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the1stpip
20-05-2008, 23:06
For all those naysayers who say the 40k universe never moves on...

A friend of mine, who happens to be on the GCN council, has seen a copy of the new rules. On our club forum, he posted this message.

OK so just suppose the Adeptus Mechanicus discover a fault with the Golden throne which is beyond their repair/technology!

What action would the Imperium of man take?

Search for the Primarks?
Find a suitably psi-endowd person/entity to replace the Emperor?
Clone the Emperor?
Do nothing?
Do something else?

Now consider that this information, in the current time line, is in fact over a decade old?

Now what do the Imperium do?



Ge later goes on to comment that this is actually taken from the new book. Could there be big things afoot?

Lardidar
20-05-2008, 23:12
It is in the new book ... we had a discussion about it a few days back.

The new book is set right at the end of M41.

Lord Raneus
20-05-2008, 23:27
Thank the Emperor...finally, he can be reborn as the Star Child instead of sitting on a glorified toilet!

Furthermore, I look forward to Ultramar becoming its own splinter empire because then they can take charge of the Eastern Fringe and beat those Tau bastards back. :D

MasterDecoy
21-05-2008, 00:10
meh, my money is on the imperium finding the long lost STC tech, and figuring out a way to travel FTL without the warp.

Raven1
21-05-2008, 01:20
what's going to happen? Nothing really, the Golden Throne will be broken for the next several years, until they inch the story forward again.

Honestly, nothing. The Emperor doesn't rule anymore anyway. The high lords of terra do that. the big problem is if he dies than the astronomicon doesn't have the light to follow, but than again it has been said the the Tyranids are chasing that light so it would be good.

Gensuke626
21-05-2008, 03:35
I think, nothing.

I mean...even if the Emperor dies, the High Lords will lie about it.

Hmm...maybe the humans will figure out how to Navigate without the Astronomicon? I mean...FTL without the warp sort of takes out some of the fun of 40k...

Maybe the Adeptus Mechanicus will adapt their Communication Network to allow for navigation...I mean, I heard that the Admechs actually have a non-psychic interplanetary communications setup...

Champsguy
21-05-2008, 04:49
The cynical perspective:

The Golden Throne has probably been the same for thousands of years. I imagine people trip over the cord and unplug the thing all the time. It probably hasn't been "on" since 34K. Just don't let any loyal imperial subjects hear you say that.

The astronomicon? Well, that's what you get when you murder ten thousand psykers a day. You can feel their death cries halfway across the galaxy.

[Glory] Wulf
21-05-2008, 10:45
Owh... Broken as in, 'beyond-repair' broken.
By reading the topic I thought there would be actual rules for the Golden Throne and that they'd be broken (well, they probably would be anyway).

Well, nice piece of fluff this promises to be.

cochise
21-05-2008, 10:51
Yep, the golden throne moves as a fast skimmers but will be fearless, will have rending, Feel no Pain, furious charge, hit and run, veil of tears, and can use 3 lashes of submission in a single turn. Also counts as a Monster Creature. But itīs not as bad as it seems...they are nerfing rending in the new edition!!!

Frecus
21-05-2008, 10:52
Golden throne: Insta-kill anything on the board. Nobody wins, and both players need to find a girlfriend so they can cry in their laps. The player who does not succeed in the final task is more of a nerd and will win anyway.

Now that's broken! ;)

On topic: I hope the plot won't go too far. With everything on the brink of happening it's a much more interesting universe.

Frecus
The glade wanderer
Madwarrior

reds8n
21-05-2008, 10:53
Well, we're not a perfect forum by any means but I think this is a bit OTT.

;)

Iracundus
21-05-2008, 10:55
While intriguing, it probably is just so much atmospheric detail rather than any true progression. The Golden Throne has supposedly been running for 10K years. A decade is nothing next to that kind of running time. All that detail really does is act as another form of hint that the Imperium is going downhill. The actual decline and fall may take millenia more.

Hellfury
21-05-2008, 11:23
In typical GW fashion, the story will "progress" and nothing will change.

It is still Grim
It is still Dark
It is still the Far Future
There is still Only War

Not that I really want it to change that much mind you (but the starchild is a really nice plot device) but don't kid yourselves into believing that anything other than a few lines of fluff have changed. Everything moves sideways....not forward in 40K.

Chaos and Evil
21-05-2008, 11:36
Search for the Primarks?

Yep, they will all go shopping for cheap shirts made in sweatshops. (http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/this-britain/primark-is-named-as-least-ethical-clothes-shop-518600.html)

I think you mean 'Primarchs'.

