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havoc626
16-06-2008, 10:33
Under the Warpstone rules it says that all attacks made by the listed weapons count as magical, and Warplock Pistol is listed as one of these.

Is it correct in saying that the pistol will count as magical attacks in CC?

Loopstah
16-06-2008, 11:07
I would say Yes.

xragg
16-06-2008, 12:13
Although I am sure it was intended to only count as magical for shooting, I see nothing in the rules that prevent it from counting a magical hand weapon. I personally never count them as magical in CC.

Similarly, could a WE use his Bow of Loren in CC to whack an ethereal creature he otherwise couldnt hurt? I know this is allowed in 40k, allowing obliterators to whack opponents in their initiative step with lascannons rather then going last with their power fists.

Griefbringer
16-06-2008, 12:38
Similarly, could a WE use his Bow of Loren in CC to whack an ethereal creature he otherwise couldnt hurt?

Warplock pistol can be explicitely used in close combat, since it is a pistol and pistols have rules allowing them to be used in close combat.

Bow of Loren is a longbow, and does not have any rules allowing for it to be used in close combat, so it cannot be used for close combat.

As for warplock pistols being magical weapons in close combat, perhaps the Skryre folks have started placing a hefty chunk of warpstone to the butt of the gun for the coolness factor. Or perhaps the warlock just pounds the enemy with a bag of the shot.

Loopstah
16-06-2008, 12:40
Although I am sure it was intended to only count as magical for shooting, I see nothing in the rules that prevent it from counting a magical hand weapon. I personally never count them as magical in CC.

Similarly, could a WE use his Bow of Loren in CC to whack an ethereal creature he otherwise couldnt hurt? I know this is allowed in 40k, allowing obliterators to whack opponents in their initiative step with lascannons rather then going last with their power fists.

No because a pistol can be used in CC as a Hand Weapon.

A bow is not allowed to be used in CC.

I don't see why you wouldn't play it as a hand weapon with magical attacks, it's the warpstone used inside the weapon that gives it a magical aura so I don't see why it wouldn't work in close combat, as the magic would soak into the pistol itself eventually.

Lijacote
16-06-2008, 12:49
You CAN shoot people in CC, you know. A slash there, a BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOMpewwwwshizzle there. +2 CR.

slasher
16-06-2008, 12:58
Also don't forget that the skaven book is from the last edition - where pistol where allowed to fire in the first round of combat. (The models attacks where S4 AP)

Condottiere
16-06-2008, 13:43
Well, I'm not too sure about the physics involved, but I assume that any ammunition is isolated in the firing chamber.

Would the mere presence of warpstone bestow magical properties on an object, or must a more direct physical involvement be required? Does the warpstone have to be integrated in the structure if the pistol?

ehlijen
16-06-2008, 14:10
According the the faq, the bow of loren also does not make magic attacks :( Apparently its abilites first need to be negated by magic arrows to count as magic...if I got all that right which I may have not.

Given that a pistol has specific combat rules a magic pistol would have a magic butt you can club with. I'm not sure that should be the case but the only rules argument I can come up with is:
Does the warplock pistol actually have CC rules? Does it defer to the standard pistol rules or is it its own entity entirely?
If it has its own set of rules and does not refer to the rulebooks pistol version, than it needs its own CC rules to be used as a hand weapon. I don't know whether that's the case or, if it is, whether it has such a rule in the skaven book, but you should check that.

Loopstah
16-06-2008, 14:27
Does the warplock pistol actually have CC rules? Does it defer to the standard pistol rules or is it its own entity entirely?

It states it follows all the normal rules for pistols.

It states elsewhere it has magical attacks.

As the attacks aren't specified to just apply to shooting attacks, then they also apply to CC.

ehlijen
17-06-2008, 02:19
Yes, if those are true, the warplock pistol has a magical butt to club people with.

xragg
17-06-2008, 02:33
So a warlord with a great weapon and warplock pistol can never use his great weapon, since he has to use his magical pistol... Also, engineers are allowed to carry two magical close combat weapons... I am not disagreeing with anyone, just pointing out discripencies in the rules.

decker_cky
17-06-2008, 03:23
There's a difference between a magical weapon and a weapon with magical attacks.

ehlijen
17-06-2008, 06:00
Having two close combat weapons with magical attacks isn't of any help as, by the rulebook, you need a brace of pistols, an 'additional hand weapon' (not just another 'hand weapon') or a magic weapon that is specifically treated as a pair to be able to claim the additional HW attack.

Griefbringer
17-06-2008, 11:01
According the the faq, the bow of loren also does not make magic attacks

Checking the FAQ, you are correct. Makes me wonder if there are similar rulings for magic bows for other army books.