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Rubicon
21-03-2008, 19:41
I've only recently started playing fantasy again after a good 5 years of 40k, and whilst it is (IMHO) a masterful games system with fantastic fluff and magnificent models (Eighth-grade alliteration FTW!) it seems to me as if there are a great number of power gaming lists that will frequent tournaments. SO my question is, what are the power gaming lists and what does the archetypal exampe of each list contain?

MalusCalibur
21-03-2008, 20:35
I'd say a 'power gamer' list is one that maximises the strength of an army while sacrificing thematics and background fluff.

Such as the Empire Arch Lector/War Altar/Hangunners/Warmachines/Steam Tanks affair.

I'm sure there are more examples.


MalusCalibur

Rubicon
21-03-2008, 22:41
Well the lists that I'm aware of that have been labelled as Powergamer lists are as follows:

Karl Franz + Stank(s)

Bretonnian RAF

Thorek Gunline

Popemobile + Flagellants

Teclis + Support Mages/Scroll caddies

Treemonic legion

I'm sure these are all pretty standard lists too, i'm just unsure as to what each list constitutes and was wondering if anyone could give me a better idea...

AzureDruchii
21-03-2008, 23:55
Popemobile unfortunately also contains 2 steam tanks... if that isnt an indication of their power I dont know what is!

SuperBeast
22-03-2008, 00:16
I think the general perception of 'cheese' is an army that is described by one or more of the following statements.
Avoid all of these, and you can't go far wrong: :D

Army is entirely focussed around a single tactical advantage, and the roster is engineered to maximise that.
Army is difficult to defeat with a 'balanced' (i.e. designed to take on all comers) list.
Army contains a special character.
Army contains a steam tank.
Army roster is described as 'characterful' and/or 'fluffy'.
Army has a special rule.
Army has more than 2 mounted units.
Army book is less than 6 months old.
Army generates more than 2 power dice per 1000pts.
All applicable Lord, Special and Rare slots have been filled.
Any magic item worth 50+ points.
This list is not exhaustive.

Zethal
22-03-2008, 00:27
=) funny stuff.

The Clairvoyant
22-03-2008, 00:57
i'm not as well-versed in these warseer-ish terms on describing an army, but to me, power-gaming and cheese are two separate things.

The way i see it, and no i don't expect anyone to agree, power-gaming is about a lot of eggs in one basket, over-the-top creations and uber-combos.

Cheese, at least to me, is something else. It's putting a horse-mounted character in a unit of foot-infantry, it's using BSBs as lone fighters tooled up to the gills and just so happen to have +1 cr because of being the BSB. It's taking a DOW cannon in army thats meant to have minimal shooting. Cheese is about using the rules in such a way that it makes the army look...well, cheesy. I know most of you put cheese and powergaming under one umbrella, so that might not make a lot of sense, but to me it does! :D

Frankly
22-03-2008, 01:17
Army is entirely focussed around a single tactical advantage, and the roster is engineered to maximise that.
Army is difficult to defeat with a 'balanced' (i.e. designed to take on all comers) list.
Army contains a special character.
Army contains a steam tank.
Army roster is described as 'characterful' and/or 'fluffy'.
Army has a special rule.
Army has more than 2 mounted units.
Army book is less than 6 months old.
Army generates more than 2 power dice per 1000pts.
All applicable Lord, Special and Rare slots have been filled.
Any magic item worth 50+ points.
This list is not exhaustive.
[/LIST]

LoL, thats funny

People will also say that all cavalry and magic heavy is cheezy.

I think some of people on warseer get mixed up between armies that they just don't want to face across the table and an extremly overpowered list.

Theres a lot of finger pointing in threads like this, mainly due to people not liking a certain a type of list and then blaming it for all their woes.

It's all a bit silly really.

In WHFB tournaments I find that 90-95% of players are relaxed, they want to do well, but know they're not going to win, most people like myself like going to tournaments because you know that your going to have a good weekend of playing a game you like and catching up with old friends. That 1 in 10 powergamer usually isn't a factor in a greater scheme of the weekend so don't worry about it.