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Ubercarp
22-03-2008, 03:00
So I'm new to Warhammer fantasy. I've played 4 games now. With the orcs and goblins I have beaten wood elves at 750pts. lost to them at 1250pts., beaten tomb kings and high elves at 1250pts. These games all counted towards selecting a starting territory in a border princes campaign. It turn five and I'm facing off with the empire player tomorrow night in a 1500 point game. I've got a banner supporting so I get an extra 100pts., he does not. I'm expecting one, maybe 2 cannons, knights, outriders, flagellants, a wizard, and maybe a priest.

Fire away with the advice. Thanks in advance.

Gobbo Lord
22-03-2008, 03:08
Ifind Empire flanks are weak and easy to break, their warmachines and small handgunner units are prime targets for wolf riders and chariots. They may well have fast cavalry also, but you can get two units for the price of his one. Go for a combat heavy orc army with chariots and wolf riders on the flanks.

Ubercarp
22-03-2008, 03:13
I good with guessing range (I'm a cabinet builder by day) do you think doom divers are a good addition? I killed some high elf cavalry by guessing short and risking on a good scatter. Also, what about night goblin fanatics? I'm reluctant to take night goblins at all but they seem almost indespensible with the fanatics.

Bortus
22-03-2008, 03:21
Flank, flank and more flank! Charge those war machines with Wolfriders and maybe the Knights to keep them out of combat. If he's running blocks of core units, as most Empire players do, try using the Rock Lobber.

Bortus
22-03-2008, 03:22
p.s Charge the Knights in the flank...I know pretty obvious but I had to clear that up. :)

showmydog
22-03-2008, 03:26
as gobbo lord said handgunners and war machines are great targets for wolf riders/chariots. this is easy vp's and will take out the things that could really hurt you. your warriors are tougher and better fighters so in a scrap you should come out on top, provided you can avoid getting flanked by his detachments. take these out with fast stuff. doom divers are fun for things like knights.

Gobbo Lord
22-03-2008, 03:37
On NIght Goblins, in this addition of the army book they are very expensive. Especially since everyone and their auntie has the skull pass models. They are excelent at supporting Orc units in combat, especially with nets, but spears are, IMO, a waste of points nowadays. The fear of Fanatics is often more usefull than the actual Fanatics themselves. More so now that they are armour piercing rather than no armour save allowed. Basically Orcs are your best, cheapest unit. NIght goblins with spears and nets work out at an averasge of 5 points per model. For six you can get an Orc with shield. Thats +1 toughness, +1 strength for the first round, better armour save, better leadership, not paniced by goblins, bonuses for the waaagh and extra power dice for your shaman if in combat. When you look at it like that they should be the main part of any orc army.
The empire is weak in combat but excelent at mowing you down before you get to them, so wolf riders are needed. Even if they just stop a unit shooting for two turns, though you should easily beat any cannon crew or small unit if you flank charge, on the first round of combat. A doom diver, or rock lobber would be good for any knights if you are good at ranges, as your war machines are good for heavily armoured foes, something your average orc has a problem with.

Ubercarp
22-03-2008, 03:47
What about spears? Should I have some orcs/goblins/night goblins with spears to protect my war machines. What about missle fire? Are bows a worthy investment for the wolf riders? Should I try to use goblins to bait charges?

In the game with the high elves I used a unit of 29 orcs with extra choppas and my battle standard bearer carrying Morks spirit totem. The unit had great combat res., plenty of attacks and could absorb some damage. I'm planning on putting this unit at the center of my line.


The wolf riders and chariots are set. What about a shaman with the wolf riders?

Gobbo Lord
22-03-2008, 03:59
goblins should ideally flank charge units your orcs are fighting, baiting is ok, yet snotlings are the best for this (no animosity and your army cares not what happens to them). i put bows on my small wolf rider units, though they rarely do any thing. i use snotlings to redirect away from my warmachines. they are versatile things. i dont like spears on my infantry, makes gobbos too expensive, orcs lose choppa bonus and both races lose the extra save in combat.

Avian
22-03-2008, 08:38
What about spears? Should I have some orcs/goblins/night goblins with spears to protect my war machines.
Spears are reasonably worthless since most of the time a hand weapon or choppa with a shield is both better and cheaper. Only take spears if you have a good deal of points to spare and you want a bit of extra flexibility.


What about missle fire?
Are bows a worthy investment for the wolf riders?
They are dead cheap, which is the best thing about them. Take them in addition to spears, not instead of spears.


Should I try to use goblins to bait charges?
That is one of the best things you can use gobbos for.


The wolf riders and chariots are set. What about a shaman with the wolf riders?
That is one of the worst places you can put a shaman. Highly exposed and vulnerable to both animosity and panic. Shamans are best put in units lead by a black orc character or with a war machine crew, if you ask me.


More: Orcs & Goblins Tactics page (http://folk.ntnu.no/tarjeia/avian/subpage.php?s=index_greenskin_tactics)

kisteglad
22-03-2008, 11:03
AND REMEMBER YOUR FANATICS!

they are rally really really good...

... unless they dont spin the way you want them to :D

spiders, boars and wolves!

kisteglad

Ubercarp
24-03-2008, 12:47
Well, I got massacred, literally. A rules misunderstanding const me a unit of wolf riders on one flank and the empire general on a pegasus destroyed the wolf riders on the other flank. It went pretty much downhill from there. My doom diver misfired the first turn and the rock lobba the second. His hellfire(?) rockets hit twice and caused some heavy casualties. The dice were fairly unkind to me too. There were several squabbles at inopportune time. Oh well, I think I learned a lot. Thanks again for the advice.

Kahadras
24-03-2008, 18:00
Unlucky. I'd probably have taken Spear chukkas over a Doom divers and Rock lobber as they offer a serious threat to small units of knights and characters on Pegasus. Having said that though if you aren't rolling well then nothings reallly going to help. Just look at it as a learning experience. You've seen how the army plays so next time you'll be able to counter some of the tactics he used.

Kahadras