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Malagant
12-06-2008, 01:59
I'm planning on 2k VC centered around a 19-strong Grave Guard unit with War Banner and a Walking Death BSB Vamp with the Drakenhoff Banner.

The unit will be flanked by Ghouls, and followed by a Ghoul "bunker" with the Vamp Lord (MOBA, Helm, Book) and Necro (Danse) on Corpse Cart (Lodestone).

I intend the Graveguard to be a Static CR monster tar-pit, but am fantasizing about ASF S6 Great Weapons.

Will the unit's ability to tar-pit be too compromised by giving up their Shields for Great Weapons? 3+AS S4, or 5+AS S6?

him_15
12-06-2008, 02:30
depends on your foe, if you are playing against army with heavy shooting (Empire, Dwarf, etc.) Then Shields would be necessary, when your GG manage to get into combat, you can tear them apart even without Great weapon. On the other hand, facing army with higher toughness such as Ogre, Bretonnia, etc. Go for Great Weapon
Btw, I think this unit would cost you more than 500pts and your opponent would simply avoid them and meanwhile killing the rest of your army.

Sloppyjayman
12-06-2008, 14:42
I just put my grave guard together and I gave them GW. The post above is correct and if the unit is 500 points, they will be avoided. Suggestion: Go 20 strong with no Vampire and give them the war banner. Now the unit is only 315 points and can still take the charge from cavalry. I do the same as you and bunker my VL behind the unit (in skeletons) with a corpse cart next to him. On a good turn, you will be attacking first, re-rolling (with dance) WS7, and wounding on S6. Thats 4-5 wounds a turn on anybody.

Hope I could help....

Belerophon709
12-06-2008, 19:53
I would look at it from a different angle:
Do you want your GG to rely mainly on CR or kills to get the job done?

For CR purposes: Go with HW/Shield and War Banner
For kills: Go with GW and Banner of the Barrows

Both of the above both work best in conjunction with the Wight King BSB sporting the Drakenhof Banner and a Supporter Lord in a backseat ghoul or skeleton bunker.

Supporter Lord:
LvL 3
Master of the Black Arts
Forbidden Lore
Summon Ghouls / Lord of the Dead
Skull Staff
Helm of Commandment
(Biting Blade)

Now, with the Supporter Lord sitting behind, you'll be casting IoN on your GGs on 3+ and VanHels on 6+ (one dicing IoN and reliably casting VanHels on 2 dice). The Helm of Commandment helps the CR unit avoid taking as many casualties as they could otherwise and it helps the killy GG unit as well, making them hit most foes on 2+ and wounding on 2+ for the most part as well.
The Drakenhof Banner will helps both the CR-unit and the Killy-unit, adding protection from missile-fire and also allowing you a 4+ save against crumbling, should the unit actually lose a round.

Sure, it can be outrun, but VanHels makes it sooooo much harder. Especially if you bring the Book of Arkhan and a necromancer as well. Also, if he keeps running from your GG unit, with the Lord sitting in his bunker behind them, he'll be trying to avoid a big chunk of points that he won't be getting VPs for.

Just my 2 cents.

Malorian
12-06-2008, 20:00
At first I loved the idea of the great weapons. Then a unit of dryads charged me and messed me up big time.

Now it's handweapon shield with the warbanner all the way.

OldMaster
12-06-2008, 22:57
Sad they can't take both...
Yeah, go for the hdwpn-shield..

Malagant
13-06-2008, 01:04
You guys all have given great feedback.

Clearly the only solution is to take two units of Grave Guard! :)

Seriously, I'm more torn now than before. I'm going to put together my models half & half, so I can get away with either and see which works best for me. :)

Thanks so much all of you!