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Lord_Crull
09-06-2008, 18:48
How do vamps beat Skaven? Fear is mostly nullified by the ranks/leadership rule the Skaven have. Most units have LD 10 when kept near thier general.

The Vampire Counts have no shooting to take out the ratling guns.

So how do you beat them?

Malorian
09-06-2008, 18:52
Swarm them. This is where ghouls and ghoulkin really come in handy. Just get in there and grind them down.

You can take out the ratling guns use fell bats and gaze of nagash.

Marshal Torrick
09-06-2008, 19:01
Terror causers can have fun with the rats. My last game against a SAD had a Varghulf charge a clanrat unit far on a flank away from the general. The Varghulf's attacks killed the Engineer in the unit and Terror caused the nearby Warp Lightning cannon, slave unit and Globadiers to break and run. Yes, the Varghulf got smacked by CR, but he did his job.

Also remember that most skaven units get one attack per model so skeletons win the battle of attrition there.

If Ratling guns are giving you problems raise a bunch of zombies in front of them.

The ever present "Grave Guard Regiment of Dooooom" with a Drakenhoff BSB comes into it's own here as Skaven magic shooting isn't, for the most part, flaming. I don't remember if the WLC is, it only got to shoot once and misfired, then it fled. If you throw in your Lord with Blood drinker it becomes an even bigger target and when it finally hits(make sure to use IoN to ensure it lives) the Lord can go crazy healing it back up with magic and the Blood drinker. This unit will soak up enough firepower to help your ghouls/skellies to make it into combat.

Winds of death gives weapon teams problems, but the resulting spirit hosts aren't that useful except to hold up rat ogres or absorb more firepower and die.

Throw Curse of years onto his Grey Seer's unit. That'll kill a few models and reduce the amount of magic getting thrown at you as he burns PD to end it. Also consider a Balefire corpse cart or two.

If he uses slaves to get your units into flankable positions, keep another regiment nearby. He likely wont wipe out 20 skells in one combat, even with broken ranks, and then your other regiment can charge in and give you 3 ranks again and likely weight which is always important.

Panic anything without a rank bonus. Jezzails are good targets for the Gaze.


Hope this helped!

Dark_Mage99
09-06-2008, 23:11
Psychology is big, here.

It might be worth making use of Forbidden Lore and making your units cause terror with either Death or Shadow; that will likely mess up his lines.

Blood Knights have enough attacks to slaughter even his biggest, meanest, most static res unit he can ever think of, and if you can get to his flanks, that one charge can turn into a game winner.

Wolves and Fell Bats are good at closing his missile units down quickly.

minionboy
09-06-2008, 23:33
Jump out from behind a door and say "BOO!"

That usually does the trick.

hippie
11-06-2008, 04:13
1 summon zoimbies and charge the canon(big thread for your vampie is gone)
2corpsecart for the minus 1 for casting wil heart his enginers
3allmost al shooting in skaven is magical so try don't deploy ethereals !
4black knight for flank charges (no ranks is -3 to his leader ship if the gen is not to close)
5 try to charge his jezzails low leadership so a big change thet run before batle (or terror)
6 the screaming bel can be trick
7 your hammer unit must have magic res or ward save

Stinkfoot
11-06-2008, 13:45
Ethereals are still useful, you just need to be careful with them. Keep them hidden until the Jezzials are dead. If you plan on tailoring your list for your opponent, take the Rod of Flaming Death. Also if you can keep a Gaze of Nagash. Usually I don't care much for that spell, but it's golden against Rats. First turn don't use either magic missile, just throw out a bunch of IoN. Second turn lead off with IoN to bleed off his dispel dice. Maybe even cast a bigger spell or two to try to make him spend his scrolls (raising zombies to pull the censor bearers out of position is always a wise move). Once he's out of dice, cast your missiles on the Jezzials. Forcing a panic test usually means they're gone with their terrible leadership. If they die, Wraiths can come out (avoid ratling guns still!) and ruin the Skaven's day.

Skeletons are usually effective infantry, but against rats they really come into their own, as Skaven don't fight much better than your immortal, fear causing infantry. Don't bother with Grave Guard (I wouldn't bother with them ever actually, but that's another story), Skellies are good enough. You can usually raise men faster than even Skaven can kill them, so there is no hurry to engage his lines. Take your time and fight him once your units considerably outnumber his.

The biggest problem for me when I play Skaven is Censor Bearers, they absolutely destroy your infantry (and cavalry, actually). Start summoning zombies to pull them off your lines early. It's worth sacrificing 100 victory points of zombies to keep these guys from seeing battle. If you really need to kill them, Black Knights usually do the trick. Still, it's risky and zombie screening is very safe.

Rubberchrist
16-06-2008, 05:43
As a skaven player, I'll probably get assassinated for say these things, but here goes:

You have a flying Terror causer. Use it! The only thing we have that can deal with that with any real certainty is our shooting, and clever use of terrain nullifies that. You don't even need to get into combat, just plop down within 6" of several units and watch them break.

Use trash to tie us up and hit us in the flanks with something even halfway hitty (ws4+ with a couple attacks) and watch the clanrats fold up shop and skitter off the table. Without a good flank, though, you are looking at 5 static CR to chop through.

We do have shooting, but all of it is Ld 5, 7 at best near the general. You set your Varghulf down beside the Jezzails/ratling guns/globradiers and they are gone at the beginning of next turn, never to return.

The best thing you can do against Skaven is be fast. I know I typically rely on turns 1 and 2 to set up my line so I can start doing things on turn 3. Get in fast and they will be cramped and it will be hard to maneuver effectively.

-R