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Damocles8
07-06-2008, 23:14
Situation: GUO casts his ws 1; bs 1 etc. etc. on himself. Enemy character has a magic item that confers WS 10; what takes precedence, the spell or the item?

Laurela
07-06-2008, 23:16
I'd say GUO's spell has priority

Damocles8
07-06-2008, 23:21
why? there is nothing in the BRB and nothing in either item that overrides the other....

theunwantedbeing
07-06-2008, 23:31
What magical item is it?
If it's the armour of agiluf...then the armour takes prescedence as it says it takes presedence.

Damocles8
08-06-2008, 05:44
yes it would be the armor....

Nurgling Chieftain
08-06-2008, 05:54
I do believe that's correct, the armor wins by dint of an "etc."

Damocles8
08-06-2008, 06:09
so where's the dint of the GUO?

Grogugluk
08-06-2008, 06:41
The problem is even with 10 weaponskill you can't hurt the GUO unless you have a great weapon as you have str 1.


And.. even if you somehow manage to wound him most GUO's have 2 4+ saves and a 5+ save from your str 3 hit.


So good luck.

Damocles8
08-06-2008, 16:20
well funny thing is that my Character has Killing Blow vs large targets so.....

T10
08-06-2008, 22:45
And a lance would bring the character to S 3 on a charge...

Regardless: Both effects do the same thing by have your character swap his statistic for a new value. I would recommend rolling at the start of each combat round for which effect "wins."

-T10

Damocles8
09-06-2008, 00:03
That was one idea, or cut the value in half (WS 5) to represent the pull on both sides....

Jack of Blades
09-06-2008, 00:39
There's a rule in the beginning of the BRB which I've found almost no one knows of. In a situation like this, when both effects override eachother, then you roll a D6 to see which one takes effect for the turn. Note that it has to be a clear overlap of effects. As an example, you can't roll to see what weapon you'll use if you're carrying a magical weapon and say you're going to summon the Flaming Sword of Rhuin - you simply won't be able to summon it, as you can't carry (ie. not use) two magical weapons at the same time in addition to not being able to use them at the same time.

Damocles8
09-06-2008, 05:42
Interesting Jack, that was another solution proposed to our dilema

Nurgling Chieftain
09-06-2008, 06:28
I've yet to see an argument that contradicts the simple fact that the Armor actually states that it overrides other modifiers.

Lordmonkey
09-06-2008, 13:00
The problem is even with 10 weaponskill you can't hurt the GUO unless you have a great weapon as you have str 1.

But it still affects how easy it is for the GUO to hit his target. Versus ws1, he is at 3's to hit. Vs ws 10 he is at 5's.


I've yet to see an argument that contradicts the simple fact that the Armor actually states that it overrides other modifiers.

If this is the case then there is no debate.

Fulgrim's-Chosen
09-06-2008, 16:52
Nurgling Chieftain, can you paraphrase/describe what the relevant wording is for that armor though, as you are saying it leaves no doubt or is very clear that no other effects / spells / rules of another model / etc. over-rule it ? (which I'm a bit skeptical that they would have worded it THAT strongly, as it's not the usual way of writing rules for an item by GW, but hey, it's possible....)

Damocles8
09-06-2008, 17:09
Fulgrim, I believe (don't have the book with me at work) that it says it cannot be modified in any way....I could be wrong but I believe that's the wording...conversly the GUO's spell doesn't say anything that it overrides magic item abilities...

Nurgling Chieftain
09-06-2008, 17:30
...as you are saying it leaves no doubt...I'm not sure I'd claim that it leaves no doubt. But it certainly needs to be addressed if anybody's going to claim that the armor can be overridden by an effect without a similar clause.

The phrase the armor uses is: "(which cannot be altered by other items, Virtues, etc.)" Now, the Miasma of Pestilence is neither an item nor strictly speaking a virtue (Nurgle might argue ;) ), but it is an "etcetera", thus my original comment that the armor appears to win by dint of an etc.