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WhiteKnight
20-06-2008, 03:37
I'm a vet to WHFB and I'm switching gears from High Elves to Beasts of Chaos. I've read through the army book and I like the Ambush and Raiders rules. I will most likely run a lot of Beast Herds to get the effectiveness of raiders and ambush. I also like Bestigors and what I learned from a friend at my local GW store is that you want Bestigors in a big unit because only one unit of them can get a mark of chaos. I want to either run an all Tzeentch list or a mix between Khorne and Tzeentch to get a mix of combat and magic. I really need tips because I'm new to Chaos armies.

Herod
20-06-2008, 04:57
All the tips you could want: http://www.freewebs.com/herdstone/

My advice - pick up some Minotaurs + Chariots, one unit of Bestigors is enough (Khorne is best IMO), and personally I think a mix of Khorne and Tzeentch will be more competitive.

H

neXus6
20-06-2008, 04:59
Hmm...to be honest while herdstone has a lot of good things, they have a lot I totally disagree with.

For example some of their views on Herd sizes and their total hatred of Chaos Ogres, even if you DONT use the awful models.

It is a good place to get a starting idea though, just don't take it ALL word for word. :p

starlight
20-06-2008, 05:05
One day I'll finally get around to my 3000pts of Minotaurs, but I have so many projects in line, I'm going to need to win the lottery to have enough time. :p

WhiteKnight
20-06-2008, 05:10
With the website not updated with the fact you can't put daemons in your armies anymore, I only read a few things on Herdstone.

TheWarSmith
20-06-2008, 05:42
Herd sizes are SOOOO subjective to the person playing.

Personally, I love the 12 gor and 8 ungor that comes in a box, but some use smaller units as shields and distractions.

You'll definitely need something very hard hitting. I'd suggest dragon ogres.

The Red Scourge
20-06-2008, 06:21
Go with Tzeentch. Then you can sink your points into minotaur, and make Tzaangors out of your opponents troops ; )

OldMaster
20-06-2008, 06:38
Go with Tzeentch. Then you can sink your points into minotaur, and make Tzaangors out of your opponents troops ; )

Oh RLY?

:\

Have 1 large Herd unit for ambushing with a character in it. It works fairly well.

WhiteKnight
20-06-2008, 08:05
Tzaangors can't ambush but they are good. I just made a Khorne/Tzeentch list. It's 2250 points and it gives me something to look forward to using.

Beastlord: Black Maul, pelt of the dark young, shield, heavy armour, mark of Chaos Undivided, Talisman of protection (204)

Bray - Shaman: level 2, staff of darkoth, chaos armour, talisman of protection (160)

Wargor: Chaos Armour, Biting Blade, Shield, Mark of Tzeentch (152)

Bray - Shaman: level 2, bray staff, x2 dispel scrolls (166)

Beast Herd:12 gors, 7 ungors, shields, full command (166)
Beast Herd:12 gors, 8 ungors, shields, full command (171)
Beast Herd:12 gors, 8 ungors, full command (151)
Bestigors:20, full command, mark of khorne, warbanner (340)

Minotaurs:3, great weapons, light armour, mark of Tzeentch (170)
Minotaurs:3, great weapons, light armour, mark of Khorne (195)

Spawn of Chaos: 2, Bloodbeasts of Khorne (150)
Chaos Giant: Mutant Monstrocity (225)

Tactic: Control the enemy
What I want to do with this army is control the magic and combat phase to flow the enemy into disarray. The Bestigors are in a huge unit to knock down the toughest units around such as Empire and brettonian knights. The Minotaurs will work as a team to knock down any pesky units that irritate me during the game. As for the beast herds, 2 beast herd units will pop up and attempt to flank a unit. As for the last beast herd unit, they will use the raider special rule and move about and make shooting incredibly difficult on them.

Please comment on this list and see if there is anything I need to edit to make it a stronger army.

neXus6
20-06-2008, 08:22
The only thing I would worry about would be lack of a Battle Standard. Those rerolls can be so helpful. All in all I like the list though, pretty nice balance of all the bits and pieces with a little extra edge on the magic.

