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View Full Version : Banner of the Barrows vs Royal Standard of Strigos?



Lordmonkey
18-03-2008, 03:59
Which do you think is a more effective general choice for Grave Guard?

Banner of the Barrows = +1 to hit (Wights only)
Royal Standard of Strigos? = Hatred

GodHead
18-03-2008, 04:38
Banner of the Barrows. You can duplicate the other with Vanhels.

snyggejygge
18-03-2008, 09:49
I like to keep the Banner of the Barrows on Black Knights, hatred is a lot worse when having that kind of movement, so even if I like Banner of the barrows, unless you donīt use Black Knights, use the Royal Standard of Strigoi on them instead.

forgottenlor
18-03-2008, 10:18
If you have a vampire in the unit take the Royal standard as the banner of the barrows won`t help him. The Royal standard is also cheaper. If I only took one banner I`d definately take it. On the other hand, taking both banners is the best option. Really the vampires have some fantastic banner and these are two of the best.

eleveninches
18-03-2008, 10:28
If going for banner of the barrows, why not get a vamp on a helsteed with crown of domination to fly around so that your knights will hit on 2+ (and wound on 2+ on the charge against most things).

Better choice for black knights is the banner of the dead legion, which causes each knight to be US4, and makes it really easy to outnumber the enemy, autobreaking big units on the charge.

Balgor
18-03-2008, 10:36
I like taking banner of the barrows, as I really like hitting stuff on 2+. Yes I do use a vamp with the crown. Works well with my combat vamp hitting stuff aswell :)

Spirit
18-03-2008, 13:05
If going for banner of the barrows, why not get a vamp on a helsteed with crown of domination to fly around so that your knights will hit on 2+ (and wound on 2+ on the charge against most things).

Better choice for black knights is the banner of the dead legion, which causes each knight to be US4, and makes it really easy to outnumber the enemy, autobreaking big units on the charge.


Listen to this man.

Galatan
18-03-2008, 13:37
Banner of Barrows all the way for GG. Most will only hit on a 4+ (unless you are fighting against cheap basic troops) and that +1 on your roll really boosts the amount you hit. I'm planning to combine it with great weapons, that will mean you hit and wound on a 2+ against most cheap core choices....Killing galore:D.

As mentioned before banner of the dead legion is waaay better for your knights, since your knights will be outnumbered most of the time. US4 helps alot.

tom1354788
18-03-2008, 14:36
i know its not one of the options, but with my black knights i really like the banner that doubles unit strengh. Combined with a mounted lord and 5 black knights the unit strengh is 24, normally enough to auto break most units through fear. The vamp gets the kills to win the combat the bk's kills are just bonus.

That allows my two units of grave guard to have both banners, the banner of the barrors on the ones with great weapons, and the strigos banner on the ones with shields.

explorator
18-03-2008, 14:41
For Grave Guard, I agree the the Banner of the Barrows is best. With GG you may be in for an extended combat, and the BoB will pay off way more than the RSoS. Royal Standard of Strigos would be better for Knights, who are much more likely to break a unit on the charge, but, the Banner of the Dead Legion often seems preferred for knights. The RSoS whould be better than BotDL against Immune to Psychology, of course.

It is nice being spoiled for banner choices. :)

Saben
19-03-2008, 00:14
Against WS1-2:
Barrows- P(hit)= 5/6= 83.3%
Strigos- P(hit)= 2/3+(1/3*2/3)= 8/9= 88.8%

Against WS3-6:
Barrows- P(hit)= 2/3= 66.7%
Strigos- P(hit)= 1/2+(1/2*1/2)= 3/4= 75%

Against WS7+:
Barrows- P(hit)= 1/2= 50%
Strigos- P(hit)= 1/3+(2/3*1/3)= 5/9= 55.5%

Strigos is always better in the first turn of combat (as it should be).

Lordmonkey
19-03-2008, 01:19
Against WS1-2:
Barrows- P(hit)= 5/6= 83.3%
Strigos- P(hit)= 2/3+(1/3*2/3)= 8/9= 88.8%

Against WS3:
Barrows- P(hit)= 2/3= 66.7%
Strigos- P(hit)= 1/2+(1/2*1/2)= 3/4= 75%

Against WS4+:
Barrows- P(hit)= 1/2= 50%
Strigos- P(hit)= 1/3+(2/3*1/3)= 5/9= 55.5%

Strigos is always better in the first turn of combat (as it should be).

