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Chain
24-06-2008, 21:45
In the current Dark Elves army book: Regarding Magic- It say something about add +1 to all there casting rolls.

Is this something that only count for Dark Elves if they pick Dark Magic or does the bonus follow if I were to Pick Shadow or Death Magic?


Also just for clarification: I'm not able to give Warriors Shields and R-Crossbows at the same time right? If I am allowed would i still be allowed the Spears?
I Know Spear and Shield is possible but what of the other combinations?

R-crossbows are like Crossbows regarding the move and fire right?


Just returned to Warhammer, played during Edition 4 and 5

theunwantedbeing
24-06-2008, 21:48
You get +1 to cast, regardless of the chosen lore.

You are able to give them both.
You dont get the spear's as the spear is swapped for a repeater crossbow.

No...they have their own set of rules given in the DE book, and in the rulebook on page 55.

DE will get updated in a couple of months so don't worry too much about learning all thier rules.

Malorian
24-06-2008, 21:53
I thought they only got the +1 for their own lore... could be wrong though...

TheDarkDaff
24-06-2008, 21:53
1. Dark Elf Sorseresses get +1 to cast. No restriction on which lore they use.

2. If a warrior but a Repeater Crossbow it replaces their spear and that is it. Nothing happens to any of the other options. You can still buys shields for them (which is a good idea as it give them a 4+ AS in combat.

3. A Repeater Crossbow is it's own weapon (just like a Repeater Pistol/Handgun). They have their own rules and do not use the parent weapons rules at all. So as Repeater Crossbows (often shortened to Rxbow) can move and fire as it's own rules allow you to.

Chain
24-06-2008, 21:59
Well I do care since i haven't picked which army Im going to play yet. The new book for september was the reason i bought the DE book(1/3 normal price)
So it's the only army book i have for the current warhammer, though I've agreed with my opponent that I can use my old Chaos regiments as stand ins.


Edit: and removed part since got answer

Mainly bought the book since DE is one of the armies I never got to battle back when i played so i was curious to know more about em.

Who knows, maybe it'll become the army I'll play

4+?
well that's only for close combat right?

Hmm shouldn't it be 5+ in this case? Light armor+ shield

Thx for clarifying about the lores

Karpav
24-06-2008, 22:12
4+?
well that's only for close combat right?

Correct. -From attacks coming from the front. 5+ in CC from the flanks or rear, & 6+ at other times from shooting etc.).

Chain
24-06-2008, 22:28
Hmm... I guess I'll take away the shields and perhaps Rxbows away from em then perhaps also the standard and musican and simply turn em into Canon fodder...
Or should I rather add more Corsairs since they're more fit against archers...
If i give them shields and Rxbows I'll likely just lose more points since my opponents range is longer and 6+ against arrows ain't helping much against Wood elves...

Shadow seem to be a good choice if i get Creeping death, Unseen Lurker or Shades of death, but Crown of taidron,Pit of shades and to a lesser degree steed of shadows don't seem to be to good with my army and opponent...

Spirit
25-06-2008, 01:15
Steed of shadows + assassin = dead mage/warmachine/flanking cavalry ect ect.

It definitely has its uses.

Arnizipal
25-06-2008, 10:46
6+ at other times from shooting etc.).
It's still 5+ against shooting.
You get to use your light armour AND your shield ;)


Hmm... I guess I'll take away the shields and perhaps Rxbows away from em then perhaps also the standard and musican and simply turn em into Canon fodder...
Or should I rather add more Corsairs since they're more fit against archers...
If i give them shields and Rxbows I'll likely just lose more points since my opponents range is longer and 6+ against arrows ain't helping much against Wood elves...

Do you know Dark Elves got an update some time ago? I don't know if this change ever made it into the books, but you can find it on the GW site (http://uk.games-workshop.com/darkelves/update/1/).
It's official and everything, and makes Dark Elf warriors dirt cheap, even with crossbows and shields.

Chain
25-06-2008, 12:13
So shields work against missile attacks?

Anyway I decided to get rid of That warrior Regiment Which gave me 140 points to place around, Add in 5 more Corsairs and a lvl 1 Sorceress.


As for magic picking I think I'll go with Death Magic for my lvl 2 Wiz and Dark Magic for the lvl 1.

Pit of shades tests on I which ain't to helpful against elves, Steed of shadows with crown of taidron would be Kamikaze.

Im pretty sure my opponent will have at least 1 Dispel scroll, so best way I found to counter that was to get more sorceresses.

Well I saw some of the new DE rules, but Without having it all better to go by the book i have.
It's my return to warhammer battle after all and it's my opponents first battle(so good thing that there'll be others to hopefully correct us)


A question regarding Wood Elves:
Bow of Loren + Hail of Doom Arrow(one use)
Does this mean that for a Highborn It'll be 4 Hail of Doom Arrows(In the turn of use) or that only 1 of the 3 Shots will be it?

Potentially 72 S4 shots from one character in 1 turn... Ouch if it is so.

Condottiere
25-06-2008, 12:48
Potentially 72 S4 shots from one character in 1 turn... Ouch if it is so.If true, I doubt that anyone would play against them.

theunwantedbeing
25-06-2008, 12:54
A question regarding Wood Elves:
Bow of Loren + Hail of Doom Arrow(one use)
Does this mean that for a Highborn It'll be 4 Hail of Doom Arrows(In the turn of use) or that only 1 of the 3 Shots will be it?

Potentially 72 S4 shots from one character in 1 turn... Ouch if it is so.

It isnt so.
Look to page 64 under the rules for the hail of doom arrow...surprisingly clear.

Chain
25-06-2008, 13:44
It isnt so.
Look to page 64 under the rules for the hail of doom arrow...surprisingly clear.