Certainly looks better than the 2k list I've ended up with out of buying bits and pieces I liked. :p

I am another fan of the 12 gor 8 ungor Herd though, mine always end up taking more casualties from combat than shooting the whole 8 gor 12 ungor thing for example seems so odd to me. :D

The Red Scourge
20-06-2008, 11:12
Minotaurs:3, great weapons, light armour, mark of Tzeentch (170)
Minotaurs:3, great weapons, light armour, mark of Khorne (195)


I'm gonna help you saving a few points here.

Minos can only have the mark of your general – in this case undecided :angel:

Personally I'm a fan of dogs and Dragon Ogres – and one of those idiots ready to pay 3-400 points to field a Shaggoth lord as my general, despite the fact that the enemy probably will tear him apart. (can't believe that it is supposed to be the beast equivalent of a treeman).

TheWarSmith
20-06-2008, 11:45
Minos can only have the mark of your general in this case undecided :angel:

This isn't university, so there's no such thing as "mark of undecided". The chaos guy isn't like "hmmm, I'm not sure who to worship!"

Go for a Tzeentch BSB. Lvl 2 spellcaster w/ a BSB.

If you cast indigo fire, you can now opt to create tzaangors instead of horrors. That's a MUCH better deal, seeing as they will generate power dice the NEXT turn if they survive, even if there's only 1(provided it's not fleeing).

The Red Scourge
20-06-2008, 13:00
This isn't university, so there's no such thing as "mark of undecided". The chaos guy isn't like "hmmm, I'm not sure who to worship!"(provided it's not fleeing).

Boo-hoo-hoo!

Theres no chaos in making a decision and sticking to it ;)

OldMaster
20-06-2008, 14:25
I never take sheilds for my beast herds - neither for my Gors as for Ungors. Small point save, but reasonable. 2 attacks > 6+/5+ armour save :\

The Red Scourge
20-06-2008, 14:38
I never take sheilds for my beast herds - neither for my Gors as for Ungors. Small point save, but reasonable. 2 attacks > 6+/5+ armour save :\

Ungors are your shields.

And a hit from a handgun, will make your shield obsolete anyway.

Khorghan
20-06-2008, 15:12
One unit of bestigor may take the mark of your general, so if your general doesent have a mark you cant give your bestis one either. (i cant find my book but im pretty sure.)

WhiteKnight
20-06-2008, 17:20
It says that if your general has a mark of a god, then the units in the army can only have that mark of god. You can mix and match them if the god has a mark of chaos undivided. It just means that the general allows members of several gods into his army because he worships all 4 gods. This is the official text from the codex.

If your general worships Chaos Undivided, then you may mix other marks in your army freely, with the following exception - you may only give a character a mark if a unit or chariot in the army has the same mark. (other than Spawn of Chaos)

And beast herds don't have any armour if not given a shield so a hand weapon and shield is a 5+ compared to no saves at all.

Tauren
20-06-2008, 19:21
Do the math, statistically doing 1 extra attack is more valueable than a 5+ armor save, if you do 1 more kill you are getting 1 less attack back. Not to mention any strength above 3 reduces that armor save, making it less useful.

Take ungors for example... statistically you can lose 6 which you payed 4 a piece for 24 points. You get shields and you may lose say 1 less... but you payed 5 points for each... thus you payed 25 pts...

Statistically its useless to take shields ever on herds. You put more ungors than gors because often if gors are dieing, you lose anyways. Additionally your herds are not great in combat. You pay less for ungors that will die from shooting often. You use ungors to beef the herds up so they can wither more shooting without panicing. Which is important because beasts panic a lot. On top of that you are playing off ld 8... with a beastlord. Guess what, thats low and what do you get for it? ambush? which isn't that great.

Bestigors are powerful as they are our ranked troops. Sadly only one can be marked, the other cannot. Personally I would take two units of bestigors if they could be marked, but until then ehh.

I will be looking into including a BSB in my army though with my doom-bull mainly becuase our leadership issues, that reroll could be critical, plus it could turn my bestigor unit into an even nastier unit.

