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Karhedron
13-04-2008, 21:22
I am playing in a campaign and my next game is at 750 points. I have several restrictions which include only 1 Hero, 0-1 Special and no rares. With the 1 character limit, I have chosen a pretty well buffed Vampire as he will have to provide both magical support and combat punch for the whole army. I may be playing High Elves but this is not certain so I don't want to unduly lean my army to play against them.

List 1
190 Vampire Flayed Hauberk, Biting Blade, Black Periapt, Dark acolyte, Lord of the dead
184 6 Black Knights with Barding and Banner

40 5 Dire Wolves
40 5 Dire Wolves

140 15 Skeletons with light armour, shields Full command
155 15 Skeletons with light armour, shields and spears Full command

749 Total

This list is based around giving my Vamp as many power dice as possible and maximisng the potential of IoN using Lord of the Dead. Basically I will spend the first couple of turns spamming IoN to get the skeleton units up to a decent size. Skellies provide rank and banner while Wolves go for a flank attack. The Black Knights are there to either flank charge tough units or take out lighter units on their own with early charges (archer units etc).


List 2
200 Vampire Book of Arkhan, Black Periapt Dark acolyte, Avatar of Death

156 5 Black Knights with Barding Banner

40 5 Dire Wolves

180 20 Skeletons with light armour, shields Full command
168 20 Ghouls Ghast

Total 744

List 2 relies slightly less on IoN with its larger infantry units. Since I don't have Lord of the Dead I have taken a mix of Skellies and Ghouls. The Vamp is magically inclined again but this time I have given him the Book of Arkhan to ensure I have a bound copy of the vital Vanhel's Dance.

I am currently leaning towards list 1 but I could be swayed by convincing arguments.

One big choice I have is whether a unit of Grave Guard would be better than the black Knights?

Thoughts comments or suggestions welcome.

Sarael
13-04-2008, 22:19
In the first list, I'd go with Sword of Striking and Nightshroud. SOS will let you hit on 2+ against most anything at this points level, S5 means you'll wound on 2+/3+, and the shroud helps you hit first, and negates things like Lances.

I've yet to have success with a casty vampire at any points level, but my casty vamp Lords are another matter. A lot of the problem lies in tooled up combat characters of every other race being more than a match for a casty vampire, which is understandable, because the vamp still chews through basic infantry units with ease. Outside of vampires and lucky KBs from wights though, the army doesn't have anything else with a good chance of taking on a dedicated combat character without any rare choices.

And I'd probably go with the GG over BKs, at this points level at least. The BKs are dangerously small, and they're kind of unsupported, especially in the 2nd list: you'll need one DW unit for a screen, and one for a support unit for the BKs.

LiMunPai
14-04-2008, 07:34
You don't have a vampire rolling with the black knights, so they won't be able to march outside of the 12 inch radius of your general. The same goes for the dogs. If you can't get any rares, (4 unkitted blood knights for 220, maybe a little steep), I'd just take a core infantry block. In that light, I think Grave Guard are the right choice. I also like list 1. Lord of the dead increases magic efficiency greatly if you only cast ION. With the Black Periapt, you should be able to get a couple through each turn versus an army without a caster, netting you 7 skeletons, or resurrected grave guard a turn, which is brutal at this low points level. Also, with two chances at spells, you might get the Danse anyway.

Karhedron
14-04-2008, 20:23
In the first list, I'd go with Sword of Striking and Nightshroud. SOS will let you hit on 2+ against most anything at this points level, S5 means you'll wound on 2+/3+, and the shroud helps you hit first, and negates things like Lances.
Hmm, I would rather go for a solid save in the first place. NS only has a 6+ save which I don't think will last long.


And I'd probably go with the GG over BKs, at this points level at least.

I'd just take a core infantry block. In that light, I think Grave Guard are the right choice.
OK, that's 2 votes for GG (damn, that means I have to get them painted in a hurry :o). So my new list looks like this.

List
190 Vampire Flayed Hauberk, Biting Blade, Black Periapt, Dark acolyte, Lord of the dead

180 14 GG with Banner.

40 5 Dire Wolves
40 5 Dire Wolves

140 15 Skeletons with light armour, shields Full command
155 15 Skeletons with light armour, shields and spears Full command

745 Total

Any ideas where to spend the last 5 points?

heinrichvoncarstein
14-04-2008, 20:56
I would go with this list, but swap a skellie unit for a unit of ghouls. they're much better than those pathetic skellies!!

LiMunPai
14-04-2008, 21:16
Take out the spears and a rank on the skeletons, netting you 55 points, with the 60, get an extra rank of grave guard to make this unit nigh unkillable at this points level. Also, drop both skeleton musicians and the champ in the strong unit of skellies to get a champ in your grave guard general unit, making it so the general pretty much never has to except challenges. The small skellie unit just has IoN target them for the first couple of turns to bolster the ranks, since ION is the only thing you pretty much ever want to cast at this small points level to make your magic more efficient. Stupid power dice to base dispel dice ratio at this small of a game.

darknar
14-04-2008, 21:25
instead go for a bit of fun any try out this vampire

vampire 100
forbidden lore 35
flayed hauberk 25
talisman of lynchi 10

ghouls ghoals and more ghouls
forget wolves you wont need to worry about anything except smashig into combat dealing the most damage possible in the shortest abount of time

also
bears anger that vampire
6 strengh 7 attacks will rip most things apart in close combat and with a 2+ save there is not much that can take him down short of him fluffing his attacks or even when he is not in close combat
just use the ghoul units to keep him save from crumbling from combat ress

just a suggestion take it seriosly or not

Karhedron
14-04-2008, 22:54
I would go with this list, but swap a skellie unit for a unit of ghouls. they're much better than those pathetic skellies!!
I certainly like Ghouls however I want to stick with a single type of unit in order to maximise the value of Lord of the Dead.


Take out the spears and a rank on the skeletons,
Unfortunately I don't have the models, I have a unit of spears and a unit with HWs so that is probably what I will go with.


Also, drop both skeleton musicians and the champ in the strong unit of skellies to get a champ in your grave guard general unit, making it so the general pretty much never has to except challenges.
Hmm, tempting. It could be tricky if my opponent has invested in some magical defences though. How much do I want to rely on IoN before I get into combat? Can I guarantee 2 castings a turn?

LiMunPai
14-04-2008, 23:11
If they have a wizard, and you are casting 2.666 IoN's a turn using 1 dice casts on 4 dice with an average value when you cast of 5.5, he will then use his 3 dispel dice to dispel approximately half if he has a staff of sorcery, you will get a little over one on average a turn, if they don't have the staff, you will get over 1.5 IoN's a turn. You'll get about a rank of skeletons a turn, even with very strong magic defense, this means you should be able to get 2 ranks, at least, before you get into combat. Also, if he has magic defenses, your combat strong vampire will beat his face in(possibly excluding ogres). If he has no magic defenses, you can transfer a dice over to each casting phase, allowing you to get 3.333 casts a turn, which is a lot of skeletons. The only army that will really shut you down is dwarves, which will probably bash your face in with their base 4 dispel dice, which is dirty as hell at this point level.