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DigbyWeapon
07-07-2008, 12:45
Hi everyone
I have got 15 white lions and some other stuff for my birthday and I wanted to know how I in your opinions go about using them?
I have some phoenix guard currently that I think are pretty helpful and some sword masters which I think I know how to use, but I'm lost with the White Lions.


Thanks in advance
Digby

BloodiedSword
07-07-2008, 13:16
Personally I use them in small units of about 7 - 8, in a single rank. I use them as flank protectors that are much sturdier than Swordmasters (with their 3+ against shooting), that people are very very reluctant to try charge.

This way you take maximum advantage of their best trait (Stubborn), so that even when they get charged by a massive fully ranked unit, provided they don't wipe you out completely (which is unlikely with your ASF), you are testing on 8.

Even if you don't need them to hold flanks, they do an excellent job of flanking themselves.

Still, personally I've stopped using them as I find that PG plus hoping you roll Courage is a much better way of doing the same thing.

EldarWonderland
07-07-2008, 13:19
Just come back from my local GW and we were talking about just such a thing.

I was told to use them in 2 ranks of 7 with command to get the maximum number of hits.

They go first, have a -2 on armour save roll against shooting because of the lion pelts, str 5 (i think) and from memory have axes that are great weapons.

Pretty hard.

Basically i don't think they are going anywhere apart from where THEY want to go :)

I am TK and my son is HE - that's why I am a little bit interested in these scallywags.

PS If I have some stats wrong my apologies - this was all from memory which isn't what it once was.

isidril93
07-07-2008, 13:23
there are two ways you can use them. either as a big strong unit of 15 or as a flanker. since you have pg you will prob use wl as a flanker but if you dont i suggest putting in a hero or a lord to help them out with attacks. also they are good at taking out cavalary with their -3 as modifier.

eleveninches
07-07-2008, 14:29
give them a banner of magic res (2) or a BSB with banner of world dragon

Condottiere
07-07-2008, 14:35
You can use White Lions in a number of functions:

1. Tarpit (breather while other units have the time to attack)
2. Ambush (moving through forests)
3. Flanking attacks (denying rank bonus)
4. Baby-sitters (character bodyguards)
5. Anti-tank (taking out high AS opponents)

Son_Of_A_Horus
07-07-2008, 14:36
Don't forget they move through woods too. Always a useful rule

Arguleon-veq
07-07-2008, 16:50
I think the work just fine as main line units in blocks of 14. Can them join a character for 3 x 5 or just 7 x 2. I think they are the best of the 3 Special Blocks [PG, SM]. Pheonix Guard cant fight and Swordmasters die in a strong breeze. White Lions are the perfect middle ground.

TheDarkDuke
08-07-2008, 04:57
You can use White Lions in a number of functions:

1. Tarpit (breather while other units have the time to attack)
2. Ambush (moving through forests)
3. Flanking attacks (denying rank bonus)
4. Baby-sitters (character bodyguards)
5. Anti-tank (taking out high AS opponents)

Personally through opinions and gameplay:

1. There 5+ save means they are very poor tarpit units, they are hard hitting assaulters, not meant to hold anything up but chew threw them... if not they are 9.9/10 times dead.
2. They are great at this, and moving threw woods if often overlooked by many.
3. I think this goes pretty much hand in hand with ambush.
4. When they gain stubborn, they become harder but are still not a tar pit, just a assault unit that if stalled an extra round have the chance to fight threw it with stubborn.
5. Anti tank :eyebrows:;):) They pack the best punch reliable punch for HE, and being moved to special have become a very good option.

Marwynn
08-07-2008, 06:35
Using them in units of 15 is about right. This gives you the flexibility to go 5x3 or 7x2+1 as necessary depending on your enemy's army.

I wouldn't stick a unit champ in there unless you have a character joining in, but a musician and standard bearer are nice to have. The Lion Banner is what you should be looking at most of the time; Terror-immune and Stubborn is nice.

They can withstand ranged fire of course but not that much.

Alternatively they can be used as harassment screens in units of 7 each. Sent ahead of the force they are thrown away. It's a very un-HE tactic, but it works best when mixed in with some small SM units too. Works best for those core-centric armies but it's not something I'd advise.

DigbyWeapon
08-07-2008, 10:18
I went to my local games workshop today and asked the question, and they said that they are good for chewing through units, and should be used over ph in smaller games, but ph are better at absorbing damage.


Thanks again
Digby

Armilthuan
08-07-2008, 11:24
I use mine as a MBU. And thanks to their 'Move through woods' special rule (and being elves), they are quite manouverable.

I run them 14 strong with full command, Lion Banner, Gem of Courage and my 'Tank' Lord (Armour of Caledor, Vambraces of Defense).

They can generally take on pretty much anything. Holding the enemy line up. I have seen them take on half an army on their own and still come back for more. Then my Swordmasters, Spearelves and Chariots can turn on the enemy surrounding my White Lions.

Should the enemy not be foolish enough to try and take down the White Lions, they then have enough hitting power (thanks to the Lord) to chew most things up front.

I have also found that they do pretty well against Brettonnians.

40kdhs
08-07-2008, 18:46
I don't personally like WL units because a SM unit will give your opponent a lot of problems. a SM unit is better than a WL unit because of its WS and 2 As.

If i want my SM unit to go through wood, i give it a banner of Ellyran.

I like lion chariots.

Mad Doc Grotsnik
08-07-2008, 18:58
One thing worth mentioning, just because they *can* move through cover doesn't mean they *have* to!

One of my regular opponents uses Yetis, and gets so obsessed with them being able to swing through the trees, they always do so, even if they could be used better elsewhere.

The small unit approach, although not one I'd normally reccomend, isn't a bad idea with these guys, as they are pretty resilient against small arms fire, thus 'ablative wounds' are less necessary to keep them in fighting shape.

Used to back up Lion Chariots, these guys will hit like a tonne of bricks. Hell, even back up Ellyrion Chariots is a good use of the guys!

Wadders
08-07-2008, 19:43
They are great fighting units at ST6 and WS5 - ASF is a powerful thing with these guys

I use them 2 units

unit (a) 14 strong, standard of balance (full command) with a bsb armed with a great weapon and the armour of caledor

unit (b) 14 strong, lion standard (full command) normally with korhil or a noble with a great weapon

10 strength ASF, S6 attacks... normally hitting on 3's

Not nice

DigbyWeapon
09-07-2008, 08:42
So I figure that they are a fairly flexible unit? :D
What do you guys prefer using though, phoenix guard or white lions?

Digby

Armilthuan
09-07-2008, 11:58
I tend to be more aggressive, so White Lions and Swordmasters fit my bill over Phoenix Gaurd. I'm not saying they are bad, just that they don't fit my taste.

That Guy
09-07-2008, 18:47
I use my White Lions as a flank protector. I put them just to the side of a wood and watch my opponent cringe as he tries to figure out a way around it. I have gotten multiple charges off on cavalry using them this way.

As for the Banner of Ellyrion on Swordmasters, it's tempting, but I prefer to put that banner on my Dragon Princes. I consider banners like that a force multiplier, and so you want them on a stronger unit to begin with.