Goat T
21-06-2008, 00:12
i am not a fan of Bestigors. I find they are too slow and clunky.
But if you do use them, i prefer Tzeengors with the banner of Wrath. It gives you a free magic missile.
Also, try put some hounds in there. They are great for 30 points, as they can bait, and be used on suicide runs. (I had a 5 hounds eat a Grey Seer before).
The points for the hounds can be taken from the minotaurs as they can only have the same mark as the general.
Also think about Centigors. 6 of them for 117points make great mage killers.
And if your heart is set on undivided, think of Slaaneesh Spawn. That 3d6 movement is a god-send (Pun intended).
Lastly, from my experience, I think undivided is a handicap. Take either Tzeentch, or take Khorne. But by trying to take both, you end up limiting yourself in troops, and the troops in a beastmen army are its real strength. The best beastmen armies out there rely on units, instead of being character driven.

][nquist0r
21-06-2008, 05:27
You cant use The banner of wrath anymore... All magic items from the HoC book are off limits. *cries*

WhiteKnight
21-06-2008, 07:11
How would I limit myself in troops but mixing and matching marks between khorne and Tzeentch? By doing so I get rid of one big weakness in khorne armies.

Tauren
21-06-2008, 07:55
You don't limit yourself in troops. You do limit yourself to a choice. IF you are running undivided you need to be doing it for a reason. Personally I plan to run (reads: until our new book) a doom-bull MoCU tzeentch powered slaaneshi spell casting list. doom-bull, tzeentch chariots to power my spells. Slaanesh is such a powerful lore that I have alot of control and backing for our low leadership/psych army with these game altering spells.

Some people will state that "Oh jeez luiz only run bestigors if they are khorngors..." Well, you could do that... yea... Some people will say on if you are doing magic tzeentch is the only way and a beastlord at that. Why? Run a doom-bull you get ld 9, big in a tzeentch army, lose out on ambush (OH GOD NOO!!!! /SARCASM END) and get what... 2 less spells? running on 12 power dice easily...

The big problem with magic heavy is we lost a lot of items, and tzeentch was never an ultra powerful lore to start with. Thusly why I run slaanesh. Another option is to go totally magic heavy and run something like an undivided GBS ... but again ld 7... will hurt...

Lord_Byron
21-06-2008, 08:22
It says that if your general has a mark of a god, then the units in the army can only have that mark of god. You can mix and match them if the god has a mark of chaos undivided. It just means that the general allows members of several gods into his army because he worships all 4 gods. This is the official text from the codex.

If your general worships Chaos Undivided, then you may mix other marks in your army freely, with the following exception - you may only give a character a mark if a unit or chariot in the army has the same mark. (other than Spawn of Chaos)

And beast herds don't have any armour if not given a shield so a hand weapon and shield is a 5+ compared to no saves at all.

Read the entry under minotaurs again.

Minotaurs, and only minotaurs, may only choose the specific mark that the general has. Every other unit in the list works as you described.

The Red Scourge
21-06-2008, 08:25
Another option is to go totally magic heavy and run something like an undivided GBS ... but again ld 7... will hurt...

Only choice for a general in beasts is a Shaggoth Champ :p

But seriously. The model looks fantastic and beasts has been nerfed all around. So why not make a virtue out of it and put Shaggy on the table. I promise you, your opponent will go :wtf:

Tauren
21-06-2008, 08:32
He will go WTF until he realizes what it is and proceeds to blast it into oblivion. Poor shaggy can't even kill half the things he is supposed to.

Khorneflakes
21-06-2008, 10:03
white knight you have two talismans of protection and two chaos armours in your list and you are only aloud one

WhiteKnight
21-06-2008, 21:08
Really, I was told that chaos armour can be used by multiple characters. As for talisman of protection, its a common magic item, anyone can use it.

giner
21-06-2008, 21:18
Common magic items mean that every army can take that item. Unless an item is a scroll (the rule, not a scroll) or says multiples may be taken you cannot.