Thought so, thx for the clarifying.

As for the page to look at well ain't helping me, since It's my opponent that might use it for the game and I don't have the Current Wood Elves army book(I have the one from Edition 4 though ;) )
And for the Rulebook I have a smaller version of it, Or the big versions of the Rule and Battle Book for 5'th edition ^^'

So yeah I might look at that but not till the time of the battle.


So how was the Rule for shields vs Shooting?
I might be thickheaded, but Would my warriors with Light armor and Shields have a 4,5 or 6+ armor save against S3 arrows?
4 sound unlikely

theunwantedbeing
25-06-2008, 14:08
5+ save vs shooting
Then you apply modifers as normal.

It's 5+ as a the sheild provides a 6+ save on it's own, and the light armour provides a 6+ save on it's own, so both together provide a 5+ save.

moose
25-06-2008, 14:10
Each additional level of armour gives a +1 sv.
Light armour = 6+
Light armour and shield = 5+
Heavy Armour and shield = 4+
As above plus mounted = 3+
As above plus barding = 2+
Even if the bearer also has a two handed weapon he can use his shield against shooting.

While in combat you get the same as above, but get a +1 to parry if using a handweapon and shield. So Heavy armour, shield, handweapon = 3+.

So in conclusion, a dark elf warrior with a shield would get a 5+ against a S3 shot, and a 6+ against a S4 shot.

Moose.

Chain
25-06-2008, 14:28
Ah good so it's like in the old days.
Though I can't say i recall the +1 sv. for hand weapon and shield.

What if i use Shield of Ghrond and a hand weapon? Would i get the parry bonus?
I doubt it count but Sword of might Ain't counting as a hand weapon to be used with parry right?

If it is then... Just how good is the save of My General i wonder...

Heavy: +2 sv.
Cold One: +2 sv.
Sead Dragon cloak: +1 sv. vs mele, +2 sv. vs shooting
And then If the Parry is add or The shield were to give Sv. +1 & +1 each...

So this is an armor save of 2+ vs mele and 1+ vs shooting? While all attacks get -1 S cause of the shield
but if the parry and Shield stil include the armor save that would make for an armor save of 1+ vs mele and 0+ vs shooting...

Would this mean that even If an opponent has S6 I'd still be saving on a 2+...

Just to be sure Even if i have 1+ armor save I fail my armor save at a roll of 1 right?

moose
25-06-2008, 15:09
A roll of one is always a fail.

Dark elf noble with heavy armour, sea dragon cloak and a shield on cold one is... 1+ in combat, and 0+ vs shooting. So S6 shots would be a 3+sv, and reduced to 2+ because of the shield.

If you gave him a handweapon it'd be 0+ in close combat because of the parry rule, so 0+/0+.

Chain
25-06-2008, 15:24
So that rule is also the same as back then regarding the roll of 1.

I think I got the potential Monster Fighter here... Though in a 1500 point battle... I suppose I should use other magic items since the chance of facing Dragons and there like ain't that big.

moose
25-06-2008, 15:39
Every army has the ability to field a hero with a magic weapon giving the ability to negate armour saves - so you're friends after one or two games i'm sure would exploit it easily! Also watch out for cannon balls or stone throwers - they also negate all saves.

Dark_Mage99
25-06-2008, 15:42
A roll of one is always a fail.

Dark elf noble with heavy armour, sea dragon cloak and a shield on cold one is... 1+ in combat, and 0+ vs shooting. So S6 shots would be a 3+sv, and reduced to 2+ because of the shield.

If you gave him a handweapon it'd be 0+ in close combat because of the parry rule, so 0+/0+.

I think the bonus of weapon + shield is only when on foot.

Chain
25-06-2008, 19:55
Well... I am to find stand ins to play DE, I don't have a single elf so here's the question to 1 penny:
What Size is the Plate Dark Elf warriors, Corsairs & Executioners use?

This is wither I should use "Skinks" or "Beastmen" as stand ins. (The way It is now where The skinks Take the spot of the Executioners, the Chaos Warriors are the Warriors, the Beastmen are Corsairs, Chaos Knights are Cold One Knights and a large Plate is a stand in For a bolthrower with 2 Familiars as the crew)

I'd have an easy time getting the Beastman Size stand ins where as the Skink Sized Is more troublesome(they look to much alike)

So which Size is there plate the size of the Beastmens or the size of the Skinks?

Arnizipal
25-06-2008, 20:15
A roll of one is always a fail.

Dark elf noble with heavy armour, sea dragon cloak and a shield on cold one is... 1+ in combat, and 0+ vs shooting. So S6 shots would be a 3+sv, and reduced to 2+ because of the shield.

If you gave him a handweapon it'd be 0+ in close combat because of the parry rule, so 0+/0+.

I think the bonus of weapon + shield is only when on foot.
Heavy armour: 5+
Sea Dragon Cloak: 4+/3+(shooting)
Shield: 3+/2+(shooting)
Cold One: 1+/0+(shooting)

Parry save isn't factored in. :)

And I don't know what you mean by "large plate".
If you mean base size, then I can tell you all Dark Elf infantry models are on small bases.

Chain
25-06-2008, 20:31
By large plate i ment the same Size as the one Used by Minotaurs, Trolls and Ogers

I used to play Lizardmen & Chaos so No warmachines there to use as stand ins.

Kinda Troublesome that they use the small skink Sized plates, Im not sure if My Chaos warriors or Beastmen can stand next to each other if placed on such a small plate...
But If I don't do that I'd be at a disadvantage in most cases seeing that my opponent would have a larger target to charge.
Though if templates are used from spells I'd get an advantage with larger plates.

I'll try to see if i can get em down to the plate then.