Ok, so judging by this mathematics, Strigos is better if you plan to win the first round, but Barrows is better if you expect to slog it out over several turns.

Lord Dan
19-03-2008, 01:22
I like taking banner of the barrows, as I really like hitting stuff on 2+. Yes I do use a vamp with the crown. Works well with my combat vamp hitting stuff aswell :)

Hmm...I can't think of much you'd be hitting on 2+ that actually mattered. (GG being only WS3)

I take Banner of the Barrows with the unit. I also throw in my Wight King with the royal Standard of Strigos. That way the banners play off of one another.

Lord Inquisitor
19-03-2008, 02:54
Against WS4+:
Barrows- P(hit)= 1/2= 50%
Strigos- P(hit)= 1/3+(2/3*1/3)= 5/9= 55.5%
You mean against WS 7+ here, right?


Hmm...I can't think of much you'd be hitting on 2+ that actually mattered. (GG being only WS3)
He's talking about using the Crown which gives them the WS of the vampire to the unit, making them WS6 or higher.

One more advantage of the Banner of Strigoi, which is that is affects the mounts and any attached characters too.

najo
19-03-2008, 06:10
Strigos banner is better mathematically and if you get seperated from your van hel's casters.

Barrows is better with van hel's used with it.

if a vampire is in the unit, you want Strigos.

Even more nasty though, is BSB with barrows, GG with Strigos and a Wight King with Sword of Kings in a grave gaurd unit. Very scary.

Saben
19-03-2008, 12:02
You mean against WS 7+ here, right?

:eyebrows:

Uhhh... yeah.... x2+1 before you need 5+ to hit...... I posted this morning and had only just woken up :o

2d6
19-03-2008, 17:18
I think another option that is well worth consideration is the standard of hellish vigour.

Knights that can run up a flank, ignore terrain and move 16" every turn definitely have some interesting applications.

80% of units out there are screwed if they get hit by BK in the flank anyway, how much you beat them by is not always as important as ensuring you get the right positioning.

Lord Inquisitor
19-03-2008, 17:32
:eyebrows:

Uhhh... yeah.... x2+1 before you need 5+ to hit...... I posted this morning and had only just woken up :o

Hey, you got the statistics right, so not a bad error to make! :D

Karhedron
19-03-2008, 20:33
He's talking about using the Crown which gives them the WS of the vampire to the unit, making them WS6 or higher.
The whole unit! :eek:

I misread that magic item and assumed it only affected one model. That'll teach me to read the rules properly.:o

najo
20-03-2008, 07:39
I think another option that is well worth consideration is the standard of hellish vigour.

Knights that can run up a flank, ignore terrain and move 16" every turn definitely have some interesting applications.

80% of units out there are screwed if they get hit by BK in the flank anyway, how much you beat them by is not always as important as ensuring you get the right positioning.


Agree 100%

Spirit
20-03-2008, 10:06
Add "we are all US 4" banner and you have a scary sized unit that will not only win, but outnumber.

Von Wibble
21-03-2008, 12:42
I won my last game vs VC because of the royal standard - it made Manfred and his (crippled) unit pursue into my prince and swordmasters. The prince then used the white swrod to KB manfred. If he hadn't pursued it would have been his turn next and he would have thrown a second unit in, which probably wuold have killed my general's unit.

I agree with the hellish vigour and dead legion points - I would take one of those.

Gaftra
21-03-2008, 13:38
i need a definitive statistical answer on this! I dont want to have to make any kind of decision for myself here:p

eleveninches
27-03-2008, 11:13
Banner of dead legion makes black knights really awesome. Give them a champion as well, and my unit of 6 black knights has
7 attacks
3.5 hits
3 unsaved wounds
6 horse attacks
3 hits
1 wound
my CR = 6

thats the enemy front rank more or less destroyed.
champions attacks back:
2 attacks
1 hit
1 wound
0 unsaved wounds (2+ armour save)
enemy CR = 4

4 < 6

outnumbered by fear causing enemy.
:)