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View Full Version : 4k vampire list advise plz



Gharof von Carstein
31-05-2008, 11:04
hey all! im a beginning player that started playing vc. im trying to make a good 4k army against OK and empire. i dont have my book handy so this is from memory. advise plz.

4k vc:

lords
count mannfred w/ barded nightmare, skull staff, book of arkhan = 595 points
vamp lord w/ zombie dragon, MotBA, forbidden lore, dark acolyte, blooddrinker, helm of com. (armour idea?) = 730p

chars
2x vampire w/ ghoulkin, summon ghouls, helm = 340p
wight lord mounted, BSB banner drakenhof, sword killing blow 5+ = 225p (not sure correct me if im wrong)

rare
blood knights (5) full command, BoBK = 450p (again not sure)
varghulf = 175p

core
skeletons (20) w/ spears, command = 225
skeletons (20) command = 205
ghouls (20) w/ ghast x2 = 336p
dire wolves (5) x2 = 80p
corpse cart x2 w/ lodestone (1) and balefire (1) = 200p

special
graveguard (20) command, march banner(15p?) = 285p(not sure)

this leaves me 110p for errors. sorry but i lent out my book so im guessing

the eater of pie
31-05-2008, 14:04
you can only have 1 of each magic item. also there is no need for 2 ghoulkin. the list seems to be quite low in numbers.

Chaplainmasters
31-05-2008, 14:09
In my opinion you should have the whole von carstein family in 4k,

Gharof von Carstein
31-05-2008, 18:47
i dont have isabella but adding vlad is too costly. im already low on unit sizes and konrad is too flaky. any other advice?

Death Korp
31-05-2008, 18:51
I'd say more infantry, and more calvary (like Black Knights), as you will get outflanked with ease.

DK

Fire Harte
31-05-2008, 18:59
Zombies are useful at 4 points each and you can get bucket loads.
I think Vlad Is way cheaper than your 790 point vanpire lord and that means you can increase the number of characters and troops in your army. More Vamps means more magic and Isabella is cheap and Konrad is a combat monstor, your should consider the von carsteins as they are very capable characters. More dire wolves and another vargulf can be used to quickly dispose war machines and release anything like fanatics. In 4k points you should have a lot more troops and if you dont you'll be outnumbered.

Gharof von Carstein
31-05-2008, 22:55
im not cutting the dragon for a reason. with his fly ill be able to make full use of the helm. not to mention take out pesky war machines. and with the magic setup between him and mannfred ill dominate the magic phase. in that phase ill summon extra guys or make a nice zombie anvil to crack fleeing units on. the ok player will get caught by this after which ill hope to have taken out warmachines after which ill replenish and swarm. thats the plan at least. i could maybe ride 2 necro on the carts

Sarael
01-06-2008, 07:36
You need 2 more Core infantry blocks: Wolves and Carts don't count.

Your BSB can't have both a magic banner AND the SoK.

The dragon isn't worth the points: susceptible to crumble when off alone, and easy cannon fodder. Now, stick a WD/BSB/WB/DK Vamp on a hellsteed, and you've got a cheaper, more versatile, more effective choice.

Gharof von Carstein
01-06-2008, 18:08
oke so I got my book back and took a look at the mistakes I made. which I have to say were a lot. But hey Im a beginner so that was to be expected. I revamped the list (no pun intended) after the several good advices I got from you guys. So, instead of making a new thread here is the new list. hope you guys can agree with this one.

Lords
Mannfred: nightmare/barding, skull staff and book of arkhan = 595p
Vlad = 490p

Heroes
Vampire: hellsteed, Dread Knight, Walking death, BSB SoD = 320p
Vampire: helm of commandment, ghoulkin, summon ghouls, enchanted shield = 185p
Wight king: nightmare/barding, lance, sword of kings = 132p
Konrad von carstein = 145p
Isabella von carstein = 90p (just won one on ebay for 4 bucks)

Core
Ghouls x15 w/ ghast = 128p
Ghouls x15 w/ ghast = 128p
Ghouls x20 w/ ghast = 168p
Skeletons x 20 w/ spears, full command, banner of endless nightmare = 225p
Skeletons x 20, full command, banner of the dead legion = 205p
Dire wolves x5 = 40p
Dire wolves x5 = 40p
Corpse cart w/ lodestone = 100p
Corpse cart w/ balefire = 100p