Huw_Dawson
21-05-2008, 11:43
I'm willing to bet that the "faults" are the faults that the first HLoT put in to keep the Emperor in sleepy-land. Cue Cypher, who will be some form of technical genius, showing up. He connects a few wires, kaboom, Emperor wakes up and fixes the Lion Sword.

- Huw

Kildash
21-05-2008, 11:44
someone (Redrivertears) told me recently that the golden throne was built on top off a warp rift, and it keeps it closed, so if it breaks down...

Booya! Major daemonic attack from inside the palace on holy terra...

Now that would be a nice twist... the imperium losings it's homeworld, and every single space marine and inquisition force rushing to take it back...

quite unlikely though...

Shasolenzabi
21-05-2008, 11:49
[[[ One never knows with GW though.

chivalrous
21-05-2008, 11:51
Huh? This sounds strangely familiar actually: Waaay back in 1996, a friend of mine heard a rumour that GW was playtesting rules for something called '50K'. The premise being a time after the Imperium had crumbled.

Now the suggestion was that most of the Imperium had either fallen to chaos or was holed up fighting a rearguard battle for survival.
Now a few things were a little contrived, because of the greater concentration of Chaos in the galaxy most of the space marine chapters had mutated to some extent even if they hadn't turned to worship chaos. Blood Angels had given in to the Red Thirst, Space Wolves had all become Wulfen. The only chapter to remain untouched by chaos was the Dark Angels, because of their self inflicted penance.
Nothing was specifically said about any of the other chapters but at that time they were all lumped in with the Ultramarines codex.
Little was said about the Orks and Tyranids other than they were rampaging unchecked throughout the galaxy, Eldar had been all but wiped out. Being 1996, there were no Tau and the Necrons were still in a very experimental stage so nothing had been written, or leaked, about them.

static grass
21-05-2008, 11:58
What's with all this obsession with the time/story line not advancing anyway?

OMG Flamez of WarZ is stuck in WWII.
OMG Lord of the RingZ whats with all the third age stuff??

The galaxy is huge and just because they add new background it doesn't always mean that this is new background that occurs after the old background.

Ghostwolf
21-05-2008, 11:58
Roll out Cypher and the Sensei Knights! they have a job to do :D Also let the Custodians out to play, they've been couped up in the Imperial palace since the Emperor took a bit of a beasting.

x-esiv-4c
21-05-2008, 12:01
5th Edition "The Golden throne is breaking"
6th Edition "The Golden throne is really breaking"
7th Edition "We're pretty sure it's almost broken"
8th Edition "Don't panic! (This edition is set in the Douglas Adams universe...Vogons etc)
9th Edition "Looks fairly broken"
10th Edition "We have organized a council to debate the thrones brokeness"
11th Edition "Council has issued the founding of several subcouncils to debate level of brokeness of various throne parts"
12th Edition "Preliminary reports are back it looks grim ( save modifiers are back )
13th Edition "Throne is indeed broken"
14th Edition "Turns out the throne was broken 10 editions ago"

Sholto
21-05-2008, 12:11
Bah - I covered this one ages ago. The Throne breaks and they get someone special in to fix it Message In A Bottle (www.incunabulum.co.uk/Message%20In%20A%20Bottle.htm).

Sholto

Ghostwolf
21-05-2008, 12:35
Huh? This sounds strangely familiar actually: Waaay back in 1996, a friend of mine heard a rumour that GW was playtesting rules for something called '50K'. The premise being a time after the Imperium had crumbled.

Now the suggestion was that most of the Imperium had either fallen to chaos or was holed up fighting a rearguard battle for survival.
Now a few things were a little contrived, because of the greater concentration of Chaos in the galaxy most of the space marine chapters had mutated to some extent even if they hadn't turned to worship chaos. Blood Angels had given in to the Red Thirst, Space Wolves had all become Wulfen. The only chapter to remain untouched by chaos was the Dark Angels, because of their self inflicted penance.
Nothing was specifically said about any of the other chapters but at that time they were all lumped in with the Ultramarines codex.
Little was said about the Orks and Tyranids other than they were rampaging unchecked throughout the galaxy, Eldar had been all but wiped out. Being 1996, there were no Tau and the Necrons were still in a very experimental stage so nothing had been written, or leaked, about them.

I had heard something like this as well. But seeing the way things are lets take a little stab at the future shall we? after looking at some recent history of course.


The Thirteenth Black Crusade - This basically threw the Imperium sideways. Chaos used Blackstone Fortresses against Cadia in an effort to destabilise the area and give Chaos greater access back into the material world. Because of this the Imperium re-directed most of its military power to deal with the Chaos threat and as such the Tau have taken the advantage and forged further into the galaxy and taken a multitude of worlds into their Empire.

