View Full Version : Saves, re-rolls and items

10-05-2008, 15:18
This is a particular case. If a paladin(brets) with Birth-Sword of Carcassone hits a Thane with Rune of Resistance, what happens?


Thane has say 1+ save. Gets -2 from the paladin so 3+. He has a re-roll from the rune of resistance, and saves his thane. But here is the problem, will he have to re-roll the successful save because the Birth Sword or not?

The dwarf player says that he mustn't because you can't re-roll a re-roll which he's right, but I don't know if this case applies here.

Gazak Blacktoof
10-05-2008, 15:47
The latest FAQs state that you don't re-roll a re-roll.

If I'm understanding the question correctly one item forces a re-roll on successful saves whilst the other allows a re-roll of failed saves.

In this case you roll all the succesful saves again (to satisfy the rules for one item) and re-roll all the failed saves (to satisfy the other item). You use the second result without any further re-rolls being allowed.

In the example you gave a single dice is being rolled. If the die comes up as "saved" then the sword will force a re-roll and you use the second dice result without any further re-rolling. If the initial dice roll is a "failed save" then the armour allows a re-roll and you use the second dice result without any further re-rolling.

Specifically the dwarf "saved" the wound on the first roll of the die so the bretonnian sword forces a re-roll. The result of the re-roll is final.

The new procedure on re-roll interation is in the high elf FAQ.

11-05-2008, 00:00
Gazak is correct - check the latest FAQ for more details.

In effect, you are forced to re-roll all dice in such a situation, and there is no conflict (since the Thane has a rule allowing him to re-roll failed saves only, and the Birthsword forces him to re-roll successful saves only).

Personally I check with my opponents beforehand to check that they're ok with the two rules cancelling each other out because I don't like wasting time rolling the first set of dice only to re-roll all of them.

11-05-2008, 05:28
The above posters are correct, but my gaming group have come up with a solution that I think is a little less convoluted which is that they cancel out each other and no one re-rolls anything, this satisfies the rule that 'you can never re-roll a re-roll'.

My two cents.

The Red Scourge
11-05-2008, 07:13
Just preaching for the choir and adding on an extra example – which has been clarified.

Armor of Damnation (re-roll successful hits in CC) vs hatred.

1: establish how many hits are successful by re-rolling for hatred.

2: armor of damnation kicks in and re-rolls successful hits.

11-05-2008, 07:22
Thank you for confusing the issue by bringing up that again. That particular example should be ignored since it allows for the dice to be re-rolled twice.

I don't know why they bothered to publish that "clarification". I can only guess that somebody got the job of explaining the "re-roll success vs. re-roll failures" issue but got confused, deciding that it was more important to have the rerolling deal with the result rather than the dice involved.


11-05-2008, 17:03
The Armour of Damnation vs Hatred was a FAQ for 6th edition which went against one of the core mechanics of WFB - that a re-roll may never be re-rolled for any reason.

The 7th edition FAQ supersedes this by clarifying that a re-roll may never be re-rolled, so hopefully we can forget that GW ever thought that the first FAQ was a good idea.