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Mr. Stabby
06-07-2008, 19:53
Ok, so I wanted to build a relatively chariot heavy army, but still rely on magic and shooting a lot. I absolutely hate Tomb King cav, so I didn't want any of that mess, and I don't use fliers as they usually don't do a whole lot vs. my normal opponents. This leaves me with the probelm of taking out artillery, while still having a nice strong force to punch with. Here is what I came up with:

Tomb King: 263 pts
Crown Of The Kings
Crook And Flail Of Radiance
Light Armor

Priest (Hirophant): 310 pts
Casket Of Souls
Dispel Scroll x2

Priest (Second Highest): 148 pts
Skeletal Horse Mount
Staff of Ravening

Priest (Third Highest): 153 pts
Skeletal Horse Mount
Plaques Of Mighty Incantations
Enkhil's Kanopi

Tomb Guard (14): 211 pts
Standard Bearer with Undying Legion Banner
Musician
Tomb King's Unit

Tomb Scorpions (3): 255 pts

Screaming Skull Catapult: 90 pts

Chariot (2 units of 3): 240 pts

Skeleton Warriors (2 units of 30): 530 pts
Full Command
Bows

Tomb Swarm: 45 pts


The tactic is quite well crafted. Everything works in perfect synch. Field the units as described in the book under the section "And let the Heavens be darkened with arrows," using your two blocks or archers to form two solid long lines in the front, the Tomb Guard in the middle, and the Chariots on the sides. Like described in the tactic, fire catapults and arrows until the enemy comes towards you, using magic phases to raise units back to full capacity as needed or shoot twice.

Now, when the enemy comes close, reform the archers back to blocks and move your Tomb Guard in between the two newly formed blocks of archers. Move your Chariots up the flanks. Now, move the skeleton line up and slam into the enemy. Use spells to hit twice or resurrect as needed. Your Tomb Guard and Tomb King unit should plow through the middle of the enemy line, and your skeletons should be able to tarpit the enemy for quite a while. Use your mobile casters to get into the best position to support this line. Slam the sides of the enemy line with your chariots and eventually you should be able to smash just about any line to pieces.

Now how to use the Tomb Scorpions and Tomb Swarm. Use these bad boys with the "It Came From Below" rule to put them inbetween the enemy line and enemy artillery. They should pop up around that area and allow you to either chew through enemy artillery crews, or get rear charges off. These two units are hard to kill, and surely won't go down without a good fight. If you need more flank support against heavy cav armies, don't be afraid to deploy them normally on the flanks too.

The magic phase is carefully constructed also. Your first caster is your King. The crown sucks in most cases, but it has its use here: draw out dispel dice. If the casts go through, great, if they get dispelled, even better. The next caster has the bound spell and the reroll plaques. This allows him to have the best power dice he can in order to draw out even more dispel dice, and the bound spell may draw a dice or two. The third caster can now cast his bound staff spell with little worry, and get his incantation off. If they dispel the staff spell, even better, less dice for the casket and the other spells. The hirophant is left, and he will just make the catapult double fire. A necessary spell, but after all the other spells go off, it may be an ignored one. Finally the casket is cast. Hopefully it will go off, but if it is dispelled, that means the enemy was saving dice for it and a lot of your other spells got through. Either way you're sitting pretty.

Overall it is a very good tactic. It's a bit too regimented to play against friends all the time, seeing as they will quickly adapt to this tactic, but it sure is great for those first games against this list when you see your enemies' jaws drop as you slaughter them by the hundreds. It has some glaring holes, but overall it is a very fun, useable, and powerful list. Enjoy.

mtw1983
06-07-2008, 22:17
Maybe it's just the people I play but that list looks uglier than a woman from the midwest. Below is a list of the gripes I'd have with this list

1) Characters-
a) King should probably just have a GW and thats it, a ward would be nice too?
b) Putting your hierophant on the casket is a nice way of saying " Kill me! Im T3 and will make the army crumble when I go!"

2) Troops-
a) Chariots are very iffy in a list like this, if you're going to use a TK why not mount him on a chariot also so he can keep up and incant as needed?

3) Special-

a) 3 Tomb scorpions is probably a bit much, two would work fine.
b) Tomb gaurd, Id rather be playing Ushabti but if it works for you then to each his own.

4) Rare-
a) The casket is currently a bit overpriced, you'd do better replacing it with a bone giant

Gazak Blacktoof
06-07-2008, 23:12
I too think you should ditch a scorpion. Get some carrion instead if you're having trouble with warmachines, you should be able to silence one of them in your first turn with a magical charge.

I don't think removing the casket for a bone giant is a very good idea if you want to remain stationary and drawn the enemy in. If you were to swap it for anything it should be another skull catapult as your plan is a bit fragged if the one you have explodes on a misfire.