The Thirteenth Company return - The arrival of the Wulfen back on the scene after a 10'000 year absence is actually a significant event. If you look back through the WH40K history there was mention of the return of the wulfen before a major event, could it be they were the forewarning of the black crusade or is it something more profound?

Cypher - A strange and enigmatic character who's appearances seem random and without reason, although it was revealed in white dwarf in a short story that involved a conversation between Cypher and Abbaddon that he does indeed have his own agenda. It is speculted that he is trying to reach earth for some unknown reason.

The Third War for Armageddon - The Orks returned to once again ravage this industrial world, was it just a test or is there still more to come?

The Tau - with their arrival the Tau proved to be yet another thorn in the Imperiums side.

The Necrons - ancient enemies of life itself are fully awaken now and they seem near unstoppable.


so with all this going on plus the arrival of a new hive fleet what else can happen?

well it looks to me like the Human race has been getting thoroughly shafted for quite some time, so I think they're just about ready to drop a big human bomb in the story. Be it the Return of the Emperor, the return of the Primarchs, the revealing of the Sensei Knights... whatever in might be I think the Human Card will be played in the opening years of the 42nd Millenium and while it may be a powerful event it will have consequences (because as humans we always get something wrong).

There's enough evidence for those willing to look for it about the possibilities of the future but we won't know until they pull the finger out and go with it.

lorbaat
21-05-2008, 14:35
the big problem is if he dies than the astronomicon doesn't have the light to follow,

That assumes that the Emperor is tha cause of the Light, and it's not just powered by the thousands of psykers who are sacrificed daily to it.

Killeritch
21-05-2008, 20:08
Y'know, I still think Cypher's evil. Just because they can't prove he caused all the revolts and led the Chaos Marines around doesn't mean he didn't do it. Then again I always side with the Inquisitors, however much GW tries to get me not to. Now let's go kill some heretical Tzeentch-controlled Sensei!

(cf: 3rd ed pg 273)

Lord Raneus
21-05-2008, 20:26
Warhammer 50k would suck, honestly. I think you'd have a lot of Space Marine players (the majority of the game's audience) not playing it at all. I wouldn't; I like to play a game where the Marines are biased, ruthless, unforgiving aspects of humanity, not one where they're a bunch of gibbering maniacs/wolves/whatever. Much of the famous chapters would probably have been wiped out, along with most of the famous Guard regiments. This is not exactly a breeding ground for success, at least not as far as Imperium players are concerned. Eldar would probably be affected as well (some Craftworlds would undoubtedly be caught/destroyed).

All in all, I just don't think it'd be a fun setting to play in. The Imperium falling and chaos ensuing? Sure; the Astartes are still there as they are meant to be, and so is the Inquisition. Most famous Guard regiments (Mordians, Valhallans, etc) will still be fine.

The Imperium falling and Chaos spreading everywhere, turning everyone into gibbering weirdos? No thanks. :P

Gensuke626
21-05-2008, 20:54
Bah - I covered this one ages ago. The Throne breaks and they get someone special in to fix it Message In A Bottle (www.incunabulum.co.uk/Message%20In%20A%20Bottle.htm).

Sholto

epic.

I almost laughed, which is high praise for me at this time of day...I'm posting from work see, and if I laugh they know I'm slacking...but I almost laughed...

Rynar
21-05-2008, 23:06
In typical GW fashion, the story will "progress" and nothing will change.

It is still Grim
It is still Dark
It is still the Far Future
There is still Only War

Not that I really want it to change that much mind you (but the starchild is a really nice plot device) but don't kid yourselves into believing that anything other than a few lines of fluff have changed. Everything moves sideways....not forward in 40K.

In what a setting would you like to play 40k?

It is Sunny
It is Light
It smells like flowers
Everyone likes each other

^^

My 2 cents? Leman Russ returns with the cure for the Emperor. And the "GodWars" start. The C'tan, the Emperor, The Chaos Gods, and whoever the rest of the Galaxy prays to :D
Now that would be bloody, no wonder GW released Apocalypse... You'l need it if you want to field the Emperor :angel:

the1stpip
21-05-2008, 23:53
I am fairly convinced that nothing will happen, although it could be an opening for some summer campaign.

Other ideas I have heard include the Satr god waking up on Mars, and causing some kind of havoc at this juncture.

But I have to agree, it would be nice to see a light at the end of the astronomicon for once for the Imperium.

Alltaken
22-05-2008, 00:47
Well some day they will bring back the emperor and the primarchs. All fluff directs there, and that glorious day will mean the Void Dragon will come from the depths of mars and holy freaking armaggeadon will reign supreme.

I guess by 2020 or so there might get to making this a reallity, it all depends on how sales how, campaings and development of the races take place, I mean necrons could make some drastic story changes all around and tau well, they could come up with something for them. Tyranids are still filled with mistery on some things. Sooner or later GW will be forced to make their fluff come true.