I forgot about this with chaos armour myself when I was new to BoC.

ZigZagMan
21-06-2008, 22:33
You are confusing some of 6th editions rules, where common magic items were, well... common and each character could have one.

neXus6
22-06-2008, 03:23
I refuse to agree beasts have been nerfed ... but I will say I am disgusted at the recent BoC FAQ and GWs attempt to deny and cover up the whole "rank to 4" thing.

I know some BoC players are happy with the "bribe" of chariots getting marks :wtf: and that tzeentch spell creating bestigor instead of horrors :wtf:. But personally I am not, their answer to the 4 wide thing was utter ******** they could have just said "yes rank 5 wide" instead of "no your book says 4 wide so it stays 4 wide, not a scoring rank" (ps. we know we changed the core rules but tough, live with it...heres some cheap bonuses to chariots and a Tzeentch spell to try and make you happy).

Not that I'm angry or anything at them thinking everyone would accept such cheap pay offs.

:mad:

veilwalker
22-06-2008, 14:41
I have been ranking my herds 5 wide regardless of anything else. It is ridiculous to think that they cannot rank 5 wide, doesn't make any sense so I have been doing it. Why would they specifically state that we can get a rank bonus of +2 but then state that we can only rank up 4 wide and that no longer qualifies for a rank bonus. Unless of course we can rank up 4 wide and still get the rank bonus?

I went the other route and ranked up 5 wide and took the rank bonus.

Tauren
22-06-2008, 16:16
Tzeentch lore was only powerful due to the staff of change. The tzeentch lore is slightly expensive for what it does on the high end, its magic missles are cheap though. Sadly it came with a hindrance for beasts with our low leadership. A mark that granted an extra power dice but opened us up to further panic issues.

Remember, our strengths are movement and lots of cheap units, including our heroes, and monster units, our chariots are amazing also. But our biggest weakness was our lack of lots of static combat res (bestigors have the most and 1 unit of those isn't bad in some armies) and our herds which only provide so much, even less with the ranking issues, and our low leadership.

The 5 wide min ranking would be worth alot. Our lack of magic items hurts. But to be honest the change opened up some major possibilities magic wise with the army, but not with the tzeentch lore. Again remember our weakness psychology and combat res. The lore of slaanesh... the most powerful lore in the game enters the field. But that good-ol prince can't do it all himself! Lore Tzeentch has decided to lend his magical winds to be abused by the shamans of slaanesh.

Spell 1: 6+ a powerful magic missle that causes d6 str 6 hits... come on! thats better than the tzeentch version by alot by not being nearly as random and for what... 1 point more? 12 inch range gives some possibilities.

Spell 2: 7+ Pick a unit and give it frenzy within 24 inches... Friend or foe? Suddenly you don't need to buy khorngors, you can make them yourself. Need that knight unit to dick around for a turn or two, assign a unit of puppies to run up to them after you frenzy them. Causes d6 strength 3 hits at the beginning of every turn (both yours and your opponents) though, so against stuff like say fast cav that you want to charge your cheap units and then die... Good stuff. And the unit can be in combat. Need an extra boost? have slaneesh kick your unit in the ass while its losing combat and get back in the game! !!!!Note!: this is not a RIP spell, the unit gains frenzy until they lose it by losing a combat.!!!

Spell 3: 8+ Select a unit within 24 inches, select a point they can see, during their remaining moves they have to go there. Want to screw up a formation of units? bring that undead vampire to where you want it to be. Bring that slann to where you want it to be, or send it to where he doesn't want it to be.

Spell 4: 9+ Select an unengaged unit within 24 inches. Each model in the unit attacks itself... watch as that big infantry block eats itself alive then panics...

