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Hrw-Amen
06-08-2008, 17:24
Apart from Chief Librarian Astropath Illiyan Nastase whose mother was human and father an unknown Eldar pirate does anyone know of other marines who were not entirly of human stock?

Also he is the only marine I can find a record of who changed chapters having started off as a Dark Angels as a Librarian, (Which seams odd as they really don't seam to like fighting alongside aliens and I imagine a half breed would be as bad if not worse!) and then after a few years was apparently ordered to join the Ultramarines. Maybe becuase the Dark Angels didn't like hime being part xenos?

Anyway I can't seam to find any other examples of this anywhere and just wondered if it was a one off?

Lt.Bradford
06-08-2008, 17:25
Thats really old fluff, so I don't think any more like him exist.

ironcurtin117
06-08-2008, 18:21
That sounds weird, it's been retconned too much, SM organs only take to purest hosts and all that jazz

Dreachon
06-08-2008, 19:00
Consider it no longer usable, GW have changed the fluff so much it's no longer doable, eldar loathe humans.

Jellicoe
06-08-2008, 19:07
Indeed that fluff originally appeared in I think White Dwarf 98 barely a year or so after the launch of 40k. In those days marines were far more in the barely restrained psychopathic mercenary mold rather than today's warrior monks. GW was having a major beserker punk chainsaw phase at the time...

Fun but no longer current sadly

jma037
07-08-2008, 02:21
Arghhh....Good old Nastase Monkey-Lover, the shame of Ulthwé.

Gorbad Ironclaw
07-08-2008, 03:53
Yup, that would no longer be possible. Eldars and Humans can't interbreed, even if they could the result would most likely be killed on sight, especially by any space marines and certainly wouldn't be allowed to join. And once you have joined a chapter you don't 'transfer'. The single exception is the Deathwatch, but that's more being on loan than anything else.

Seved
07-08-2008, 04:12
The old jokers at GW must have thought of the 70's romanian tennis player, Ilie Nāstase, for some strange reason, when they created that one.;)

Hrw-Amen
07-08-2008, 12:04
I don't think things like this can be so easily disregarded. Perhaps it because I was there and into the hobby when it first came out and have all the white dwarfs back way before then that I like to hark back to those days.

Besides it was written by GW themselves. I'm not sure that you're description of marines back then is entirely accurate either 'In those days marines were far more in the barely restrained psychopathic mercenary mold rather than today's warrior monks.' afterall is said and done even the RT rulebook has a cut away drawing of the Space Wolves fortress monastary in it so that just goes to prove that even back then they were seen as monk like.

But that aside I think it still adds rich and interesting if somewhat obscure details to the tapestry of the 40K universe. The universe is a big place and I am sure that whether something generally happens there are always going to be exceptions to the rules.

So generally Eldar and humans cannot conceive, but there is always the one odd time that it happens maybe by some genetic flaw or more disturbingly by some evil Eldar (Or human?) experiment. (By the way I got the impression that his mother did not do it willingly, the Eldar guy was a pirate raider afterall.) A bit like when females get pregnant without the input form a male. Does not normally happen as a rule, in higher species, but does sometimes. (I'm talking things like crocodiles etc not religion before someone thinks otherwise.)

Not to mention that pirate raiders get up to all manner of things when they raid. Just think of the Eldar in viking helmets!

Shibboleth
07-08-2008, 15:41
The old jokers at GW must have thought of the 70's romanian tennis player, Ilie Nāstase, for some strange reason, when they created that one.;)...and Spock ...for the old pointy-ear-alien-mating-with-a-human thing... :D

As for Eldar and Human procreation, no, it's impossible. It's Heresy and a blasphemy against the human race to suggest humans have DNA similar enough to Eldar to make babies. That would suggest Eldar could have been responsible for the birth of the human race, or their DNA involved in the initial 'experiments', which both species would strongly deny.

If you want to keep with the old fluff (which I haven't read, so maybe this is off, but...) the eldar pirate may well have mated with the human woman, but couldn't be the child's true father. She must have been with some other human guy around the same time, and things then gotten confused from there... with rumours, etc.

Hrw-Amen
07-08-2008, 18:13
Mybe, I guess they said that about Ravenor, he was supposed to look like an Eldar wasn't he? Then again he did hang around with them for a bit.

