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Lennart.nevanoja
17-03-2008, 14:01
Hello, i am going to play against Empire but i do not have any ideas for how to play against them. any ideas ?

xragg
17-03-2008, 14:52
I always take at least a unit of tunnelers vs empire to take out warmachines. Other then that, empire is diverse enough that its hard to know exactly whats coming before you see them set up. So stating an exact strategy really isnt possible. That being said, humans are T3, so blocks of slaves/clanrats will do just fine killing them. Use your numbers and mobility to win.

ZeroTwentythree
17-03-2008, 20:18
How many points?

For around 2000 - 2250 points I've had a lot of luck with my usual/generic lineup, which consists of:

2 tunnel teams: Not only great for taking down artillery, but after finishing that task they can start hitting handgunner/crossbow units or rushing at detachments from behind to keep them from being used on your infantry blocks. If empire infantry gets that countercharge on the flank, skaven are doomed.

8 jezzails: or however many you've got, I probably wouldn't run more than 8-12. I'm comfortable with 8. Use them to take down empire cav. Primary target would usually be knights, secondary would be pistoliers/outriders. Or use them to hit the Steam Tank if your opponent takes one. Keep your jezzails outside his shooting range, because they will likely be some of his primary targets.

Lots and lots of clanrats, slaves, monks: Empire infantry is among the few that skaven can go toe-to-toe against. Different match-ups have different pros & cons, but the important thing for both armies is to get flank charges while denying the opponent the same advantage. Of course, of your opponent isn't using an infantry-heavy army, then this doesn't really apply, but big blocks of skaven can still stand up to Empire knights as well and win by numbers.

The STank is one of the bigger problems I've faced, IMHO.

The best I can figure is to hit it with anything possible for the first turn or two (jezzails, warp lightning, whatever) and then try to get a hero with a strength-enhancing magic item(s) into coumbat with it. The trick is that the hero should be in a nice big unit of impact/grind absorbing meat shields, and of course being a skaven he'll be stuck on foot. I managed to take one down with a plague priest with a desolate blade in a unit of 30 plague monks before.

Or you could try throwing a tarpit (as much as you can get that to work vs. all those impact hits) at it and concentrate on the rest of the army.

tw1386
17-03-2008, 21:25
I played 2 different games with the same empire player, and he used the same list. Which was a very heavy shooting list.

He had a mortar: These things are nasty against Skaven.

Great Cannon, and a Helblaster. 2 units of Handgunners, 1 Unit of Crossbowmen, and 2-3 detachments of Handgunners/Xbowmen.

He had a unit of Knights, and 2 blocks of spearmen/swordsman.

and his characters.

The first game, I got massacred. I played 3 blocks of clanrats and 3 slaves. with 2 gutter runners, jezzails, giant rats, rat ogres, and plague monsk with cnesor bearers.

I didn't make it across the board before my units all panicked, and fled off the board due to shooting casualties.

The second game was a draw, but I brought the screaming bell. Which helped a TON. I guess you can call it luck or just the power of the bell. Anyways, the first turn, my entire army went Frenzy, therefore immune psychology (which helped ALOT), and then the second turn, i rolled and blew up the helblaster, and the greatcannon with the bell.

I just had bad luck, by the time I even made it into combat, my generals unit (with the bell) only had 2 ranks left, in a starting size of 6x 5 ranks.

Against the majority of empire, I'd expect alot at least a decent amount of shooting, and a unit or two of knights. Thankfully, most empire players I come across don't spend alot of points in magic, therefore I was able to do ALOT of damge to his knights and x-bow with warplighting.

I guess they don't realise how bad it hurts. It's not unusual for me to roll 10+ hits each time I cast it.

Against, Empire, its really hard to know what they bring, but It's usually safe to prepare for a decent amount of shooting.

Badbones777
19-03-2008, 18:49
I played 2 different games with the same empire player, and he used the same list. Which was a very heavy shooting list.

He had a mortar: These things are nasty against Skaven.

Great Cannon, and a Helblaster. 2 units of Handgunners, 1 Unit of Crossbowmen, and 2-3 detachments of Handgunners/Xbowmen.

He had a unit of Knights, and 2 blocks of spearmen/swordsman.

and his characters.

The first game, I got massacred. I played 3 blocks of clanrats and 3 slaves. with 2 gutter runners, jezzails, giant rats, rat ogres, and plague monsk with cnesor bearers.

I didn't make it across the board before my units all panicked, and fled off the board due to shooting casualties.

The second game was a draw, but I brought the screaming bell. Which helped a TON. I guess you can call it luck or just the power of the bell. Anyways, the first turn, my entire army went Frenzy, therefore immune psychology (which helped ALOT), and then the second turn, i rolled and blew up the helblaster, and the greatcannon with the bell.

I just had bad luck, by the time I even made it into combat, my generals unit (with the bell) only had 2 ranks left, in a starting size of 6x 5 ranks.

Against the majority of empire, I'd expect alot at least a decent amount of shooting, and a unit or two of knights. Thankfully, most empire players I come across don't spend alot of points in magic, therefore I was able to do ALOT of damge to his knights and x-bow with warplighting.

I guess they don't realise how bad it hurts. It's not unusual for me to roll 10+ hits each time I cast it.

Against, Empire, its really hard to know what they bring, but It's usually safe to prepare for a decent amount of shooting.

Weve all had our beloved clanrats wasted by accurate arty fire at some point, so dont feel too downhearted mate! Also, what people tend to forget is that if you add up the stat line of a human and skaven (clanrat) the totals are exactly the same, and the clanrat is arguably the better fighter (essentially, the 2 points of LD you lose have been put into move and Initiative). Combine this with the fact that it sounds like your opponent has a "shooty" army, and its really just a case of getting into combat. Your troops have more numbers, are, if anything, better in combat, the LD is largely negated thanks to strength in numbers, and your clan rats come equipped with everything they need for CC with their basic points cost. If Knights are giving you a hard time, perhaps throw some slaves at them and pump poison globes and ratling gun shots into the combat? Empire v Skaven is always interesting, cos it usually comes down to who can use their Inf. better! Good luck in your next game, btw!:)

fubukii
19-03-2008, 18:55
A usual skaven army setup that does well vs empire include

Lots of rats/slaves (3-4 blocks of each)
2-3 tunnel teams
2 wlc to help kill stanks
some jezzails to help kill stanks and knights
2-3 warlocks for magic d, and 2d5 str 5 hits (annihilate all the infantry and fast cav in his army, this spell isnt too useful vs knights so i would hold back at using it vs them unless its needed)