Spell 5: 10+ (RIP) Select a unit within 18 inches even if engaged in combat... that unit is useless, it can't cast, it can't attack, It can't move, it can't shoot, and they are hit automatically in close combat. (cool but it doesn't work on immune to psychology critters)

Spell 6: 11+ (RIP) target any unit within 24 inches the unit is unbreakable


So we lost a cookie, but GW's biggest! !#%^-up or perhaps what they wanted us to think about was a bit of mark mixing, something we couldn't do with our old list due to it's restrictions... only 1 regiment could ever be marked, a total !@#% up when they wrote the book. If this is anything of a sign to come, expect our next book to mix and match as we see fit like the daemon book. I just hope we stay as cheap hero-wise, have lots of troops, fix some of our CR issues, and for the love of god, don't @#$% up what our marks do. Thankfully they have an entire army of warriors to figure out, which should have our army pretty well settled mark wise. One thing to note is each army is probably gonna be getting different magic lores. I say this because if you look its the Daemon Lore of Tzeentch. The Mortal Lore of Tzeentch will probably what they get. And the Beast Lore of Tzeentch for example will be ours.

WhiteKnight
23-06-2008, 01:46
When you put it like that, I'm going to do an all slaanesh army. The marks of chaos are cheap, and the magic is outstanding. I also am thinking of having a shaggoth in the list to **** off this one skaven player that has 4 warplightning cannons in a legendary battles list.

The Red Scourge
23-06-2008, 19:56
He will go WTF until he realizes what it is and proceeds to blast it into oblivion. Poor shaggy can't even kill half the things he is supposed to.

Yeah! Its fantastic. Try comparing to a treeman, and your eyes will really start to run :cries:

But then again. Its shaggy and I wouldn't leave home without him.

Khorneflakes
25-06-2008, 01:27
hey tauren your a little off with your spell #4, its only a character in the unit that attacks the unit not the unit itself, thats the green fire of tzeentch spell

_Lucian_
26-06-2008, 20:29
On a beasts note i only just realised how Kazrak the one eye is an absolute Stank killer. You power him up with some 4+ self buffs likes bears anger and steeds (doesnt matter if its dispelled) and you end up with a S8 4atk and 1 uber whip atk killing machine.... Think about it, the stank is auto-hit, so thats an automatic 4 S8, then you get to keep re-rolling wounds untill you roll a 1........ lets say you manage another 3 rolls before a 1 comes up and your looking at 5-6wounds easily (remember it will only get a 6+ save). Seems like a bargain to me, although i still dislike him taking that second hero slot.

WhiteKnight
29-06-2008, 06:36
Kazhrak is a great character for monster killers and stank hunters but I would only use him in 3k+ games where I actually see these kinds of things floating about. He's also great for ambush armies.

I think Ill be going for a lot of beast herds, about 4 units of 12 gors and 8 ungors, so I utilize raiders and ambush. I dislike chaos hounds as I'd rather use chariots because they're 85 points a chariot for str 6 impact hits and str 5 attacks.

My main concern is the shooting. If my non raider units get shot to death, then I will be in some serious trouble. Hopefully my shamans and ambushers get those pesky gunlines with quickly.

_Lucian_
29-06-2008, 10:48
Getting to gunlines is what hounds do best and at 36points for 6 moving 14" a turn, you cant go wrong. They have one of the largest uses of any unit in the game from my experience especially now furies have been taken away from the list (bring back harpies i say)

veilwalker
29-06-2008, 18:46
Hounds leadership is horrible. You will be taking a panic test before you get close to a gunline and that will be it for your hounds.

Ambushing with hounds is pretty useless as well since their leadership is so bad they will only rarely show up where you want or need them.

_Lucian_
29-06-2008, 19:18
If you keep your general central and moving forward he will most likely be in range of the hounds for his Ld, also hounds can be a mere 30points a unit, so what if they take a panic test you can easily fit 4 units of 5 into a list with minimal fuss and if your opponent is shooting hounds then hes not shooting your chariots or d.ogres.
Thirdly although hounds dont do well ambushing, however they count towards the ammount who can and so having 4 units of hounds and 4 herds means all your herds can ambush. Another tactic is units of 20 hounds on the flank, comes in at 120points has 3ranks and outnumbering with M7, not bad at all. Kept within range of your general for ld and your not doing too bad.

Ive yet to see a competitive beasts army do well without them, although i will admit i havnt seen them all.