Lord Raneus
22-05-2008, 00:53
I sincerely doubt it, and in fact hope the overall storyline freezes at this point.
Simply inch along and focus on the exploits of individuals rather than factions as a whole. You've made your background too apocalyptic for anything else, GW.

lorbaat
22-05-2008, 15:26
I sincerely doubt it, and in fact hope the overall storyline freezes at this point.

Speaking as one of the biggest fans of the background for the 40K universe possible- there really is no reason to "advance the storyline". The Imperium gains planets/systems, it loses planets/systems.

Now replace "Imperium" with any other faction in the game- and if necessary, replace "planets/systems" with another resource.

If you really need to do something- like introduce the Tau- handle it just like they did: A combination of retroactive continuity (not as big a deal in the background for a game like this as in other areas) and mildly inching stuff forward 50-100 years, which is a drop in the bucket in 40K (where even regular human characters live extended lifespans).

Rosicrucian
22-05-2008, 16:41
The Golden Throne is broken? Time to get lootin'!

brain_dead_1st
22-05-2008, 16:42
I dunno, primarchs will come back only if sales are stooping low...
Before then we have to have the moment when the emperor wakes to say

"guys when i said only let the space marines use landraiders i meant while they are in short supply... and when i said kill chaos, i meant KILL them not just push them back, I mean, for my sake, an alliance with tau and eldar to finally put chaos out of the picture is not that heretical!! ... even guiding the nids into the warp would have been sensible, but nooooooo you guys sat around wondering if it was ok to clean your teeth with your left hand because that was not my way of doing things on the day I died"

resume coma, enter new period of warhammer 40k the last alliance years....
NOW enter primarchs of the white scars and imperial fists
Sanginius has a child who is one crazy mo fo, russ turns out to be gay after all, and the ultramarines primarch shows up, no body likes him so they all shoot him instead of each other and peace is restored

Partisan Rimmo
22-05-2008, 19:09
teh throne is totally broken guys!!!! zomfg throne spam is totally stupid!!! nerf throne!!!

Karhedron
22-05-2008, 20:06
The Golden Throne is broken? Time to get lootin'!
http://warseer.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=39562&d=1211470865


ROTFLMAO!!!! :D

Now I would love to see that model! :D

Slaaaaaanesh
23-05-2008, 00:44
From what I have heard from GW sources regarding this topic:

Apparently the emperor is well and truly dead and it is only his spirit that remains.

Also the astropath beacon at terra has been found to been on the fritz thereby sending many ships off course.

Copella
23-05-2008, 03:21
The campaign idea maybe already in the works. My local GW store is starting a campaign about "Imnos". It hasn't started yet, and not a lot of info has been released. I do know that the Orks that crashed into Imnos, when they both got ripped out of the warp, found something rather big. Big enough to get most of the Imperium turning their attention to it. This seems like a campaign designed for just our store. That being said, the story seems to be starting pretty close to the whole golden throne problem. Connected, prolly not. Tho it wouldn't be too far of a leap to connect them.

Here is some of the story so far:
http://halifax.gw-local.com/imnos-world-of-peril/

I play an Adepta Sororitas army, so whatever the "discovery" is the Inquisitors will more and likely to tell me to destroy it. All in all more fluff is more fluff. Its the stuff that inspires us to write new tales of sacrifice and heroics. New things for our evil counter parts to prevent us from doing, etc.

vlorlich
23-05-2008, 15:54
Bah - I covered this one ages ago. The Throne breaks and they get someone special in to fix it Message In A Bottle (www.incunabulum.co.uk/Message%20In%20A%20Bottle.htm).

Sholto

OMG! That is funny stuff!

Vepr
23-05-2008, 16:16
The problem started when they thought they had found an STC. Unfortunately it was Windows Vista. When they tried to upgrade the system they blue screened the Golden Throne. The IS-Magi are still working on it but things do not look good. The Ultramarines are being sent on a crusade to find XP service pack 3.

Spectral Dragon
24-05-2008, 11:50
The Golden Throne is broken? Time to get lootin'!

Wow, that was worth reading this whole thread to see!

Seriously? I wonder how big that throne is. I've read very little fluff regarding it, where would I start reading up on it?

Partisan Rimmo
25-05-2008, 21:32
I'm not entirely sure where you could read about it. Ask the Background board. As for size though, it's huge. It looks like a chair from on top, but it goes way down inside the palace with its workings.

Coasty
25-05-2008, 21:41
The Golden Throne is not broken, it's just operating in its alt-mode as a powerful GrimDark generator.

darknar
25-05-2008, 21:50
i thoughts on this are. the golden thrown did its job. it is effectivly a stasis device that also does several other things whilst its operational.