I'd suggest trying to squeeze in a warbanner onto one of the skeleton warrior units to give it the chance to repel an enemy.

Overall I'd suggest

1) Get some carrion

2) Ditch the casket for another SSC

3) Give a warbanner to skeleton warriros

4) Swap the crook and flail for a great weapon and a couple of defensive items or give the king the brooch of the great desert and swap a scroll on the hierophant for the hieratic jar.

5) Increase the size of the Tomb Guard with any remaining points.

TK421
07-07-2008, 07:53
Tomb Guard definitely need to be bigger, 20 should be the minimum.

Mr. Stabby
07-07-2008, 16:06
I was a bit worried about the Guard unit being quite small. I figured the Undying Legion banner and two support casters would be enough in most cases to keep them alive though. I will see what I can wiggle in to get that unit to 20+ models though.

As for the casket, I'm keeping it. I love the thing, and it has never failed me. It may be a bit on the expensive side, but drawing out dispel dice or killing units, it always makes up for its points IMO. Bone giants are just 200+ point bolt thrower targets. I see no way shape or form in which they are a better investment than a Casket. I play Dark Elves, Empire, Chaos, and Night Goblins a lot, so the Giant WILL get pincushioned. Just a free 200+ points for the enemy.

As for not putting the hiro on the casket, the only other option I have is to run him alongside my units, and with a cannon sniper (and I DO play a guy who is a consistent cannon sniper) or someone good a guess ranges, I might just lose him easier that way. At least with the casket he's a bit more protected, and has a nice terror cushion and some guard to assist him. Not to mention I can field my scorps normally in my zone to cover him if needed. I might drop a ward on him too, just for that extra advantage. I know most people think three scorps is overkill, but the advantage of having that third heavy hitter swinging around in the enemies back is just too nice to pass up.

As for the Chariots, I don't really care if they are destroyed. All they are there for is to crush the flanks, or if absolutely needed, tie up something on the flanks I can't handle at the moment. I don't expect them to really be tide turning most of the time, but if everything goes well, they just might give me the extra punch I need. In my previous list my TK was on a chariot, and the extra punch the CoF added was GREAT, but after that initial hit, the chariots just don't do enough to really be tide turning in close combat. Maybe it's because I'm hitting Chaos units, but the stat line on the chariots just doesn't seem to cut it.

Dropping 5 from each of the Skeleton units and dropping the Tomb Swarm would bring my Tomb Guard unit to 25 units strong, with units of 25 Skeletons with full command. Does that seem better, or would I be better off with more of the Skeletons (insta-fear outnumbering)?

I also realized that my one Priest cannot carry the Plaque and the Kanopi, so I swapped it for the jar and the Brooch.

OldMaster
07-07-2008, 18:20
I was a bit worried about the Guard unit being quite small. I figured the Undying Legion banner and two support casters would be enough in most cases to keep them alive though. I will see what I can wiggle in to get that unit to 20+ models though.

Do that.

Besides, which Chaos are you playing? Chaos is a pretty hard army to beat for Tombs imo : O

Mr. Stabby
07-07-2008, 20:02
I play Tchar Chaos, with marks on everything. Also a Korne Beast list is floating around the shop I play at, so I'm sure I'll run into that eventually.

But my question is, should I go for the outnumber / fear combo, or just get the tomb guard to 20+ and not worry about my ranks of skeletons? Seems like the fear would go a bit further in most games...

I haven't gotten a ton of TK games under my belt yet, so I'm still a bit unsure with the army. Thank you all for your advice and I'll see what I can't figure out. Playing Wood Elf today so I should have plenty of fun. ^_^

TK421
08-07-2008, 08:00
Tomb King Archers are great against Wood Elves.

Oh, I'm -28 to hit you? No, I don't think so :D

splinter & poison
27-07-2008, 04:27
Its descent, id ditch the swarm though. replace it with a bone giant if you can afford the points or even some ushabti, as three tomb scorpions will be more than capalble of dispatching your enemies artillery ( i might even drop a scorpion and throw in some carrion). The "let the heavens be darkend with arrows is a good tactic but if your going up against a army with lots of artillery you need to be carful. a few good hits and your bowmen go back to the dust from whence they came! Ya you can raise em back up but your lying to yourself if you think you can bring em all back up after a direct artillery hit and another off to the side a bit.

