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EvilMinion
01-07-2008, 03:10
Hello everyone!

I have a simple question, can you use more than one Doom & Darkness (Page 119 of Warhammer Rulebook) on a single unit; ie. Stacking twice for a total modifier of -6 to leadership?

I was thinking not... but I decided to ask the geniuses at Warseer - you have'nt let me down once yet!! :)

With all the frenzy of 0+ armour Bloodthirsters I 99% doubt I can do this...

decker_cky
01-07-2008, 04:04
I would say no, for the same reason Bear's Anger doesn't stack (see GW FAQ).

Loopstah
01-07-2008, 11:11
Hmm, you could argue either way as the spell does not actually alter a characteristic like Bears Anger/ FSoR it just gives a penalty on tests.

Bears Anger specifically doesn't stack as it adds to the Base Value, which isn't the case here.

kroq'gar
01-07-2008, 14:23
I see it like this. A unit effected by doom and darkness suffers -3 ld. Casting it more than once wont increase a spells effects if the unit is already effected (exeptions are noted as such).

I am affected by wall of fire. Can the effects be doubled (eg all models take two st 4 hits if the regiment moves)?

I'd say no, though my basis is more in, well... i cant find my rule book.

Loopstah
01-07-2008, 14:37
Interestingly there appears to be nothing in the BRB about casting the same spell on a unit and the effects stacking except in two places.

The first is the Bears Anger/ Flaming Sword FAQ answer which states they don't stack because they add to the Base Characteristics, Which makes sense really. Note this answer only applies to these specific spells though.

The other is the Cancelling spells section on pg 110. This states that if two spells are cast on a unit that contradict the newer one dispels the old one.

There is nothing that says if you cast the same spell on the same unit they don't stack their effects.

So I see no reason why Doom and Darkness cast twice on the same unit wouldn't result in a -6LD penalty or Wall of Fire cast twice to result in twice as many hits.

DeathlessDraich
02-07-2008, 11:59
Answered in the last FAQ:
Q ...cast Bear's Anger multiple times ...do their bonuses stack up?
A: No etc

Any bonuses affecting charactereistics do *not* stack up.

Loopstah
02-07-2008, 12:02
Answered in the last FAQ:
Q ...cast Bear's Anger multiple times ...do their bonuses stack up?
A: No etc

Any bonuses affecting charactereistics do *not* stack up.

Doom and Darkness does not affect a characteristic.

DeathlessDraich
02-07-2008, 12:13
Yes, I know. My post just added to the first part of your previous comment

Loopstah
02-07-2008, 12:14
Yes, I know. My post just added to the first part of your previous comment

Sorry, I took it you meant the other way. :o

decker_cky
02-07-2008, 17:24
Other places where multiples of the same spell doesn't affect the unit more than once:


Q. Can a unit be affected by the Slaanesh spell
Luxurious Torment several times, thus suffering
additional damage at the start of each turn?
A. No, further castings of this spell on the same
unit have no additional effects.

Krusty
02-07-2008, 18:55
that only answers for luxorious torment though...

however, for D&D, id say it wouldnt stack...
it says they suffer a -3 penalty to rolling ld tests...
but, if it said that theyre leadership itself is reduced by 3, i think it would

decker_cky
02-07-2008, 19:02
I know, I was answering to the earlier comment where someone said they only knew of two spells that don't stack.

To the general question, I thought the general statement on those situations was that most spells don't stack because they're giving the same effect. So you could cast Doom and Darkness twice on a model, but each one would cause the same modification to leadership tests, making it so the effect is the same as having a single doom and darkness. Not sure if that's something adapted by me from the other spell stacking rulings, or if I actually read it in a commentary somewhere.

Fulgrim's-Chosen
02-07-2008, 22:52
perhaps I'm remembering incorrectly, but couldn't you do a "double-stack" of the old Mortal Chaos (Nurgle) spell, "Pestilence" (IIRC), the #6 spell of the Hordes of Chaos list ?

I forget it's wording, but I recall reading it and thinking "hmm, the way that is written, a subsequent casting would simply result in the target unit taking TWO tests", etc.

I never played with it, but am just thinking about it from memory, so could be mistook.

(relevance to this discussion would be that if it was allowed to work that way for the Nurgle spell, couldn't it be allowed to work similiarly for Doom and Darkness ?)

Gazak Blacktoof
03-07-2008, 12:17
In an ideal world you wouldn't be able to stack leadership penalties (except with those from combat resolution) to prevent ridiculous situations like those with slaanesh daemons and this spell.

skank
03-07-2008, 12:26
That would be terrible, could not Doom+Darkness somebody then have the masque do her thing (whats wrong with that?).
Saying that leadership test always pass on a double 1 like breaktests would make sence.

Bears anger/FsoR/etc are stated exceptions (which would not be needed if it was a blanket rule that spells don't stack), so i would say D+D could stack.