1. heals the user of throne
2. keeps the user of thone alive while he is being healed by mortal wound
3. keeps the holy light to navigate by alight
4. many other things i cant imagine

however. the only problem is the one instruction the emporor forgo to mention

"wake me up when that timer goes down to 00:00" as i should be fine and ready to go on the cruisade again. as well as go spank my naughty children.

only problem is the high lords of terra didnt get that order or chose to ignore it

:p

Grimtuff
25-05-2008, 22:00
Other ideas I have heard include the Satr god waking up on Mars, and causing some kind of havoc at this juncture.


They all worship a Goat Man. I knew it!

Big TM
25-05-2008, 22:43
Facts about The Palace and the Throne room:

a-the palace takes up most of the earth

b-it takes several months to walk across end to end

c-the throneroom takes a days walk to get across.

d-there are 2 imperator titans either side of the throne

e-the throne has an exact location: willow road, lenton-GW HQ, the board
room is where the high lords of terra sit. really, no joke.

f-hive fleet leviathan is coming from below up to segmentum solar, towards terra

g-leviathan will not succeed, there are 6 imperil fleets in constant patrol around Terra.

Speculation from me:
a-the mechanicus is gone renegade, something to do with the battle for the abyss, upcoming Horus Heresy book

b-the emperor and Lion, and starchild is all to do with Cypher

c-cypher is easily the coolest, most mysterious charachter in 40k

d-i think hes a good guy going to the throne room

e-he'll never get there without inside help

f-thinking about it, hed probably get there eventually, hes too cool not too

g-the emperorll wake up, and fix the lionsword, and call his primarchs back.

h-there is a big problem with Lion el Jonson, hell only wake up when he sees Luther... anyone see a flaw in that plan

i-if the custodes could be bothered to leave the emperors palace, they wouldnt need the emperor to keep the scum under control

j-custodes are cool, there should be more fluff on them

k-Chaos would be dead by now if the imperium lords wernt corrupt

l-the mechaicus should reveal some more secrets to the Lords of terra

m-Cypher should rule the imperium:D wooot

n-the dark angels treachery goes deeper than the fallen

o-they want to get rid of cypher so he cant tell anyone

p-cypher is the keeper of dark angels traditions

q-Cypher doesnt work for chaos, he id=s the hidden link for the emperor



SO PEOPLE, WHAT DYA THINK ABOUT THAT

Big TM
26-05-2008, 10:20
hmm, interesting???

Big TM
26-05-2008, 14:10
no more people interested? same, its a cool topic

Isoroku
26-05-2008, 14:49
The Throne is Broken, the navigation problems is a lot...

Koryphaus
26-05-2008, 15:13
They all worship a Goat Man. I knew it!

I had that exact same thought...

ChaosBeast
26-05-2008, 15:25
meh, my money is on the imperium finding the long lost STC tech, and figuring out a way to travel FTL without the warp.

i didnt think there ever was any, i thought the necrons were the only civilisation to develop faster than light travel and there tech is millions of years ahead of humanities. if the emperors throne breaks and he dies then humanities in deep s**t

FranticDaemon
26-05-2008, 15:33
All the talk about Cypher and Starchild reminds me of one post from 4chan:


As he strode up the seemingly endless stairs, he could hear the voices of those he had betrayed in his ears. Every one of them accused him but as he rose upwards, a single voice became louder over the others.

As he reached the throne that had for ages held his lord prisoner, he could hear only his voice anymore. "Return the blade... Compleate the circle... RELEASE ME FROM THIS PRISON!"

Roaring with might he swung his mighty sword and shatterd the throne.
Picking up the remains of his masters armour, he adorned them as the citadel around him collapsed.
In a moment of destiny, their voices united and called out: "NOW, WE ARE ONE!"

And then Cypher, the new God Emperor, sat down upon the shattered from of the Golden Throne, smiling, his destiny fulfilled.

(To those who don't get this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OW02BWFRnkw)

It fits so well it's scary...

Orinoco
26-05-2008, 15:46
i didnt think there ever was any, i thought the necrons were the only civilisation to develop faster than light travel and there tech is millions of years ahead of humanities. if the emperors throne breaks and he dies then humanities in deep s**t

There is. In the horus heresy art books they retconned some background about the golden throne. The original purpose for it was to serve as a gate to the webway. this is how the eldar travel through space without needing to go through the warp. However, it all came crashing down when magnus sent his psychic message warning the emperor about horus's betrayal which destroyed all the runes of protection that prevented demons from pouring in through the gate.

I imagine all this was retconned (except the eldar's mode of transport which has been part of the background for a long time) because everybody was wondering how the throne was built so darn quickly after the emperor had fisticuffs with horus.

