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Vedar
02-06-2008, 21:45
Right now what would you say are the Top 5 competitive armies and the bottom 5 armies?

From a tournament perspective.

I don't see many games played so I'm just curious.

Malorian
02-06-2008, 21:50
Well the main thing you want is dependability. With that in mind:

Vampire counts, tomb kings.

Then after that you want to look at armies with the most potentially nasty builds:

Empire, skaven, dwarfs.

Lordsaradain
02-06-2008, 22:42
Most competative: High Elves, Wood Elves, Dwarves, Vampire Counts, Bretonnia, Chaos Daemons(?)

Least: Warriors of Chaos, Beast of Chaos, Ogre Kingdoms, Dark Elves, Orcs and Goblins

huitzilopochtli
02-06-2008, 22:55
from my own experience i'd put the WEs the VCs and the dwarves in the top 5, and i'd put the tomb kings in the bottom five. can't really say anything for the rest.

Kahadras
02-06-2008, 22:58
Most competative: High Elves, Wood Elves, Dwarves, Vampire Counts, Bretonnia, Chaos Daemons(?)

You missed Empire. Karl Franz + 2 steam tanks + gunline = highly competitive in my book.

Kahadras

Lordsaradain
02-06-2008, 23:40
You missed Empire. Karl Franz + 2 steam tanks + gunline = highly competitive in my book.

Kahadras

Yes but that army is a one trick pony, and tbh stanks arn't even that great. The empire army as a whole isn't one of the most competative, it's fairly average I'd say.

Tarliyn
03-06-2008, 02:07
sorry to hijack thread for a second but the way that this forum over values steam tanks really boggles my mind.

Yeah it is hard to wound but once it even takes one would it becomes drastically less useful. So if you see two of them get a wound or two on each then take your time killing them as they won't be doing much for the rest of that game.

I do think the army list is kinda silly as well due to the one trick pony aspect of it and due to the reason that it basically spits in the face of the lore lol

sorry /rantover

DevianID
03-06-2008, 04:37
My top 5, in order
1) Heavy Magic VC
2) Thorek Anvil Dwarf gunline
3) High Elves with special characters
4) Empire with dual Stanks and special characters
5) Heavy Magic Tomb Kings

Worst armies
1) wood elves in big games (3k+)
2) Dark elves
3) Skaven
4) Beastman
5) The new WD Warriors of Chaos in big games (3k+)
6) Lizardman

Wood elves in big games always seem to die to magic heavy lists that bring 18 power dice--I have never seen a good wood elf army with enough dispel to counter uber magic.

The new warriors of chaos have so few options that at 3k there simply isnt enough good magic items left, and with none of their old banners at all and only one of each chosen units, you either get out fought or out magic'd and definately outshot by every other army out there. Though chosen knights of Khorne still rock, new units like the steam tank or blood knights devestate them when charging, and units like wraiths simply cant be hurt at all, and anvils of doom make it impossible to get across the board.

Kahadras
03-06-2008, 06:23
Yes but that army is a one trick pony, and TBH stanks arn't even that great. The empire army as a whole isn't one of the most competative, it's fairly average I'd say.

Most of the top five armies are one trick. Dwarfs have a Thorek gunline, Wood elves have the Treesurfing forest spirit army, High elves have their double dragon, Bretonnians have their RAF.

If the army isn't great then it wouldn't do so well in tournamnets but IIRC at least two of the last three GTUK heats were won by an Empire army that contained 2 stanks and it's probably the most complained about unit in the new Empire book.

Kahadras

KUMA
03-06-2008, 06:44
I would say Daemons is in the top 5 for sure, players in my area wont even play against them anymore

tiass
03-06-2008, 11:11
Some of you have definatly missed out on some really competitive daemon gaming. VC and daemons is definatly the top 2 armies in the game at the present time.
Every army is competitive if the playing style and skill is adapted, many thinks, (including me), that DE is one of the bottom 3 armies there is, (along with DoW and ogres), but DE is still winning major tournaments on a regular basis, in real life it all depends on your gaming enviroment, how the gaming groups, tournament organises balances the armies, but ofcourse, if all your mates play 27 PD tzeentch armies, take up a physical hobby instead, and take it out on them by the old fashioned way ;)

Aflo
03-06-2008, 11:30
I think I'll wait and see a few games played before I damn the get-you-by warriors list as terrible. Some things in that list look pretty solid, as much as I dislike saying it.

lordkull
03-06-2008, 11:39
It appears that if you just go backwards on the book releases you will have your answer .
Deamons
vamps
high elvis's[dont be cruel]
empire
not orcs though
Id also add bretts and woodelves
And some people still dont believe in power creep

and most certainly not the new get you by list in white dwarf although its not as nerfed as I first thought

Ward.
03-06-2008, 13:39
Strongest:

Daemons
Vampire counts
high elves
wood elves
brettonians

Weakest:

Tomb kings
dark elves
Beast if chaos
ogre kingdoms
orcs and goblins

Explanation: The strongest were chosen because it's consistently hard to make a weak list and they can function perfectly well against their lesser counterparts without a one trick build.

The tomb kings and dark elves are in the weakest section because they generally require a lot of well timed moves to make the most of their strengths.

kroq'gar
03-06-2008, 13:48
Whers the lizardmen in this?

Malcador
03-06-2008, 13:51
In the jungle

Storak
03-06-2008, 15:30
It appears that if you just go backwards on the book releases you will have your answer .
Deamons
vamps
high elvis's[dont be cruel]
empire
not orcs though
Id also add bretts and woodelves
And some people still dont believe in power creep

and most certainly not the new get you by list in white dwarf although its not as nerfed as I first thought

this post delivers!

add in a couple of the late lists from the last edition, anyd you ve got your list...

ZeroTwentythree
03-06-2008, 16:04
The tomb kings and dark elves are in the weakest section because they generally require a lot of well timed moves to make the most of their strengths.

On the other hand, a TK army in the hands of a capable general can be pretty fearsome, if you ask me. More so than DE. I wouldn't rank TK in the "weakest" category -- but that's just my opinion.

Aflo
03-06-2008, 16:21
needs deleting.

Aflo
03-06-2008, 16:22
On the other hand, a TK army in the hands of a capable general can be pretty fearsome, if you ask me. More so than DE. I wouldn't rank TK in the "weakest" category -- but that's just my opinion.

It depends on what point level we're talking about here. Tomb Kings really aren't that competative at anything under 2k but as mentioned, can be really very powerful in the hands of a skillful general, specifically in games of 2k+.

lordkull
03-06-2008, 16:34
All this is also subjective
Is it a take on all comers army ??
for a tournament or event ??

Is there a comp system ?
Veteran or noob ??
I know I can wipe up the floor with my Tzeentch beastmen against a noob but will have a bit harder time wiping up the floor with a Vet :)
so daemons
vamps magic heavy
high elves
empire
Bretts
woodies
then lizzies
weakest imho :
orcs
ogres
beasts
darklelves
and newbie tombkings *note
*Tomb kings in the hands of a veteran are a fantastic army

Dwarves are actually both the best and worst
The best in regards to troops hard cr weilding troops with awesome firepower and great resilance with rock hard charectors
and the worst at actually being able to take table quarters move into position and flexability