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Kalec
14-07-2008, 05:24
I have decided to take up Fantasy. Coming from 40K, the Empire has drawn me in, with plenty of heavy armor, wacky gadgets, and firearms galore. I put together a small list that I should be able to proxy using marine and chaos bikers and IG rough riders easily enough.

3 Warrior Priests on warhorses with with GW, heavy armor, and barding - 336

3 units of 6 knights, all with full command - 414

1 unit of 6 pistoliers with musician and champ with repeater - 125

995 points

27 models total
5 dispel die
3 prayers per turn

The goal is to use the mobility of cavalry to ensure that I am able to charge the enemy. The priests let me control the magic phase, with my enemy stretched just getting 3 level 2 wizards and some troops, much less a full array of magical kit. Most will take just 2 characters, making it much easier for my prayers to remain undispelled and allowing me to negate their magic much easier.

The priests contribute to combat by hitting as hard on the charge as the knights, and by allowing rerolls to hit with hatred and to wound with hammer of sigmar (especially deadly on the outrider). They can make their units unbreakable should the need arise, and soulfire is great for clearing away undead or deamon tarpits and flankers all at once, which is incredibly important for units the live or die by the charge. They can also heal themselves, great for denying VP's later in the match should things go poorly.

The pistoliers harass low T, high armor save targets, and charge into weaker troops if need be, and can take out war machine crews to keep the heavy cavalry safe.

Low model count is a problem, but I am hoping my mobility and armor can help overcome this. Comments and suggestions welcome, though keep in mind I want to keep my model count relatively low as that makes preparing and moving my army much, much faster.

Marwynn
14-07-2008, 06:42
It's an interesting list. Three hate-filled units of Knights charging about with a pistolier unit keeping the enemy honest.

There are a few problems with it though: 1) Fear/Terror, you'll be able to negate VC/Daemon magic but not their Fear. One unit with Icon of Magnus would do that, else you'll find that you have a perfect combo-charge set-up and one unit of Knights won't cooperate.

Another is truly hard-hitting capabilities. Believe it or not there are a few armies out there that'll take a charge of Knights to the face and shrug it off. Or kill you before your lances can touch them in combat. Not to mention gunlines.

It's a list that you're going to gamble with for sure. I don't know how successful you'll be at proxying this too.

All in all I say try it out and have fun, it'll teach you a lot of things the hard way though. When you have the time and resources, invest in infantry for the Empire. It is that army's backbone.

Phytrion
14-07-2008, 15:34
My concern with this list is the staying power your units have. One bad roll of the dice and your units are bouncing. Without any static CR, you're relying exclusively on wounds to win combat. That may work against some lists, but what will you do against super heavy units such as plaguebearers with a herald and slime trail?

I would recommend dropping one warrior priest (since its only 1k points, 2 should provide enough magic defense in my opinion) to beef up one of your units so it has enough to give you at least a rank for some static.

Just my two cents.

monkeyboy1989
16-07-2008, 02:44
The priests let you defend in your opponants magic phase you get 5 dispell die, but the prayers are easy enough to dispell, you have a solid defense but a lack luster offence.

Personally I would drop a priest and get a captain with a lance, barded horse and shield he is only 74 points and packs more of a punch in a unit of knights. Give one of your priests Van Horstmann's Speculum otherwise enemy heroes are just gunna eat you up!

This army is as already stated a gamblers army, there are however a couple of things you can do to even the odds.

1)ONLY GO FOR A FLANK/REAR CHARGE I can't stress this enough, with units of 6 knights you will loose everything if you charge the front of the enemy unit, and with an army as small as that I doubt you will be able to get a front charge and a flank charge, so stay away from front charges at all costs.

2) It is always tempting with mounted units to charge just because you can. Don't. with an army as small as yours you will have to pick your fights, only charge if the unit you are killing is important to your opponant or a big threat to you, don't charge that unit of swordsmen just because there is nothing better to charge this turn.

Also unless I have lost my mind, you have miss counted you pistoliers points totals, you are 7 points light.

Marwynn
16-07-2008, 03:01
Oh I dunno, at this points level I'd be hard pressed to dispel all the prayers. Even with using the Power Dice in the following turn to dispel the RiP prayers. It's enough to let some go through.

kroq'gar
16-07-2008, 03:10
Could work... though my moneys on losing more than winning. Your army lacks the things that make empire knights great... st 5 isnt that great (an orc is t4 and will still get a 6+ save most the time)

Hatred will be used against you, and you have no throw away units & your vulnerable to phych. Not to mention your general has only a 3+ armour save.

i hope the repeater in the pisoliers is a pistol, otherwise he'll rarely shoot. This is a game of movement, and those are fast cavalry.

Still, at 1000k points you could do alot worse. Remember to utalise your movement, and i'll go against the grain a little- frontal charges can work with 7 riders and hatred, though dont try it against elites, and soft targets may flee from your charges.

monkeyboy1989
16-07-2008, 03:12
i hope the repeater in the pisoliers is a pistol, otherwise he'll rarely shoot.

I thought the same then checked the army book and found he can only take a repeater pistol. He can't take a rifle in a unit of pistoliers.

monkeyboy1989
16-07-2008, 03:15
i'll go against the grain a little- frontal charges can work with 7 riders and hatred, though dont try it against elites, and soft targets may flee from your charges.

Yeah to be fair against skirmishers you will win (if they don't flee) and most light infantry will probably be broken if you get enough wounds. But anything tougher than an orc will probably just thump you if you try a frontal charge.

Kalec
17-07-2008, 06:43
Feedback, exactly what I wanted. I was hoping for more comments about the composition of the army itself and some ideas for alternate unit choices, but I am happy with what I got.

For starters, I took 3 priests because an enemy with just the base dispel die is unable to stop all of my prayers. Statistically, I should be able to get off 2 against 2 dispel die, as opposed to one with only 2 priests. 5 dispel die is also enough to ensure that I shouldn't regret the lack of dispel scrolls too often. They only have 3+ armor saves, but can get 4+ ward saves and heal a lost wound with prayers, so they should be alright.

The speculum, as amazing as it is, I felt was not needed because very few heroes in this points range will be able to survive a charge by my knights, and against undead heroes I still have soulfire. I decided that an extra knight and some gear was worth more then a magic item that would rarely prove useful. Perhaps there are more super-choppy characters in 1K then I realize. If someone could give me a good argument as to why Van Horstmanns would be useful, I would love to hear it.

Yes, the pistolier champ has a repeater pistol. I wouldn't give him the handgun version if I could. Adding the points back up, I am off by 7. Now I have to find out how to cut 2 points, easiest way is to give on of the priests light armor. Or, I could cut a pistolier and give one of my characters a magic sword and a shield over his great weapon. Any suggestions on which to use (other then not the sword of striking, of course)?

I know that charging the front is a bad idea, as I am likely to be unable to break the enemy regiment and get ground down in a protracted battle unless I can negate their rank bonus.

If I do take a captain, it would be because I need a BSB, which very well may be the case. Just a stronger knight is not what I need, especially not for the cost of 3 knights.

Since you brought it up kroq, what exactly is it that makes empire knights great? I would have thought 1+ armor save, 7 movement, and s5 on the charge would be good enough. If there is something I am missing other then "they are better as knights of the inner circle" or "they work best when supporting infantry blocks", then tell me, for I am all ears.