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Socialist
13-08-2008, 22:33
TROOP: 1208
25 Clanrats- musician, standard, Ratling gun- 210
25 Clanrats- musician, standard, ratling gun- 210
25 Clanrats- musician, standard- 150
25 Clanrats- musician, standard, Warpfire thrower- 225
25 Storm vermin- command- 215
5 Night runners- 30
5 Night runners- 30
3 Poisoned wind globadiers- 30
3 Poisoned wind globadiers- 30
3 Poisoned wind globadiers- 30
22 Clanrat slaves- 44
22 Clanrat slaves- 44

SPECIAL: 285
5 Gutter Runners- tunnellers, poison- 85
5 Jezzails- 100
5 Jezzails- 100

RARE: 100
Warp-lightning cannon- 100

HEROS: 407
Warlord- weeping blade, warpstone armor, bands of power, shield- 153
Chieftain- heavy armor, BSB- 74
Warlock-engineer- warp-blades, warp-energy condenser, warp-power accumulator, Storm daemon, dispel scroll- 135

TOTAL: 2000
Models: 207


Ok, revised it. It got allot more shooty.

bork da basher
13-08-2008, 23:02
hi first of all i'll start with your charecter choices. your warlord has been woefully missequiped here. there is no point in spending 40pts on a desolate blade, a great weapon will give you +2S for 36pts last. yes you strike last but oh well. it makes even less sense to then equip the bands of power as it only boosts your base strength so it'll be 8 at the highest. my advice is take a weeping blade and the bands of power for S8 D3 wounds. warpstone armour n shield is fine just remember you dont get a bonus to your save with a magic weapon+shield.

BSB = good stuff no need to change this i run mine exactly the same way.

warlocks. right you need to give them the works, bar the pistol. either kit them out fully or leave them at home i say. a dispel scroll wouldnt go amiss considering the points level either.

clanrats n vermin all good size, 2 ratlings is perfectly fine. id even try to find room for a warpfire thrower in there aswell. 1 wound forces a panic test which can be golden.

skavenslaves should never be taken in units over 21. there purpose is to die in variously useful ways and any more than 21 is simply throwing points away, the unit is already fully ranked and no general is going to waste shots firing to reduce its numbers because its worthless, theres better targets and should it panic n flee it cant cause other units to panic. 20 naked or 21, either way a musician is often quite nice to have.

night runner unit, split them in half, 2 units are better and they wont cause panic tests. ditch the additional hand weapons its wasted on them.

again split the globadiers up. i'd suggest 3 units of 3 and leave one behind or if your intend on using 10, 5 units of 2. they will be largely ignored because no one will waste a units firepower on two rats when it could strip a rank or two off your clanrat units. your also spreading the unit out to maximise its usage and can deploy 5 tiny units on the tabe without revealing a thing to your enemy during deployment. sneaky.

again with the splitting, gutter runners are best in 5 strong units, always always make them tunnellers, dont bother with stars but poison is good.

3 jezzails is pointless, 5 bare minimum or dont take them at all.

rat ogres, personnally i dont like them at all, others love them, i leave this down to you. i believe there really overpointed and stupidity is a pain.

WLC, i love these and use two.

overall i think the list just needs tweaking to make it work, getting to know the best unit size for skaven is very important as they're such a low LD army anything that doesnt have ranks will run very easily and a unit bigger than 5 can panic and take other units with it. a crafty general will spot this and target them specifically especially since alot of those units are generally screening units like the night runners. with slaves it doesnt matter but everything else causes panic. fear terror and panic is what defeats the majoirty of skaven armies.

Makarion
13-08-2008, 23:07
Try and plot out some deployment on a piece of paper. You'll notice that a good part of your army will not be inside the warlord's command bubble. As a result, you'll see a lot of fleeing slaves.

Now, slaves are quite useful, but I'd use smaller units. Perhaps 2 units of 25 would do just nicely, at least for me.

My experience with Jezzails is that you want a nice block (say, half a dozen or more), or none at all. Try it out, though - see what works for you.

I've yet to have much luck with Rat Ogres, but maybe you will :).

As to war machines - I think that 2 ratling guns is perfectly fine, especially since you only have a single WLC and medium magic. Your list is quite polite - no worries.

Units of 10 skirmishers tend to be a little large, especially for the gutterrunners - it becomes hard to keep them out of line of sight during deployment. I tend to field about 6-7 of them, as a tunneling team. Sometimes 2 units, if I'm feeling frisky.