The Red Scourge
30-06-2008, 16:36
If you keep your general central and moving forward he will most likely be in range of the hounds for his Ld, also hounds can be a mere 30points a unit, so what if they take a panic test you can easily fit 4 units of 5 into a list with minimal fuss and if your opponent is shooting hounds then hes not shooting your chariots or d.ogres.
Thirdly although hounds dont do well ambushing, however they count towards the ammount who can and so having 4 units of hounds and 4 herds means all your herds can ambush. Another tactic is units of 20 hounds on the flank, comes in at 120points has 3ranks and outnumbering with M7, not bad at all. Kept within range of your general for ld and your not doing too bad.

Ive yet to see a competitive beasts army do well without them, although i will admit i havnt seen them all.

What he said :)

Hounds are invaluable in a Chaos army, be it beasts or mortals. With mortals you can even do a doggy delivery service. Suit up a couple of champions on daemonic mounts (barded steeds can do to), and set them in charge of a huge pack of hounds. The enemy has no chance of getting to your champs, who will be churning heads by turn two and perhaps even with a rank bonus :evilgrin:

WhiteKnight
02-07-2008, 02:43
Well I played my first game with my Beastmen. I was playing against Empire with 3 units of knights and 2 state troops. Here's the turn by turn details.

Turn 1:The Empire army stood stationary. My Chaos Ogres and one shaman moved up a couple inches.

Turn 2:Empire stayed stationary, this led to many flaws by him later. Moved up a bit closer, ogres within charge range of a unit of swordsmen.

Turn 3: Empire stay stationary. I signal my ambushers and get on the rear side of a unit of knights. I use Blissful Throes and killed one knight.

Turn 4:Empire begin to move a bit but no more than 4 inches. I rear charge unit of knights and break them in combat. They flee and I pursue. My rear is now exposed to Inner Circle Knights.

Turn 5: Inner Circle Knights charge the beast herds. I flee and still manage to get caught. They die. I charge a unit of knights with Slaangors. Cast Blissful Throes on Inner Circle Knights. kills one knight. Breaks the unit of knights and catches them, now only state troops and inner circle knights left.

Turn 6: Chaos Ogres charge State Troops and kill 5 swordmen. Swordsmen held off and killed them by breaking them and catching, now only 2 bray shamans and Slaangors are left. Slaangors are charged on flank and front. I challenge the empire captain with my Wargor. We fight and he kills me cause of the charge. The slaangors die and my two shamans are left. I kill one unit of state troop halberdiers and end up pulling a draw because he had a bit over 330 points and I had 326 points left. The Swordsmen were under half so that really helped me. Also I captured 2 banners and he captured 1. Yay! I didn't lose!

WhiteKnight
03-07-2008, 17:29
Any comments?

Gorthor21
03-07-2008, 18:31
sounds like quite an epic bout:D

slannesh magic is one of the best qualities of chaos. what others have said about herd size is subjective to the player imo. if you take the herdstone philosophy and use things like "uber herd" and minimize the number of gors and bulk on ungors, youre placing too much faith in them. a good balance would be to take two of the standard herds (12/8) for your ambush units. since you dont want to take hounds, use a unit of minimized gor and take a crapton of ungors w/ just spears to screen. could work well, prolly wont. just do what you want with it.

maybe you should venture into the special choices and get some sledgehammer units like minos, trolls, or ogres(convert the OK ones cause he beasts ones are *****). charging great weapon wielding minos/ogres could easy take down a small unit of heavy calvary. 4 would be a good number to use for them.

was this a 1000 point battle?

WhiteKnight
03-07-2008, 21:37
Thanks. Yeah this was a 1k points game. I'm getting more beast herds soon and I'll be getting minos to boost my points up and get ready for 2k points. I still can't believe that I owned his knights so easily when they all had 1+ armour saves. Good thing ambush helped me.

veilwalker
04-07-2008, 00:04
I have been running my herds with 8 Gors and 12 Ungors, with standard bearer and if points permit a musician. 5 wide when we rank up for combat though there appears to be some debate over whether that is legal. My thought was that with 8 Gors I should have a full front rank at the beginning of the 2nd rnd of combat and then my 2nd rank of Ungors can join in the fun. Any less than 8 Gors and I think the risk is too high that ungors will be your new front rank. My two cents on that issue.