ChaosBeast
26-05-2008, 16:06
yes, but the webway is another dimension like the warp, its just halfway between the empyrean and the real world. i.e. still technically not FTL

downundercadet07
26-05-2008, 16:49
I'm confused, so the Golden Throne is in Britain, but the Astronomicon is in Tibet? I guess he doesn't have to be right on top of the thing to steer it but still, I thought he would be a little bit closer to it. Also-- if all the seas are boiled off is it perpetually raining there? Like it did when the earth was brand-new? Because that would be cool.

Here is MY Cypher theory for the interested parties. I won't lie, it pretty much rocks.
http://www.40konline.com/community/index.php?topic=135005.0

Pious Hearts
26-05-2008, 17:40
If the Golden Throne is out of order - the Emperor may have to look around for a portaloo cabin....

brain_dead_1st
26-05-2008, 21:48
so the emperor needs someone to wake him, the lords are corrupt and wont do it, cypher holds the alarm clock given the DAs to wake the emperor, due to go off when the school holidays were over.

killa kan kaus
26-05-2008, 22:44
When the 40k universe moves only slightly faster then the real one it maybe time for a serious fluff advance. I think the golden throne is broken and if the emperor wakes up then I am sure GW will find an equal obstacle for him (more Ctan? MegaWaaagh? Daemonic infestation?).

MasterDecoy
27-05-2008, 07:17
yes, but the webway is another dimension like the warp, its just halfway between the empyrean and the real world. i.e. still technically not FTL

I thought the tau could too, cause the warp scares them to no end (but it doesnt get you very far)

Big TM
27-05-2008, 07:51
The emperor wanted to have Magnus power the web portal (like thats not gona kill him) with his psychic energy. The Emperor got a little angry when e broke the damn thing. He didnt listen to the message but instead took Magnus for a traitor. Poor guy...

Big TM
27-05-2008, 08:03
Here is MY Cypher theory for the interested parties. I won't lie, it pretty much rocks.
http://www.40konline.com/community/index.php?topic=135005.0

I love your theory, but I have to disappoint you.

Cypher was one of the knights of caliban. He was the tradition keeper of one of their orders. Cypher is a title, not a name. He became Cypher after the old oe died, just before the Emperor came. After some campaighning, the Lion went off with half the DAs on The Crusade. Leaving the other half, Cypher, Luther included, On caliban.

Its not really luthers fault what happened on Caliban. The Lion left his best friend behind when he went on Crusade. Luther was in a mess after that. The Lion didnt trust him anymore and their relationship fell apart caus of the Lion. No one knows who The CYpher is, but hell know all the DA secrets.

Thats all taken ffrom Descent of Angels, though no quotes

Briareos
27-05-2008, 08:33
This is more for the fluff forums, but just so everyone is on the same page;

The Webway is part of the Warp, but protected by psychic shields. It is often described as tunnels through the Warp. Technically, it allows for faster-than-light travel since you can get from point A to point B through the webway faster than light in real-space.

The Tau use warp-travel, but have not the light of the Astronomican. Thus they are only able to make short jumps before having to hop back into real space to get their bearings. For reminders, Tau have next to zero warp-signature and are thus somewhat protected against demons and Warp entities who have difficulties "seeing" them.

Shinzui
27-05-2008, 09:16
The Tau use warp-travel, but have not the light of the Astronomican. Thus they are only able to make short jumps before having to hop back into real space to get their bearings. For reminders, Tau have next to zero warp-signature and are thus somewhat protected against demons and Warp entities who have difficulties "seeing" them.

No, as per the BFG book they never enter the warp but skim the barrier between it and the material universe. They get the time benefits of warp travel without the danger. You can download the book with Tau space background from the specialist games website.

Big TM
27-05-2008, 20:32
what books that?

ryng_sting
27-05-2008, 20:43
Re the faulty Golden Throne. An AM calls up about it:

"Have you tried switching it off and back on again...?"

Lord Raneus
27-05-2008, 20:57
No, as per the BFG book they never enter the warp but skim the barrier between it and the material universe. They get the time benefits of warp travel without the danger. You can download the book with Tau space background from the specialist games website.

They get a speed boost, but I don't think they go as fast and they are dependent on warp rifts, are they not?

Big TM
29-05-2008, 09:57
Re the faulty Golden Throne. An AM calls up about it:

"Have you tried switching it off and back on again...?"

Thats a thought, aand knowing the High Lords, they probably avent.

Or they pulled the plug 'accidentally' not knowing the consequeces

Radioactive Bob
29-05-2008, 10:26
You know, i don't think anything gonna happen, and that the Emporer is still alive in his chair, and that all this talk of doom is just a way for a certain company to buy their products.Why do we have to look further than whats presented to us?

