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devolutionary
07-11-2005, 07:07
This here is the second army list I'm building atm. This is to be built alongside my Nurgle Mortals, Ultramarines, Word Bearers, Tyranids, Orlocks, Van Saars, Skaven Mordheimers... the list goes on. Needless to say, this is one of the seconday projects.

Basically I like Strigoi and I like Ghosts. The rest is easy to figure out ;)

Strigoi Count - 290
Level 2 Wizard, Infinite Hatred, Iron Sinews

Necromancer - 145
Level 2 Wizard, Cloak of Mist and Shadow (see? Ghosts!)

Strigoi Thrall - 125
Bat Form

Wraith - 90

30 Zombies - 185
Musician

30 Zombies - 185
Musician

30 Zombies - 185
Musician

15 Ghouls - 130
Ghast

3 Bat Swarms

6 Dire Woves - 60

5 Fell Bats - 100

[5]5 Fell Bats - 100[/b]

2 Spirit Host - 130

Banshee - 90


Total of 1994 points


Thoughts and commentary, as well as crticism, always welcome. I'm in it to have fun with a typically horror movie theme (ghouls and ghosts, wooooooo) so I'd like to keep that flavour a little bit.

TAU AIR CASTE
07-11-2005, 07:25
Yeah sounds like a fun list (ghosts and ghouls), only change I would suggest (as you want to keep with the theme) is to divide the ghoul unit into 2 as I find large units of skirmishers aren't very good (with the lack of rank bonus and inability to negate ranks) where as 2 smaller units will be more then twice as good. hope this helps :)

devolutionary
07-11-2005, 07:27
You raise a good point that I did not think of *nods* two units of 7 Ghouls inc Ghast would be a touch more effective, it gives me a couple of light harrying units for cheap. I play too much 40k to be correct first time, every time it seems ;)

TAU AIR CASTE
07-11-2005, 08:01
also can't see the use of the musicians in the zombies if you drop these it will give you 15pts plus the 6pts you already have, then you can buy another fell bat and again if you like you could dive them into 2 units great for cannon hunting :D

Scythe
07-11-2005, 10:49
I wouldn't drop the musicians. When you do, you'll definitely draw a combat against an opponent who also lacks a musician, and don't break the enemy because of it...

TheDrugLordX
07-11-2005, 11:57
Agree with the above suggestions, though, keep the musicians.

Also, why no standards on the zombie units? These units are supposed to give your support units CR due to ranks & outnumbering. The +1 for a banner helps alot.

TAU AIR CASTE
07-11-2005, 12:06
Yeah I was wondering about the standards and thiught they should be there but then devolutionary would have to mess around with the list a bit so I tried to suggest stuff that wouldn't change the list.

fubukii
07-11-2005, 18:51
id suggest skels over zombies. its just a personal perference i guess though ^.^

Also for your count id try to get him either regeneration or +1 wound. I know you enjoy ghosts but to be 100% honest i have never seen a wraith do anything remotely good. Drop it for a necromancer, Counts tend to need more magic then other armies. Other then the above points i mentioned seems like a decent list

devolutionary
07-11-2005, 20:56
So I should realistically take a full zombie "command"? That makes sense I guess. If I drop the wraith I can pick up another Necromancer with nothing but a magic level, and three Zombie standards.

The Count is a worry for me with his rather low cost (for a count ;) ) but juggling points, I dunno, it looks tough. I really dont want my Ghosts to be reduced to a single Banshee after all, that would be silly. Are the Dire Wolves absolutely necessary/ Can they be dropped to allow a few extra points?

TheDrugLordX
07-11-2005, 21:16
Yeah I was wondering about the standards and thiught they should be there but then devolutionary would have to mess around with the list a bit so I tried to suggest stuff that wouldn't change the list.
I see no problem in dropping 2 Fell Bats, as he IMHO has far too many anyways (hey, they might be good vs warmachines, but they're kinda worthless vs other things other than marchblock). But the suggestions he came up with himself makes far better sense.

As for the count: He's OK to me. Though, there are some configurations that I think are even better. Like Iron Sinews + Curse of the Revenant + Summons Ghouls. This still makes him fearful in combat, though tvice as durable.

This unit of Ghouls works just as well for War Machine hunting as a unit of fellbats. So I would drop A unit of fellbats if you go with this configuration and boost the Spirit Hosts to 3 or something, maybe add in some spicy unit.

Tormentor of Slaanesh
07-11-2005, 21:44
yay, another strigoi!!!
I like the list but the ghoul suggestion is ace.
drop the wraith for a necromancer and have less bats and no bat form thrall, i had one but dropped it in favour of a wizard. either do the curse of the revenant combination or add massive monstrosity toyour existing count. to pay for all this, maybe drop a few support units.

Catpipe
08-11-2005, 00:57
Here are my suggestions

Drop the musos of the zombies and DO NOT give them standards once zombies start dieng they pop preety quik and thats another 100pts to your enemy.

The perfect number for Ghouls is NINE big enough to require 3 for a panic test.

Put cursed book on your wraith and stick him between your zombie units or join the unit to accept challenges against GWeapon weilding heroes.