Special
Grave guard x20, full command, banner of the strigoi = 305p

Rare
Varghulf = 175p
Blood knights x5, full command, banner of blood keep = 400p
Cairn wraith x4 = 200p

total = 3996

I think this might be a bit bulkier. maybe ill drop a cart and a wraith for some fell bats but I havent made up my mind about that. (would mean buying bats)

so this any better? keep in mind im rather new at this. any good advice will be appreciated.

wolfenstein
01-06-2008, 19:02
you don't need the dire wolves there crap use the points to bulk out the grave gaurd
unit. but yeah much better.

Gharof von Carstein
01-06-2008, 20:52
think ill take out the wolves for bats and something else for bats. I kind of need those easy war machine hunters.

isidril93
01-06-2008, 20:59
2nd list is better than before but get some bats

Gharof von Carstein
01-06-2008, 21:28
any idea what to drop to fit them in. dropping the wolves gives me acces to 4 of them. what else?

Sarael
02-06-2008, 08:38
6 Infantry blocks is overkill: I'd drop the GG myself, but then I don't like expensive infantry w/ 1 attack, even if it IS a KB attack.

Wolves are good. Bats are good. Both aren't really necessary, though they have their uses. Wolves are worth the 40 pts when they negate that rank bonus.

Using both ghouls and skeletons in the same army is usually a bad idea. Better to go with one type. As you have Manfred (he's my obligatory 2nd Lord in 3k+) I suggest Skeletons, and let him do the raising. A basic vamp lord can be the helm bearer, who uses offensive magic, and has WS 7.

What do you mean by SoD on your BSB Vamp?

Isabella, Vlad, and Konrad should be the front line of the spear skeleton unit, which should hold your center against pretty much anything.

Against magic light opponents, screen your KoBK with Wraiths. They're also a nice combo: Wraiths attack the front, Knights into the flank, if you can pull it off.

No scroll caddie at 4k... shame on you. Even dwarves take a "scroll caddie" runesmith at 4k.

Gharof von Carstein
02-06-2008, 10:31
sod is standard of drakenhof. kinda didnt think id need a scroll caddie but thats just my opinion. dropping the GG is a big nuh uh. and the reason why I go both skellingtons and ghouls is that I think they both have their uses and I cant pull off 80+ ghouls (if I could id do it in a hardbeat let me tell ya) because I dont have the models and money.

Malorian
03-06-2008, 12:58
The FAQ says a vampire with dreadknight must be on a barded nightmare, so you unfortunately can't put him on the hellsteeed.

I'm not a fan of dire wolves. Personally I think it's more reliable to just summon ghouls when you need to redirect/marchblock/take quarters (if that's what you are using them for) but the models do look cool.

The helm vampire will probably be hiding from combat (so he can use the helm) so the shield is probably not needed.

The bloodknights and cairnwraiths would be better if they were a bit bigger. At 4 wraiths you can't be sure you'll do enough damage to be able to take on blocks by themselves. If you could cut the points to get to 6 or 7 that would be best. Five bloodknights are good, but at 4000 they are going to take all the firepower and go down quickly. (From the look of it I'm assuming that you use the wraiths to block LOS to the knights, but I'm sure in a big game like this there will be a hill.) To get the points to make them both bigger there isn't much you can drop (already at min troops) so I would pick one or the other.

Overall the list should be fine and really the main thing you are going for here is the fluff anyway with the whole family involved (which I think it great). It should be a lot of fun to play with, but now and then you might want to see what regular customizable vampires you can make for the same points.

Gharof von Carstein
03-06-2008, 13:30
my main reason was indeed to go for fluff. the other is that this is basically everything i own.. :P

i do have the zombies units to raise up. i dont have more blood knights but will be expecting one or 2 units for my birthday along with some black knights. how are you standing on the whole fell bat discussion? are they a go or a no go? i might cut the hellsteed for a normal barded nightmare in that case seeing as the ability is pretty crucial to keep him alive the flying rule would also hurt him joining units so thats a problem solved. ill probably hang my units back behind some cover to raise them up before I try and take on the main forces but this will put the emphasis on hunting cannons early so I dont get shot up to bits while the ogres move up.

its tricky but im gonna try to puzzle it out. thx for the great advice!