Big TM
30-05-2008, 06:17
becos its interesting

Herebror
30-05-2008, 13:27
Who cares! Nids are going to absorb him anyway ;)

Colonel Jacka
30-05-2008, 13:37
well it looks to me like the Human race has been getting thoroughly shafted for quite some time, so I think they're just about ready to drop a big human bomb in the story. Be it the Return of the Emperor, the return of the Primarchs, the revealing of the Sensei Knights... whatever in might be I think the Human Card will be played in the opening years of the 42nd Millenium and while it may be a powerful event it will have consequences (because as humans we always get something wrong).

There's enough evidence for those willing to look for it about the possibilities of the future but we won't know until they pull the finger out and go with it.

:eyebrows: Or the birth of the Star Child, Pius re-incanted and Cypher finally admits who he is and saves the Star Child with the help of Pius. :D


i didnt think there ever was any, i thought the necrons were the only civilisation to develop faster than light travel and there tech is millions of years ahead of humanities. if the emperors throne breaks and he dies then humanities in deep s**t

No the Squat Explorer Fleets have it! :eyebrows:

Varath- Lord Impaler
30-05-2008, 13:59
In my view, Cypher is a Daemon, along with the Watchers in the Dark.

The Dark Angels guilt was so strong that they created a minor warp entity. Watchers in the Dark follow high ranking Dark Angels since they know the truth, and their Guilt is strongest. They can only survive near to the emotion they Embody.

Cypher, however, is difference, he is the greater daemon, of sorts. He is the most powerful Entity spawned by this warp entity.

philipdgilbert
30-05-2008, 19:49
Cypher is McLovin, sorry, McGuffin, as someone said long ago.

The star child stuff is gone, i heard, they got rid it of it with Eye of Terror campaign when the 'he's getting closer to earth' was changed to 'he's playing bait to get the dark angels involved'

As for the golden throne, one of the guys from the Poole store suggested that the Emperor is not dead, he is alive, kicking **** and he alone is holding back the daemons in the portal in eternal combat, and that the throne is keeping him alive. The astronomicon is something completely different/seperate, and not in it at all, the same way the queen/president doesn't run the highways department.

cowzrnomatoh
31-05-2008, 06:09
Wait a Second...
The high Lords of Terra are barley keeping him alive on the The Throne. So that He cant actually do anything and the Lords can still keep their spots in the system. He they do pull the plug the spirit kills the great hive mind and is then reincarnated. Or something along the lines of that.

AngryAngel
31-05-2008, 07:22
Huh? This sounds strangely familiar actually: Waaay back in 1996, a friend of mine heard a rumour that GW was playtesting rules for something called '50K'. The premise being a time after the Imperium had crumbled.

Now the suggestion was that most of the Imperium had either fallen to chaos or was holed up fighting a rearguard battle for survival.
Now a few things were a little contrived, because of the greater concentration of Chaos in the galaxy most of the space marine chapters had mutated to some extent even if they hadn't turned to worship chaos. Blood Angels had given in to the Red Thirst, Space Wolves had all become Wulfen. The only chapter to remain untouched by chaos was the Dark Angels, because of their self inflicted penance.
Nothing was specifically said about any of the other chapters but at that time they were all lumped in with the Ultramarines codex.
Little was said about the Orks and Tyranids other than they were rampaging unchecked throughout the galaxy, Eldar had been all but wiped out. Being 1996, there were no Tau and the Necrons were still in a very experimental stage so nothing had been written, or leaked, about them.


Of course chaos would not taint the DA. They are beyond chaos, and when it all crumbles down will be the only thing that stands between humanity and oblivion. The final bastion that will wage a desperate final campaign in humanitys dieing hours. There will be no retreat, no surrender it will be victory or death.

Now that would be cool, but not too likely. Seriously though I think humanity will come out on top. They've got that spirit of humanity on their side. A powerfull force that helps all humans everywhere survive even when greatly besieged, outmatched and woefully ill equipped. Just watch any movie, spirit of humanity = the win.

D.J.
31-05-2008, 22:47
DA = Chaos Undivided.



They were sitting on the fence during the HH.

The Fallen are loyalists.

AngryAngel
01-06-2008, 02:58
You speak heresy. If you were here I would destroy you personally for your slight to our honor.

StrikerFox
01-06-2008, 11:03
ill call a plumber... okay?

Colonel Jacka
01-06-2008, 22:01
Great Avatar StrikerFox. Must be Military?

