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Sinew
20-10-2005, 12:01
I'm pretty sure I know the answer to this but I want to know how other people read it. Eternal guard are stubborn if joined by a Highborn/Noble. A stubborn unit cannot use the leadership of a non-stubborn character if they want to retain the benefit of stubborn. Eternal guard have Ld 9, so if joined by a Highborn they would either be able to use his Ld 10 with modifiers from combat resolution (obviously pointless) or their own Ld 9 unmodified because they are stubborn. If the Highborn had the Eternal Guard kindred, would that make him stubborn too, and thus allow a Ld10 stubborn unit?

Avian
20-10-2005, 12:04
Nope, it wouldn't. The Eternal Guard Kindred gives him Eternal Guard fighting style, it doesn't mention anything about making him Stubborn.

Griefbringer
20-10-2005, 14:50
Stubborn unit with Ld 10 would be rather demanding to break (there being a 3/36 chance to roll 11 or 12 on d6)!

Dooppie
20-10-2005, 18:37
I say Ld 9...it's the Eternal Guard unit that protect the noble/high born even it's having the same kindred. The Eternal Guard of the charackter gives the special fighting rule.

Now I have a question about the stubborn Eternal guard:
1 noble/high born is standing in Eternal guard unit.
The unit is stubborn...now the chrackter have the item 'Gwytherc's Horn' and use it...does the unit loose the stubborness for one turn. (the unit loose stubborness for 1 turn if they are immume of Phychology)

Avian
20-10-2005, 20:20
If the horn makes the unit Immune to Psychology for a turn, then Yes, they would not be stubborn for that turn.

Some may call that silly - I suggest you complain to the author of the army book.

Ganymede
21-10-2005, 05:05
I agree; I always wondered why Stubborn wasn't a special rule.

I always figured it was an artifact of splitting 5th edition Hatred into two seperate entities.

Sinew
21-10-2005, 16:31
Presumably it's a psychological effect rather than a special rule because stubborn and immunity to fear/terror/panic makes a unit all but unbreakable; depending on its leadership of course. Admittedly High Elves can still manage this to some extent by putting the Lion Standard on a Lion Guard unit led by a Pure of Heart character who is the general, but I think this is a one-off.

samw
28-10-2005, 01:38
Isn't the eternal guard issue the same as the dwarven one regarding hammerers? In every game I've played the stunties have been stubborn on LD10, have I been cheated or is there a denoted difference in the bodyguard rules?

NakedFisherman
28-10-2005, 01:56
It's psychology so that effects which make things Immune to Psychology are not wasted. Standard of Balance, for instance. Or the Slaanesh spell that makes a unit Frenzied.

Army book designers can always elect to make an exemption (ex. Plague Cencer Bearers) if they wish.

Flame
28-10-2005, 10:17
Isn't the eternal guard issue the same as the dwarven one regarding hammerers? In every game I've played the stunties have been stubborn on LD10, have I been cheated or is there a denoted difference in the bodyguard rules?

It depends on whether the dwarf lord had the MR of Kingship, which makes the bearer, as well as his unit Stubborn. In this case you would be stubborn on a 10, as the character has it as well.

IIRC, the hammerer bodyguard rule only makes the unit stubborn, not the character, stubborn.

god octo
29-10-2005, 20:02
no, as the highborn is still not stubborn, so they would use thier ld value, not his.