However the picture in WD albeit a black & white drawing does look like an Eldar in SM power armour.

Back in those days, (When that was fresh and RT new'ish) I remember making a couple of squads that were mixed Eldar guardians and SM with bits from each. I think some of the bits came from Space Hulk expansions or something like that.

I'm not sure what happened to the models, they are probably in my mother's attic somewhere, but I seam to recall that they looked abit like Tau Battlesuits only normal SM size, sort of bulky in the middle with skinny legs / arms and little antena sticking out of their heads. Kind of funny thinking about it now. I'm sure an inquisitor somewhere would think of it as a heresy!!!

Jellicoe
07-08-2008, 18:27
I think that the eldar human marine is an early reflection of 40k as fantasy in space hence the half elven character as a simple transpose from all sorts of pseudo D&D fantasy settings. In those days eldar were simply space elves and orks were space orks

acknowledge the cut away fortress monastry in the RT rule book but it also has if I recall correctly a couple of marine dudes in power armour in a bar with a drink!

Kage2020
07-08-2008, 18:34
To be fair, those could have just been "dudes" in power armour, not Marines.

And is the "barely restrained pyschopath" approach to Marines actually dead? Seems to me that it is entirely consistent with the "warrior monk" approach. :D

Eldar-human hybrids, though? Nyargle...

Kage

DapperAnarchist
07-08-2008, 18:40
The Space Wolves Fortress-Monastery mentioned there a) wasn't a hollowed out mountain and b) wasn't on Fenris, but Lupus. So, thats out the window.

The Deathwatch... is that a "chapter" as such, or just an endless mission with rotating personnel? Its not that unusual for a force to be assembled from different Chapters...

sydbridges
08-08-2008, 05:37
The Deathwatch... is that a "chapter" as such, or just an endless mission with rotating personnel? Its not that unusual for a force to be assembled from different Chapters...

It's not really a chapter, per se. IIRC, Marine chapters are required to lend marines to the Deathwatch (although whether or not they do depends on how friendly the Inquisition, and more specifically, Ordo Xenos, and the marine chapter in question are). They go in, do their time, come back out (or die), maybe get to keep their equipment, and others replace them.

Shibboleth
08-08-2008, 07:13
Re. Changing Chapters, there's also the Mentor Legion who, IIRC, contribute their elites to training up newly formed Chapters then leave for the next.

Hrw-Amen
08-08-2008, 10:22
Just a thought, would two marine chapters that were falling low on numbers for whatever reason join togehter in a similar fashion to IG regiments? Whilst it may not be that likely if they are from different founding legions it may work if they are both 2nd or 3rd foundings from the same original legion? What do you think? Or will they simply die out?

Critias
08-08-2008, 10:36
Just a thought, would two marine chapters that were falling low on numbers for whatever reason join togehter in a similar fashion to IG regiments? Whilst it may not be that likely if they are from different founding legions it may work if they are both 2nd or 3rd foundings from the same original legion? What do you think? Or will they simply die out?
I think most Marine Chapters would choose to die out, raging and shaking their fists the whole time, than to acknowledge that sort of crippling weakness and ask for help.

stainawarjar
08-08-2008, 10:44
Just a thought, would two marine chapters that were falling low on numbers for whatever reason join togehter in a similar fashion to IG regiments? Whilst it may not be that likely if they are from different founding legions it may work if they are both 2nd or 3rd foundings from the same original legion? What do you think? Or will they simply die out?

They'd... rebuild?

Lanparth
08-08-2008, 10:52
You know, to be honest? I'm not entirely against the idea of Eldar-human hybrids, I just think that the survive rate of such organisms would be non-existant. IF one survived, who would take it in? Really?

The mother, if Eldar, would forsake it surely for being tainted (as the only conception that could reasonably create such a being would be non-consensual), and would probably wish to remove said child from existence in rather quick order (Grim dark future).

Were the child born to a human woman, that just opens up a whole new bag of ass. Humans + Aliens = Somebody's not gonna live here. The mother would be killed, and the child along with her. If she escaped, who would take her in reasonably? Eldar? Not *******' likely. You take that freak-baby and go find a banana, damn crazy Mon-kei lady!

So who does that leave? Orks? Ha... HAHAHAH.

Tau? Maybe.

Necrons? ... *giggles again*

Tyranids? Well, I guess you could get refuge... if you count your biomatter.