Lisiecki
01-06-2008, 22:18
No

There was A knight, on Caliban, who was the keeper of traditions who was called Cypher.
That may, or may not be the same Cypher that is running around the universe in 40ks present.
My father was in the uninted stated army, his name is Norman.
The General who commanded american forces in the first Iraq war, is named Norman.
They are not the same norman



I love your theory, but I have to disappoint you.

Cypher was one of the knights of caliban. He was the tradition keeper of one of their orders. Cypher is a title, not a name. He became Cypher after the old oe died, just before the Emperor came. After some campaighning, the Lion went off with half the DAs on The Crusade. Leaving the other half, Cypher, Luther included, On caliban.

Its not really luthers fault what happened on Caliban. The Lion left his best friend behind when he went on Crusade. Luther was in a mess after that. The Lion didnt trust him anymore and their relationship fell apart caus of the Lion. No one knows who The CYpher is, but hell know all the DA secrets.

Thats all taken ffrom Descent of Angels, though no quotes

DarkAzrael169
02-06-2008, 02:22
This is all completely off topic but... It dosen't matter who THIS Cypher is. It might not be the same Cypher who was present during the HH. Cypher is just a title. Think of a marathon were one runner passes off the rod(Information, secrets, life mission) to the next runner.

Big TM
02-06-2008, 06:12
Who cares! Nids are going to absorb him anyway ;)
The nids arent getting anwhere near him. Really. Leviathan may be moving in on Solar, but they aint getting anywhere near Terra, not with 6 fleets constantly stationed there. AND Mars with the Titan Legions.

In my view, Cypher is a Daemon, along with the Watchers in the Dark.

The Dark Angels guilt was so strong that they created a minor warp entity. Watchers in the Dark follow high ranking Dark Angels since they know the truth, and their Guilt is strongest. They can only survive near to the emotion they Embody.

Cypher, however, is difference, he is the greater daemon, of sorts. He is the most powerful Entity spawned by this warp entity.

Ummm...have you read descent of Angels?

The watchers existed before the Emperor came to Caliban. They speak of a taint in the world. The beasts of Caliban are a carnation of this taint, but their all gone now:p

Lisiecki
02-06-2008, 06:53
Or, It may be a Marine whos name was Jim Cypher.
The implication from Cypher's backs troy has always implied it was the same being.



This is all completely off topic but... It dosen't matter who THIS Cypher is. It might not be the same Cypher who was present during the HH. Cypher is just a title. Think of a marathon were one runner passes off the rod(Information, secrets, life mission) to the next runner.

Lisiecki
02-06-2008, 07:00
double post

Abaddonshand
04-06-2008, 00:53
"POTENTIAL SPOILER"

theorise that as in Descent of Angels, we have the concept that Cypher is a title, and said Knight who is given this title loses his individual name and is charged with keeping the traditions and morals alive. Without giving too much away, at the time of Decsent of Angels, i.e from before the Lion's discovery on Caliban to the point where he dismissed Luther, the current Lord Cypher, and the book's main character, et al, only ONE single Dark Angel had ever encountered the Watchers in the Dark (that being said main chracter). I recon that had Descent of Angels continued on to the time of the fall, we would have seen the main character being promoted to the position of Lord Cypher, and hence being the Cypher we all know and love/ hate that has some unfinished business with the Emperor, after all, the main character (sorry, can't remember his name) and the Emperor had a "moment" of psychic bonding IIRC during the book.

neophryte
04-06-2008, 01:09
Man... how about a spoiler heading somewhere near the beginning of your post... sigh...

Colonel Jacka
04-06-2008, 13:57
This is all completely off topic but... It dosen't matter who THIS Cypher is. It might not be the same Cypher who was present during the HH. Cypher is just a title. Think of a marathon were one runner passes off the rod(Information, secrets, life mission) to the next runner.


Don't think so. Cypher is and has always been Cypher! There is nothing that suggest anything different.

Abaddonshand
04-06-2008, 23:45
Man... how about a spoiler heading somewhere near the beginning of your post... sigh...

Warning added, sorry bout that, although tbh I didn't think I was spoiling much in the way of plot lines of Descent of Angels.

Abaddonshand
04-06-2008, 23:46
Don't think so. Cypher is and has always been Cypher! There is nothing that suggest anything different.

Descent of Angels states different.

Alltaken
06-06-2008, 23:11
why i'm wondering is the state of his imperial's **** from certain milenia of being sitting on the golden throne?

lorbaat
06-06-2008, 23:39
why i'm wondering is the state of his imperial's **** from certain milenia of being sitting on the golden throne?

Well, one woman's skin fused to a toilet seat after she sat on it for only two years-

http://discovermagazine.com/2008/mar/14-how-the-heck-did-a-woman-become-fused-to-a-toilet-seat

I'd have to imagine after 10,000 years it would be more severe.