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Darth Rubi
17-06-2008, 15:55
Hi,

Does anybody have experience or advice for using small (5-7) units of white lions? Specifically, I am trying to decide what, if any, command units to use

Andrew Luke
17-06-2008, 16:00
I'd put in a muso so they can flee from charges, prefferably back into the woods they came from.

riven5
17-06-2008, 16:54
I usually run full command. Musician for reasons stated earlier, and standard bearer for some CR protection. If you're running only 6-7 per unit then don't bring a standard banner as you'd only need to fluff your attacks once to risk giving up the VPs to the enemy.

With WLs I always encourage people to use the champion. He brings a second S6 attack to the table while costing less than another WL. Absolutely perfect for MSU.

Rimmz
17-06-2008, 17:03
Personally I think WL work best in a tar pit roll holding a unit in place for a turn or 2 in order to set up flank charges with Chariots or Cav. Give them full command and the Lion standard for this roll because stubborn doesn't work against a fear causer.

The woods movement does make them a good flanking unit but Sword Masters are probably better overall as a flanking unit because of the additional damage output. The higher STR only really matters against higher armored units the STR of the Sword Masters is usually enough.

Really though a flanking unit should be something that can move. Chariots and Cav are the best and IMO the Lion Chariot is one of the best Chariots in the game, if its supporting a block of WL infantry it can even work on its own.

Ethriel
17-06-2008, 17:43
I ran a small unit of 6 White Lions against a Brettonian Player. No command or anything. They held up his unit of Grail Knights for the entire game. By the end there were only 2 grail knights....I ended up losing the game, but not because of them.

I'd say use them to guard your flanks, or to hold up those tough units you don't want to deal with, for a turn or two. Just be wary of enemies with multiple attacks, cause that 5+ save isn't very good.

Marwynn
17-06-2008, 21:56
If you're going for guerilla tactics with them then musicians are all that you need. Bringing a standard bearer is going to be unfortunate should they get run down when you flee, and a champion is just cumbersome due to challenges.

Darth Rubi
17-06-2008, 22:53
I've been considering using them as close support for larger blocks (like spearmen maybe) sort of like empire detachments. I see the reason behind not taking the standard, but if my opponent is charging a 6 man unit then won't he just be leaving himself open to a counter from the main block?

As for taking a champion: the extra attack for cheap is nice, are challenges that much of a hassle? Especially is you're mainly (hopefully) using them for flank charges

and finally, as Rimmz says, are swordmasters just better at this role? One thing about swordies is that they can lose the crucial US 5 required to negate ranks easily, from shooting etc, compared to the white lions with a 3+

isidril93
18-06-2008, 17:42
white lions serve better as a flanker than swordmasters as they die less from shooting and they ignore penalties from wood which is good for surprise attacks!!!

Marwynn
18-06-2008, 22:39
I've been considering using them as close support for larger blocks (like spearmen maybe) sort of like empire detachments. I see the reason behind not taking the standard, but if my opponent is charging a 6 man unit then won't he just be leaving himself open to a counter from the main block?

As for taking a champion: the extra attack for cheap is nice, are challenges that much of a hassle? Especially is you're mainly (hopefully) using them for flank charges

and finally, as Rimmz says, are swordmasters just better at this role? One thing about swordies is that they can lose the crucial US 5 required to negate ranks easily, from shooting etc, compared to the white lions with a 3+

Things won't often go according to plan. And if your opponent happens to have something quick but sufficiently powerful to take on White Lions the challenge alone is detrimental. Instead of dealing potentially 2 attacks to the rest of the unit you focus it on one guy, so actually you're down 1 attack.

Honestly try it out for yourself, but I'd rather save the points for something else. It's almost another elite infantry model for that cost.

And no, Sword Masters aren't that much better at this. Whatever shooting your opponents have will be directed towards those guys. That, and movement conditions.

If you're intending on screening a unit of SMs until the moment of truth comes though, go for it.