I will run with a foe-render and a hero in the herds where possible.

Chicago Slim
04-07-2008, 01:51
5 wide when we rank up for combat though there appears to be some debate over whether that is legal.

Okay, here's the deal: Beast Herds are skirmishers, so they line up like any other skirmishers (a bit wider than whatever they're facing). For example, against the front of a unit of Orcs (5 wide), your Beast Herd will be 7 wide.

Per the BoC book, the minimum you'll ever line up is 4 wide (instead of the 2-wide you'd normally get against a 20-mm single model, or the 3-wide you'd get against a single 20-mm or 40-mm model, or for that matter against 2 20mms).

So, literally the only time the "4-wide vs 5-wide" thing comes up is when you're fighting single models (including chariots and monsters), artillery crews, and the flanks of small units. In all of these cases, you're probably not counting on the 2 extra points of combat resolution from your ranks to really turn the tide of battle.

It's not exactly a "non-issue", but it's not a huge deal, either, and it's pretty easy to work into your plans.


That said... Personally, I like beast herds that have a LOT of ungors-- they're cheap, they hide in the back (allowing the T4 Gors to soak up the damage), and bringing a lot means that I'm likely to have numbers. I seldom run fewer than 7 Gors (the aforementioned width when fighting against 5-wide 25mm), and often bring 8 Gors + 12 Ungors, or 8 Gors + 20 Ungors.

Sometimes, though, I'll bring very small units (5 + 5, or 5 + 7), with no command, just to "flood the field" with MSU tactics.


I also tend to agree with earlier comments about the fragility of Hounds. Which is why I bring at least 2 units, and sometimes 4 or 5 (in 2500 points). Ambush all of them, and one's bound to turn up where you needed it.

Lots of opponents freak out when you Ambush into their backfield, and overcommit to dealing with the ambushers. Even opponents who know better tend to have a hard time of it, when you ambush 8 different units, all over the table (since about half of them will turn up in random locations).

Another reason I ambush with hounds: Beast Herds, when they charge an enemy rear or flank, do not negate that enemy's rank bonus (they're skirmishers, remember?) Hounds do, as long as there's at least 3 of them...

Condottiere
04-07-2008, 05:53
I thought Beast Herds were raiders, and since they have ranks, they'd negate the rank bonus? Or am I mistaking them for something else?

skank
04-07-2008, 08:37
Raiders are still skirmishers (so don't break ranks), they just get a couple of bonuses.

WhiteKnight
04-07-2008, 18:14
I'm now using Dogs of War Ogre Bulls. They're more cost-effective IMO so I now have more damage to cause. I'm picking up 4 minos today so now I'm at about 1500 points. Hopefully I can get another unit of 4 minos and some Spawns of Chaos and if I have spare points, some Dragon Ogres for more ownage.

starlight
04-07-2008, 18:21
Bulls over Minos?

Long before Ogre Kingdoms came out I decided to build a Chaos army, and settled on a Doombull led horde of Minotaurs. I've still got the models (in storage sadly while I sort other things out) but I'm wondering if they would work better using the Ogre Kingdoms rules, or the Beasts of Chaos Minotaur rules...

Conversions aren't the issue, fun is. :) While 3,000pts of Minotaurs would look cool, I'm concerned that they'll get boring quickly. :(

WhiteKnight
05-07-2008, 00:12
I'm kind of going through a small phase right now. I cannot decide what Chaos God to worship in my army. I like the Lore of Slannesh but I like being magic defensive with the Marks of Khorne. I might play a Tzeentch army to give Vampires a run for their dispel dice. They may have lots of magic, but with an average of 11+ power dice, I can conquer a lot. Any suggestions?

WhiteKnight
08-07-2008, 16:03
Any comments?