Drop CoMaS off your mage and take 2 scrolls. The only thing CoMaS is good for is accpeting challenges and protecting the vampire and your Wraith can do that just fine.

I would drop some zombies to find points for either another spirit host base or another banshee

Hope this helps

TAU AIR CASTE
08-11-2005, 10:59
Thinking about it your thrall would be an exelent war machine hunter! turn 1 move forward inside a unit turn 2 charge a war machine (usually on a hill!) and then over run off the table to remain safe! then you would only need one unit of maybe 4 fell bats, Also Catpipe is spot on about the ghouls I personnaly always take 2 units of 9 but like I said before my suggestions we small amendments as not to change you list to much.

Scythe
08-11-2005, 12:35
I wouldn't drop the wolves as you suggested before. Wolves give you some needed tactical flexibility and can, unlike fell bats, cancel ranks.

TAU AIR CASTE
08-11-2005, 13:45
Yeah I really like wolfs! they're great fast units (not worth getting rid of them) and as Scythe pointed out they are great for flanking units (also great fast cav hunters str4 on the charge).

TheDrugLordX
08-11-2005, 15:26
Thinking about it your thrall would be an exelent war machine hunter! turn 1 move forward inside a unit turn 2 charge a war machine (usually on a hill!) and then over run off the table to remain safe! then you would only need one unit of maybe 4 fell bats, Also Catpipe is spot on about the ghouls I personnaly always take 2 units of 9 but like I said before my suggestions we small amendments as not to change you list to much.
And what if he flees with his warmachine crew?

That would make your hero very voulnerble to the rest of his army. Not that wise decision to me:wtf: Though, I dunno, perhaps some times sacrificing your hero in order to destroy a mortar or so could be worth it...


Drop the musos of the zombies and DO NOT give them standards once zombies start dieng they pop preety quik and thats another 100pts to your enemy.
With the standard it might never come to this. Besides, the extra CR can decide between a fleeing enemy or a destructive one. An they're only 10pts each...

If they get a low unit count, use magic to summon more and send reinforcements! that's after all what zombies are for. Take the charge and w8 for reinforcements to do the job, since zombies can't do **** by themselves. They provide good and cheap rank & file så why not maximize this effect?

TAU AIR CASTE
08-11-2005, 17:37
[QUOTE=TheDrugLordX]And what if he flees with his warmachine crew?

That would make your hero very voulnerble to the rest of his army. Not that wise decision to me:wtf: Though, I dunno, perhaps some times sacrificing your hero in order to destroy a mortar or so could be worth it...
QUOTE]


Well if they flee the vampire will still move 20" as he's a flyer and if he has moved 8" forward the turn prior and set up 12" on then that's 40" which should be more then enougth to get behind the enemy lines and be safe from incoming chargers! also most war machines are on hills so he will probaly end up behind a hill, But hey it's only a suggestion and it won't always work but it's a good idea all the same.

Scythe
09-11-2005, 08:33
Plus he'll probably be amongst mages and other war machines, who probably can't run fast enough to flee outside his 20" charge range next turn...

TAU AIR CASTE
09-11-2005, 09:46
Plus he'll probably be amongst mages and other war machines, who probably can't run fast enough to flee outside his 20" charge range next turn...

Yeah exactly!

TheDrugLordX
09-11-2005, 11:41
Concerning they nay dubble-pace their movement, I think they indeed will be able to hide behind some unit.

Besides, if he's got enough magic he'll blast your 2W t4 character to bits in seconds.

And nowadays, most armies out their have some kind of nasty surprise up his sleeve which should be able to destroy your thrall.

I don't like having crumbling characters running away on their own, but that's only my oppinion

Scythe
09-11-2005, 12:00
True, you'll always be at risk of magic missles, Salamanders, Ratling Guns, etc, but then it's only a Thrall. It's not like you're investing hundreds of points in them. If he survives, he'd cause some serious trouble to anything behind the enemy battle line.

TAU AIR CASTE
09-11-2005, 20:19
Yeah and if they waste a turn turning to face and shoot a thrall then they will most likely being charged in the rear THE FOLLOWING TURN!

Tormentor of Slaanesh
09-11-2005, 22:11
the tactic does work for a bit but its best to keep characters with units and let your flankers/magic sort out the war machines.
It's too risky.
back on the list, do you want the wraith, they're rubbish at killing things, expensive and only good against non-magic weapon weilding characters. i know this is a characterful army but is the wraith and cloak a good use of points?

devolutionary
09-11-2005, 22:31
Wraiths are ethereal terror causing characters. At 90 points, it's a more effective blocker than a unit of zombies. It will be more of a flanking unit though, along with the banshee. I want to break apart at least one flank, and I think ghosts will be useful for that. I do not want to have a spread battle line, hence why I put both of those ethereal characters in.

Tell me I'm doing something smart? Please? :p

fubukii
10-11-2005, 06:05
2 str 5 attacks for 90 points why not!!!!@#* >.< as you can tell i think wraiths are worthless >.< id rather have a spirit host over a wraith

edit: yea i dislike wraiths as i rarel see them earn their points. dont worry i wasnt bashing or anything its just my humor/sarcasm :)

devolutionary
10-11-2005, 06:51
So... I take that as a "Not a very smart thing, no" answer then?