Malorian
03-06-2008, 14:44
I'm not a fan of fell bats as I feel that they can be wiped out too easily. Normally I don't care about warmachines because they can't kill faster than I can raise.

In this army it might be a good option though and if you take out the wolves it would free up the points for that.

Gharof von Carstein
04-06-2008, 09:38
thx ill look into it and make a new list soon.

Gharof von Carstein
05-06-2008, 08:56
Did some reorganising and this is what I came up with.

Lords
Mannfred: nightmare/barding, skull staff and book of arkhan = 595p
Vlad = 490p

Heroes
Vampire: nightmare, Dread Knight, Walking death, BSB SoD = 308p
Vampire: helm of commandment, ghoulkin, summon ghouls, enchanted shield = 185p
Wight king: nightmare/barding, sword of kings, lance = 132p
Konrad von carstein = 145p
Isabella von carstein = 90p (just won one on ebay for 4 bucks)

Core
Ghouls x15 w/ ghast = 128p
Ghouls x15 w/ ghast = 128p
Ghouls x20 w/ ghast = 168p
Skeletons x 20 w/ spears, full command, banner of endless nightmare = 225p
Skeletons x 20, full command, banner of the dead legion = 205p
Corpse cart w/ lodestone = 100p
Corpse cart w/ balefire = 100p

Special
Grave guard x20, full command, banner of the strigoi = 305p
Fell bats x3 = 60p
Fell bats x3 = 60p

Rare
Varghulf = 175p
Blood knights x5, full command, banner of blood keep = 400p

total = 3999

its not so great that I cant cover the blood knights anymore but I guess the varghulf will have to do. the 2 small units of fell bats are needed to annoy, flank and take care of those pesky warmachines early on. its also great that manny can raise them beyond their starting sizes. So what do you guys think?

Fire Harte
05-06-2008, 17:53
Excellent, the army has lots of bulk to it, meaning you won't be outnumbered.I think you could do with a few dispel scrolls though. But I think that the 6 vampires is excellent. I recently played a Vampire count army with my Orc and Gobbo horde and because I dominated the magic phases I denied him the chance of being outnumbered and outdone, (the guy was quite distressed with his defeat). So take a few dispel scrolls to bolster your magic defence.

The Clairvoyant
05-06-2008, 18:09
I'd give both corpse carts balefire as in conjunction, they almost remove the need for dispel scrolls. As i said, "almost". Take a single scroll. Thats all i've ever needed in my 4k point games. And seeing as you'll be facing ogres, plumping a -2 on their to cast rolls means you'll never need that scroll!

Second point is in regard to your wight king. You've given him a magic weapon and a lance. Under the magic weapon rules, you won't be able to use your lance so you need to decide which you want to go for

And lastly, this is more of a personal taste thing, but i really dislike varghulfs. So with your fluffy all-carstein list, i'd go for a black coach. Sit it next to a couple of vamps and it'll be immune to pansy empire and dumb ogre attacks in no time!

Good luck with it :)

Gharof von Carstein
05-06-2008, 23:48
id like to use the coach but regretably i dont own one :S well it will be my birthday in a month so maybe later :P

the thing about the lance is I have no idea what to add for those 13 remaining points. I could add 2 ghouls and put myself 3 over but there will be whining from opponents ill bet. guess i might add a scroll and go 2 over... there's a thought :) if the whining still wont stop ill shave the barding off the wight's nightmare that costs only 5 and ill be 3 points under which is acceptable.

ill let you guys know how this works out! most of the units have been assembled and painted and look great (got a whole dark blue theme going on)

Gharof von Carstein
09-06-2008, 14:12
hey all. after whiping the floor with the OK player one on one he has decided to take orcs & goblins instead. all i know is that he has a lot of fast cavalry, skarsnik and the contents of a O&G spearhead. does this change anything? should i make changes to my list?