Socialist
13-08-2008, 23:59
I revised the list a bit. As for the large numbers for skrimishers, I'm mainly a lizardman player and use units of 10 scouts/skrimishers all the time. It's hard for me to wrap my head around 5 skrimishers with hand weapons doing anything useful. But I guess they do.

bork da basher
14-08-2008, 07:13
they are useful at larger numbers but lizardmen are not as wimpy as skaven are. a unit of 10 night runners will likely run if it takes 3 kills, its also quite likely to take something with it as they are almost always ahead of your battle line and will run right through units. even fully ranked units arnt going to pass all the time and if your outside of your warlords LD range its time to worry. if you take 5 or 6 they cannot cause panic.

gutter runners it works differantly, they are never really set up with the battle line so dont have to worry about panicing their own stuff but they are very expensive and they always seem to die in the process. i find small units far better and give them select targets. i use two 3 man units of tunnellers with poision and they do just fine. plus tunnelling isnt exactly safe and if you loose one small units its better than one big expensive one leaving you with nothing to counter any warmachines etc.

the list looks good now. im not sure of the point of the bands of power if your not going to equip the weeping blade. yes you'll wound most on 2+ but it'll proberly still turn and smack you in the face. trust me this is a nasty surprise for enemy charecters and when they learn to send a champion in instead the overkill bonus you get when you kill him will proberly win you the combat by itself.

my advice is drop the champions from the clanrats, your paying 10pts for an extra attack (5pts for an extra model??) it just isnt worth it. no skaven other than your warlord should except a challenge anyway and theres no shame in declining them its the ratty way. i'd proberly ditch a globadier and make 3 units of 3. this will give you 50pts spare and enough to buy the weeping blade with some change.

Socialist
14-08-2008, 17:17
All sounds good. Thanks for the help.

Socialist
14-08-2008, 21:08
Revised the list again (about 2-3 times) and I think this is what I'm going to build. What do you guys think?

TROOP: 1232
25 Clanrats- musician, standard, Ratling gun- 200
25 Clanrats- musician, standard, ratling gun- 200
25 Clanrats- musician, standard- 140
25 Clanrats- musician, standard, Warpfire thrower- 215
25 Clanrats- musician, standard, Warpfire thrower- 215
5 Night runners, 2 hand weapons- 40
5 Night runners, 2 hand weapons- 40
3 Poisoned wind globadiers- 30
3 Poisoned wind globadiers- 30
3 Poisoned wind globadiers- 30
23 Clanrat slaves- 46
23 Clanrat slaves- 46

SPECIAL: 325
5 Gutter Runners- tunnellers, poison- 85
6 Jezzails- 120
6 Jezzails- 120

RARE: 100
Warp-lightning cannon- 100

HEROS: 343
Warlord- weeping blade, warpstone armor, bands of power, shield- 153
Chieftain- BSB- 70
Warlock-engineer- warp-blades, warp-energy condenser, 2dispel scrolls- 120

TOTAL: 2000
Models: 211

Makarion
15-08-2008, 02:47
Light on magic - might as well take a bare scroll caddy if you plan on just 1 warlock. Otherwise, a boatload of shooting, decent leadership, and plenty of blocks.

Socialist
15-08-2008, 04:15
So drop the storm daemon for another dispel scroll?

Gokamok
15-08-2008, 11:15
So drop the storm daemon for another dispel scroll?

Either that or remove a unit of clanrats to get a second warlock, depending on how magic heavy your gaming environment is.

With the amount of shooting you have, I think you'd be better off getting another warlock, so you have the option of playing semi-gunline against armies such as VC without getting completely overwhelmed by their magic.

Socialist
15-08-2008, 18:11
Ok took out the Storm Daemon for another dispel scroll. It's still not that good in magical defense but I'm hesitant about taking out a unit of clanrats since I fight O&G most and it would be nice to out number them for once, and after shooting really overwhelm 'em.

gerrymander61
16-08-2008, 17:23
Consider single packs of giant rats. They're horribly underrated because for 30 points, you get a m6 unit that negates flanks and is extremely expendable because they dont often make your troops panic. The enemy has to either get very lucky and kill two to make it panic and panic others (extremely unlikely to only kill 2 because the rats have no save), or he can dedicate shooting at it to eliminate it completely, which is still in your favour because they're not shooting at anything else.

They've always outperformed globadiers to my experience.

Chrisorc
17-08-2008, 09:01
Just a small note.

I have found that 20 slaves with musician is better than 22 without so consider dropping two of them for the musician and they'l have a much bigger chance of rallying.