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Jagosaja
11-06-2008, 06:44
Say unit A wants to charge unit B. Unit C is an inch away from unit A. Units A and B are in such a position that they can charge each other in front. Unit A does not see unit C for charging purposes. The distance from B to C is smaller than unit A is deep. Unit C is places somewhat "in between" A and B.

Can unit A charge unit B (in the movement phase)?

Condottiere
11-06-2008, 07:27
As long as unit A does not come into contact with unit C while charging unit B. You can turn once during the charge.

T10
11-06-2008, 08:54
Unit A is indeed allows to charge unit B. They need to avoid unit C but are allowed to pass within 1" of it since they are currently making a charge move.

However, unit C limits their maneuvering options. This may cause unit A to make contact with the target in such a way as resulting in "clipping".

This is acceptable since they are are still making contact with as many enemy models as possible. In this case, the maximum number possible may be less than the optimal number.

-T10

Jagosaja
11-06-2008, 09:56
Well, the reason why I am asking is because I got once in the situation like this. The unit C is not letting me be in the front of unit B because I cannot fit my unit A between his B and C, and the rule says that I can only charge the side of the unit I initially can.

So, will C have to move, or I have to wait for the next turn to charge, as I cannot just go for the flank? I understand that clipping could occur, but I don't know how to perform it in such a situation. Chargers can be wheeled and sorted, but charged unit cannot be moved, I guess.

theunwantedbeing
11-06-2008, 10:25
Unit A could get into contact with unit B assuming they had enough charge range to do so.
You move them fowards a bit and then wheel, then move forwards again into contact..then use your free alignment wheel move to get a lot of men in contact.

You'll get half the unit in contact by the looks of it.
You certainly dont get to charge the flank.
Only empire detachments get to do that with supporting charges........

Jagosaja
11-06-2008, 10:49
But what about unit C? It is not charging that C is interfering, but placement for combat. If unit A was cavalry with a rank, so 100mm deep, and if unit C is 90 mm away from unit B, by vertical axis, and is between A and B observed horizontally, how can A fit in the front?

DeathlessDraich
11-06-2008, 10:50
Looks like a definite failed charge to me.
(A) hasn't got room to move into contact with (B)'s top left hand corner

If it could do so, then it is the norm [not a published rule] to accept this as a succesful charge even if the free alignment would bring (A) into contact with (C).
When *only* the free alignment is blocked, a mutually agreed shift and shuffle is necessary and clipping is possible.

Chicago Slim
11-06-2008, 10:50
The unit C is not letting me be in the front of unit B because I cannot fit my unit A between his B and C

Excellent point, and one which nobody above seems to have addressed (I hadn't noticed it, either, until you pointed it out!)

So, will C have to move, or I have to wait for the next turn to charge, as I cannot just go for the flank?

As has been mentioned, you absolutely WON'T get the flank, unless you're in the flank zone to start with (or are an Empire Detachment making a supporting charge).

But, check the last paragraph of Pg. 21, BRB, which tells you to realign the charged unit-- my interpretation of that instruction, in this case, is: Move A into contact with B, then rotate BOTH A and B to bring their fronts into line.

If you're using the optional Sliding methodology (described in the FAQ) then you could either slide B to the left, or you could slide while rotating the units.

theunwantedbeing
11-06-2008, 10:57
You could always wheel the unit round to "clip" unit C and get an enemy in the way charge on them, requiring them to stand and allow you to fight them, or to flee and allow you to charge B as normal.

Assuming you have enough movement to perform that wheel of course.

BloodiedSword
11-06-2008, 11:04
I would suggest that the charge succeeds and that you shuffle both units A and B in a way so that unit A can fit.

That's my interpretation of Page 21, under "Aligning the combatants":

If it is impractical to align a unit properly because of interposing terrain, other models, or whatever, then it is acceptable to realign the charged unit as well (or instead) so that the battle lines remain neat.

Volapyk
11-06-2008, 13:58
I would suggest that the charge succeeds and that you shuffle both units A and B in a way so that unit A can fit.

That's my interpretation of Page 21, under "Aligning the combatants":

I dont have the BRB in front of me atm but I am fairly certain that the rules tells you to wheel unit B instead of unit A when there is no room for unit A to wheel into contact.

So unit A would move down and use its charge wheel to turn until it touches the corner of unit B which will then wheel up into unit A.

T10
11-06-2008, 15:24
That is correct. If the chargers are able to make contact with the target but are unable to align due to obstructing units or terrain then the target unit is moved in order to align in stead.

See p.21, down near the end.

Lord Aries
11-06-2008, 16:18
Correct, unit B gets moved...

Even in tournaments, the answer to a problem like this, is the one that lets the game continue without something absurd. If your opponent is being a dick, and trying to do this to you, don't play that guy...

T10
11-06-2008, 18:23
Notice that you "never" move units that have been engaged in close combat, so if unit B was already fighting you would have a stange situation on your hands...

-T10