia Dominica isn't outaded inquisition war fluff it's very recent. So there's definatly precedent of the Emperor communicating in current fluff

All we know is that Alicia Dominica and the Brides of the Emperor were taken before the Emperor by the Custodes in the depths of the Palace. We don't know what happened in the Emperor's inner sanctum. We don't know what the Brides saw, heard, or thought that they heard. All we know is that they came out determined to execute Vandire.

Maybe the Emperor communicated with them, but it's certainly not the only explanation for what happened....

For what it's worth, I personally don't think the Emperor per se has communicated with anyone since his incarceration in the Golden Throne. Just look at the conversation between the founders of the Inquisition right after the Heresy: the Emperor's certainly not communicating with them, at least.

I'm sure most cases where the Emperor is said to communicate with people directly can be explained as the exercise of psychic power, latent or otherwise (eg the Emperor's Tarot), or just ordinary delusion driven by religious fanaticism.