OK, I've expanded the theme based on suggestions in to an entire damn haunted house. Ghouls, Ghosts, Bones, and Beasts. I've tried to keep it in theme, with each part of the force looking to be painted a bity differently. So, the "not so flying, but still a damn circus" Strigoi list number two :)


Freak Show

Count
Level 2 Wizard, Infinite Hatred, Iron Sinews, Massive Monstrosity

9 Ghouls
Ghast

9 Ghouls
Ghast

20 Zombies
Musician

20 Zombies
Musician


Haunted House

Necromancer
Level 2 Wizard, Cloak of Mists and Shadows

2 Spirit Host

Banshee


The Witch Doctor

Wight Lord
Light Armour, Great Weapon

20 Skeletons
Musician

20 Skeletons
Musician


The Lion Tamer

Necromancer
Level 2 Wizard, Dispell Scroll, Barded Nightmare

3 Bat Swarms

6 Dire Wolves

6 Dire Wolves

4 Fell Bats

fubukii
10-11-2005, 07:51
a much better list overal. Seem rather good except for a few minor things.

For Starters i would suggest the Configuration of Iron sinews, Summon ghouls, and Regeneration on the lvl 2 count, as a 4+ regeneration on 3 wounds is better then a extra wound most of the time.

The ghouls look solid maybe break them into 3 units of 6 as opposed to 9 man units. this way you get more attacks in.

Im not a huge fan of zombies but i guess you cant agrue with cheap undead troops. While they may not be very effective they are good at holding units up until a flank charge can be postioned. Try to boost their Unit strength up if possible (either by magic or just add more) the skels choices are good as well, along with the wolves.

Lvl 2 necronmancer doesnt really need the cloak of mist and shadows. I would advise the book of arkan to be taken. A free vanhels dance a turn is a wonderful thing and makes that Combat winning flank/rear charge so much easier to pull off. maybe give him a dispel scroll if points permit as well.

Spirit hosts One of the best UD units in the game goodstuff banshee is pretty good as well

-wight lord? I dont see what purpose he has without a sword of kings he is just inferior to a thrall in every way. Give him a sword of kings and a gem of blood or take a thrall instead.

lower the amount of bat swarms to beef up zombie units and or get some items. i would also advise giivng a necromancer a black periapt and another scroll or the staff of damnation.

TAU AIR CASTE
10-11-2005, 08:11
I personnaly think that spirit host are rubbish! If it wasn't for the nature of the list I would strongly recoment against them! in my experience they just crumble in h2h but hey you might have more luck with them then I have.

Scythe
10-11-2005, 09:13
Spirits are great as flankers and move nicely trough that forest in the middle of the battelfield. They are also great knight blockers. Even if engaged at the front by a ranked unit (which you shouldn't let happen imho), they'll usually last a couple of turns before crumbeling.

Wraiths, on the other hand, like said, are rubbish.

TAU AIR CASTE
10-11-2005, 11:16
It's just there isn't a great deal of magic defence in the army so they would suffer to magic users! but you right they are good flankers. Also if you were going to take a wraith give it the flamming skull magic item thing (d3 str4 causes panic) you know the one. Also go with zombies not skelletons as skelletons will die just as quick, they hit no harder and thier iniative 2 is nothing to get excited about and zombies cost less which means more :D

devolutionary
10-11-2005, 11:24
I am not going to take cliche overused magic item combinations, and I am not going to pillage my theme to the point where it's Skeletons, Dire Wolves, a Count loaded up with Ghouls, and two scroll caddies. That is just wrong. I quite frankly refuse to follow the same army list as everyone else. The Cloak of Mist and Shadows is staying. I am not taking a scroll caddy in any form. The Wight is there to serve as a challenge taker for the Skeletons (great weapons with killing blow give him cheap versatility over immediate deadly threat). I have split the Ghouls in to groups as advised before. I have removed the Wraith for another Necromancer. I'm in it to have fun. If I win, then so be it.

General commentary on version two seems to be that it is stronger and fits the theme all the same. I'm happy with how it looks, and I'd be pushing to change it any more. Unfortunately if I don't like the thematics, I won't build it :)

Thanks for the assistance though folks! it is greatly appreciated.

Tormentor of Slaanesh
10-11-2005, 18:21
I personnaly think that spirit host are rubbish! If it wasn't for the nature of the list I would strongly recoment against them! in my experience they just crumble in h2h but hey you might have more luck with them then I have.

What game system have you been using? They rule!!!!!!
I like the new list though i do agree with the fact you don't need that wight lord, have a thrall. Keep that bloodline power combination, I use it, and get standards, they win you combats.
I think you'd be ok against most magic armies except 4 mage high elf armies but they suck against strigoi, i mashed one the other week.

TAU AIR CASTE
10-11-2005, 22:05
Well there is a way to completly nutralise undead ethereal creatures but I'm not going to give it away!

Tormentor of Slaanesh
10-11-2005, 22:09
skaven shooting?
you can't neutralise them except with mountains 13'' long.