And having your hierophant on the casket is borderline suicide. I would say take him off but don't put him on a horse either. I almost always put him on foot because then he can hide behind the bulk of my army.;)


In commorragh death is not a right, but a privlidge

Lazarus15
27-07-2008, 17:40
Just some food for thought:

In a list like this I would either go with a Liche High Priest with Neferra's Plaque of Mighty Incantations or Queen Khalida (spelling?). For the LHP, that is two incantations a turn, with three re-rollable dice. So not including bound wargear Items, that is 14 Incantation dice per turn. 6 for the LHP, 2 per LP, 2 for TP, and 2 for casket.

As far as Magic Items, you could also add in some dispel scrolls and Staff of Sorcery. TK's don't have fantastic magic resistance, so between the -1 from the casket, the +2 to dispell, and the 3-4 scrolls, you should have a decent time in your opponents magic phase. I personally like the Hieratic Jar on your LHP for 3 more incantation dice for one turn, in addition the priest on the casket is a good candidate for the Blue Khepra, I think is what it is, that gives the casket magic resistance (2).

You could always just go with a Tomb Prince in the Tomb Guard with a Great Weapon, and still get your two incantation dice, and have 50 points to spend on whatever like a Golden Ankhra for the 4+ ward or I LOVE the Blade of Setep for the DESTROYS Magic armor when you hit and ignores armor saves! But that is up to you.

As far as the Casket goes, I run one in my chariot heavy list and it is AWESOME, however, I would say it is a must to take your Heirophant off of it, due to the whole fire magnet idea.

Tomb Guard, as previously mentioned, do need to be in a larger block...IE at least 20. As far as the banner goes, the BoUDL is good, I prefer the mirage standard on the hammer in my army. It cannot be dispelled, and gives staying power to your TG.

I use 3 scorp's in my list, but I have bad luck with the Art. Dice. If you find that you are getting the job done with two, cut the third. There are no better warmachine hunters in my opinion so I would keep it. Not to mention they are great all around, so if you are fighting, say Daemons, they work fine against chariots, heralds, pretty much anything but skulltaker, Bloodletters, and GD's.

I would have two groups of chariots numbering at least 4 in each group. Three is not quite enough, especially for sake of casualties.

I hope this helps and good luck!

DeathlessDraich
27-07-2008, 18:10
The Hierophant starts the battle on The Casket??!

moose
27-07-2008, 18:30
I think you're battleline looks a little iffy:

1. Drop one tomb scorpion and the tomb scorpion for three more chariots - the scorpions are excessive, and the swarm unnecessary. [I run 9 chariots - 4 plus a prince, and a unit of 5. But 3 units of 3 is great against hordes].

2. Drop the mounts on your liche priests they'll get wiped out way too easily. I usually have mounted liche priests with some light horsemen running behind chariots to cast incantations. But yeah - put them in the archers or skeleton blocks.

3. Increase the tomb guard to 20+, and give them the Icon of Rakaph. They'll never ever be flanked and load your tomb king into here.

4. I'd suggest using a king with the Collar of Shapesh - basically a 4+ ward which can never be negated. With the Destroyer of Eternities equipped as well your tomb guard unit will be both a brilliant hammer and tarpit if necessary.

5. I'd drop one of the units of skeletons to:
a. make the changes above
b. give your catapault the skulls of the foe
c. use a prince in chariot - flail, chariot of fire, and the golden eye of rah nut so it can't be autokilled.

EDIT: Don't worry about your heirophant on a casket if tomb guard with the icon of rakaph are guarding it. Your opponent will think they're about to flank you're casket with flyers, but you reform to face, move then magically charge from the king/heirophant.

Moose.

moose
27-07-2008, 19:19
I've made a list with my edited suggestions, because i'm bored and I was making some armylists anyway. If you don't like the list I don't mind I think it's worth a shot myself on gamesnight this week!


1 - King - Destroyer of Eternities, Collar of Shapesh, Light Armour, Shield - 253
1 - Priest - Casket of Souls, Golden Ankhra (4+ward) - 155
1 - Priest - Dispel Scroll, Dispel Scroll - 165
1 - Prince - Chariot, Chariot of Fire, Golden eye of Rah-Nutt, Flail, Light Armour, Shield - 201

16 - Skeleton Warriors - FC, (Archers) - 178
16 - Skeleton Warriors - FC, (Archers) - 178
[I'm taking 12 light horsemen and making my second priest mounted instead of the second archer unit. I'll use the first unit to block charges to the SSC and casket.]
3 - Chariots - - 120
3 - Chariots - - 120
3 - Chariots - - 120
[I'm taking them in a unit of 4 and 5 chariots].

1 - Tomb Scorpion - - 85
1 - Tomb Scorpion - - 85
20 - Tomb Guard - FC, Icon of Rakaph - 310

1 - Screaming Skull Catapault - Skulls of the Foe - 110
1 - Casket of Souls - - 165

2245