Chaos? Complicated. Might live, might not. Depends if considered valuable to the Chaos Gods or to the two bit Lord/Legionaries in the area. Mother probably wouldn't survive. 99% chance of death overall.

Dark Eldar? Similar to Chaos. If usable, might live, if not? Souls to drink anyone? Mother almost guaranteed to die.

But overall, chances of her meeting anyone other than Imperials, very small.

For one of these creatures to have made it to maturity in any environment, even the more 'likely' ones, would be in the hundreds of millions. There would literally only be a handful alive in any capacity.

totgeboren
08-08-2008, 10:52
Just had to point out that according to current fluff, a human is closer genetically to a dolphin or a hamster than an Eldar (even closer to a octopus than an Eldar).
That is, its easier to make a human/hamster hybrid than a Human/Eldar hybrid. Considering what is says in Xenology, I dont think the greatest minds of the AdMec could produce a human/eldar halfbreed even.
The Eldar have DNA that is engineered from the bottom up, with a different structure to their DNA strands and all that.

And changing Chapter kinda happen, but only for renegades. Im sure the Word Bearers got some new recruits from Loyal Chapters, and I read in some Black Library book about a former Imperial Fist that had joined the Iron Warriors.
Also, the Red Corsairs all mostly made up of Marines from other Chapters.

LokkoRex
08-08-2008, 10:52
my chapter wouldn't, in fact my whole fluff is made on them being a coalition of destroyed chapters that work together(thats why i can paint them in different colours:))
it would be quite funny if a marine could be half-eldar half-human!

Adra
08-08-2008, 11:10
Just had to point out that according to current fluff, a human is closer genetically to a dolphin or a hamster than an Eldar (even closer to a octopus than an Eldar).
That is, its easier to make a human/hamster

Right so breed that human/hamster, put it in power armour, give it a gun, stick a GW logo on it and you have the next great army in 40k. Genius.

BLZBOB
08-08-2008, 12:27
Right so breed that human/hamster, put it in power armour, give it a gun, stick a GW logo on it and you have the next great army in 40k. Genius.

Now you just know you've opened the floodgates to the hello kitty style marine, a tough uncomprimising chapter that upon removal of their helmets are cute and fluffy.

Chapter advantages: Ferocious Bite & Food Reserves - Capable of biting and holding on no matter how hard they are flung and packing their cheeks with food allows them to fight for longer in enemy territory.

Chapter Disadvantages: Sidetracked - When confronted with a wheel they are compelled to run to it and run around in it.

Adra
08-08-2008, 12:43
Now you just know you've opened the floodgates to the hello kitty style marine, a tough uncomprimising chapter that upon removal of their helmets are cute and fluffy.

They also feel compeled to learn a valuable lesson every single battle...often about things like friendship and sharing. Truly the Emperors finest.


Back on topic. The idea of two chapters joining may seem unlikely but im sure it could happen. Maybe two low number chapters, close in space and have a long history, find themselves fighting together a great deal of the time. Both are from the same mother chapter and so they forge a union between the two doomed chapters. Obviously there would be alot of issues but im sure its not impossible. Although marines may see doom as better than admit defeat, some may see that as surrender to fate and duty come before anything else.

AdeptusOverton
08-08-2008, 13:30
Plus Marines dont breed in fact arent all those sexual tendencies bred out of them when the gene seed is implanted allowing for a perfectly psychologically conditioned soldier.

Also Eldar and Human gene strains are incompatible plus how the hell would they mate in the first place i heard that Eldar mate on all levels spiritually mentally and physically plus you dont really hear many accounts of Eldar young which leads me to believe that they are shielded from the universe

Rlyehable
08-08-2008, 16:27
Plus Marines dont breed in fact arent all those sexual tendencies bred out of them when the gene seed is implanted allowing for a perfectly psychologically conditioned soldier.
Slannishi <sp?> chaos marines?



Also Eldar and Human gene strains are incompatible plus how the hell would they mate in the first place i heard that Eldar mate on all levels spiritually mentally and physically...
Dark Eldar anyone?

Off-topic: Dark Eldar strike me as having the same mind-set of the Eldar before the Fall. Same fixation on pleasure/pain. They just found a way to delay being eaten by throwing food in front of the tiger stalking them.